Reptile & Amphibian Forums

From what i have been reading illinois says no life threatening reptiles. I dont consider a dwarf caiman any more dangerous than a croc monitor. You can have those here. I have a monitor so im not new to lizards. I was wondering if dwarf caimans are legal in illinois because alligators and crocs are not but i heard dwarf caimens were but im not sure. I have a kiddy pool measuring 8x5x2 would that work for a cage for a while if i make some kind of border around that? Also if they are legal where do i get one? i havent seen any on here for a long time. I probally wont get one for a few years anyways but i want to know if i can get one so i can start on research

Not sure about illinois but if crocs and gators are illegal I would assume that dwarf caimans would be do they are all in the crocadillian family. And let me tell you you think they are not dangerous then you got a lot of research to do. The can get up to 6 feet lond and most a mean as hell most of the time the smaller the crocadillian species the more agressive. And if they are legal and you still decide to get one then first do much more research and second they are for sale one here all the time.
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Tom
1.2.0 Leopard Gecko (dot, spot, leo)
0.0.1 California King Snake (booboo)
0.1.0 Sulcata Tortoise (tank)
0.0.2 Russian Tortoise (tito and lulu)
0.0.2 Red Ear Sliders (bernie and ernie)
0.0.3 Painted Turtles (larry, curly and moe)
1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (marshmellow)
0.0.1 Savannah Monitor (beef)
1.0.0 Peachfront Conure (kermit)
0.1.0 Australian Shepheard (layla)
2.1.0 Crazy Cats (babe, sabastian, tinkerbell)
0.1.0 Lion Head Rabbit (daisy)
0.1.0 Ferret (jordan)
0.2.0 Guinea Pigs (lilly and petunia)
0.0.1 White Tree Frog (dumpy jr.)
0.0.2 Fire Belly Newts (spork and blaze)
0.0.1 Fire Belly Toad (ferdinan)
0.0.1 Red Spotted Newt ( red)
0.0.2 Bull Frogs (goliath and tubby)
0.0.1 Rainbow Ameive (jack)
0.0.1 Spectacled caiman (wilbert)
0.0.3 Green Anoles
1.0.0 Bahama Anole
0.0.1 Long Tail Grass Lizard
Lots Of Fish

All crocodilians must be listed on an IDNR Threatened and Endangered Species Permit. For the record, a dwarf caiman is NOT a good pet croc - an adult dwarf is typically fairly aggressive, full of piss and vinegar, and with their very pronounced osteoderm, can shred your hands pretty well. From the sounds of the first post, it appears they may want to consider a different type of herp. Here in Illinois, we take in quite a few crocodilians as well as some other friends of mine with the Chicago Herp Society. We even have a nile croc on the loose in a river in the Chicago area. It's getting harder and harder to obtain the permit and probably for good reason.

>>Not sure about illinois but if crocs and gators are illegal I would assume that dwarf caimans would be do they are all in the crocadillian family. And let me tell you you think they are not dangerous then you got a lot of research to do. The can get up to 6 feet lond and most a mean as hell most of the time the smaller the crocadillian species the more agressive. And if they are legal and you still decide to get one then first do much more research and second they are for sale one here all the time.
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>>Tom
>>1.2.0 Leopard Gecko (dot, spot, leo)
>>0.0.1 California King Snake (booboo)
>>0.1.0 Sulcata Tortoise (tank)
>>0.0.2 Russian Tortoise (tito and lulu)
>>0.0.2 Red Ear Sliders (bernie and ernie)
>>0.0.3 Painted Turtles (larry, curly and moe)
>>1.0.0 Bearded Dragon (marshmellow)
>>0.0.1 Savannah Monitor (beef)
>>1.0.0 Peachfront Conure (kermit)
>>0.1.0 Australian Shepheard (layla)
>>2.1.0 Crazy Cats (babe, sabastian, tinkerbell)
>>0.1.0 Lion Head Rabbit (daisy)
>>0.1.0 Ferret (jordan)
>>0.2.0 Guinea Pigs (lilly and petunia)
>>0.0.1 White Tree Frog (dumpy jr.)
>>0.0.2 Fire Belly Newts (spork and blaze)
>>0.0.1 Fire Belly Toad (ferdinan)
>>0.0.1 Red Spotted Newt ( red)
>>0.0.2 Bull Frogs (goliath and tubby)
>>0.0.1 Rainbow Ameive (jack)
>>0.0.1 Spectacled caiman (wilbert)
>>0.0.3 Green Anoles
>>1.0.0 Bahama Anole
>>0.0.1 Long Tail Grass Lizard
>>Lots Of Fish
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Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

I would say that Nile is on borrowed time with winter approaching in that area. Poor fellow.
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CDieter
'Reason, observation, and experience; the holy trinity of science.'

Sure is...I know Bob from the CHS has tried a few times and I hope to get involved as well. Temps are now in the 50's and its not looking good unless he found a water discharge from a nuclear power plant.

>>I would say that Nile is on borrowed time with winter approaching in that area. Poor fellow.
>>-----
>>CDieter
>>'Reason, observation, and experience; the holy trinity of science.'
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Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

I have always considered a dwarf caiman on of the more difficult crocodilians to deal with from a hands on perspective. Athletic, quick, and really difficult to hold due to the osteoderms. They also have the croc strength.

Croc monitors are nice and can give a very dangerous bite but it's very light in comparison and nowwhere near as strong.

>>From what i have been reading illinois says no life threatening reptiles. I dont consider a dwarf caiman any more dangerous than a croc monitor. You can have those here. I have a monitor so im not new to lizards. I was wondering if dwarf caimans are legal in illinois because alligators and crocs are not but i heard dwarf caimens were but im not sure. I have a kiddy pool measuring 8x5x2 would that work for a cage for a while if i make some kind of border around that? Also if they are legal where do i get one? i havent seen any on here for a long time. I probally wont get one for a few years anyways but i want to know if i can get one so i can start on research
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CDieter
'Reason, observation, and experience; the holy trinity of science.'

First of all NO croc of any kind should be purchased as a pet. They are NOT for the novice keeper and neither are croc monitors for that matter. Buying potentionally dangerous wildlife of any kind without the know how to properly deal with them is a recipe for disaster as well as creating BAD P.R. which leads to more regulation. Please think and research what you intend to maintain or aquire as the industry is under attack as never before. THANKS....TC

ok for one i didnt say i was a beginner i handled many species of crocodilians over the years. Secondly i dont plan on holding it if i got one. I dont consider them life threatening because i doubt a dwarf caiman could kill you unless you let it. Yes i know their attitude and all that. I was just wanting to know if they were legal since i have seen it somewhere that they were but you couldnt get a species getting over 6 feet.
Reptiles i have/had or worked with:
Nile monitor | eyelash viper
American alligator | nile croc
savannah monitor | red tailed boa
blackthroat monitor | frilled dragon
mangrove monitor | austrelian water dragon
water monitor | desert and green iguana
copperhead | various python species
water moccasin | various snakes ( kings,corns,ect)
croc monitor | lace monitor
american crocadile | retics, burms and beginner lizards(beardies, geckos, ect)

Posted by: xxvipervenomxx at Mon Oct 6 20:36:42 2008 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]
From what i have been reading illinois says no life threatening reptiles. I dont consider a dwarf caiman any more dangerous than a croc monitor.

Sir, The law does not care what you think is dangerous. See your quote above. Laws are written to protect the average person. Many people do not believe 90 miles an hour is fast, but try speeding past an officer and see what happens.
To answer your question: Yes, the State of Illinois considers all crocodilians to be both endangered/threatened (Do to the look alike of the really endangered ones) and dangerous. (As in the dangerous animal act you quoted) So you will need a permit to possess one. The State requires a more important reason than just because you think they are cool. Get the permit first, than the animal. Not the other way around.
And yes, the Illinois Supreme Court has ruled that crocodilians are life threatening no matter what size, do to the fact that they can injure/kill people and they continue to grow. They are apex predators and look at us as food just like lions, etc. (By the way what will you do with it after it grows up and lives 60-70 years?) Yes, even dwarfs can get big enough to do serious damage to us. Listen to the other posters as they have a lot of first hand knowledge.
" "Secondly i dont plan on holding it if i got one. I dont consider them life threatening because i doubt a dwarf caiman could kill you unless you let it.""
You say you do not want to handle the animal. How will you get it in its cage. How will you clean it? Change its water? How will you treat its health? No matter what animal we have, there will always be human contact. Hopefully nothing requiring stitches.
On another matter, To get the animal, you will have to find a supplier willing to break the laws here in Illinois as it is illegal to sell Dangerous animals. (See agriculture welfare laws) If caught they will lose their right to do business in this state.
Any one shipping, transporting, or receiving an illegal animal into this state without the health and state permits will find themselves in a court room. Anyone dumping dangerous animals (The fate of more crocodilians than you think) will find themselves arrested and charged with multiple offences. Many crocodilians have been seized by the State and their owners fined. At last count I believe this year’s score as State of Illinois 18 and the private owners 0. Do you want to take that chance?
Please turn any unwanted reptiles into Animal Care and Control or the IDOC.
If given up, there are no fines or charges. They will take it as a found stray.
Good luck with all your reptiles.

I tried to get a permit and you can only get one for educational purposes or a zoo. I dont plan on handling it if i get it i change the water with a drainage pump on the side of the tank. Im not asking for people to say i couldnt handle one because i can. I am just making sure if i could legally get one. Some people said yes some said no. I probally wont live here long. I cant have venomous snakes here legally because of their screwed up laws made when some idiot gets a reptile and doesnt know whats going on with it. Your apparently not suppost to have a snake over 6 feet. oops. I got a burm a boa and soon a retic. I guess alot of pet shops around here are screwed selling all these. I guess ill have to get a couple of eyelash vipers now. And to get a permit would an educational purpose be issued if i wanted to study the animals and watch their breeding for the product of more cbb. The snakes are an educational purpose i bring them to school and thats fine because its for teaching

????really...????

Bob and the rest of the gang hit it on the head. Obviously, this person doesn't want to listen to good, solid advice. So this person is going to keep a crocodilian and never have to handle it? There will come a time when it will probably be necessary and if you don't now how, you shouldn't keep them. There have been enough solid replies about the fact that dwarf caimans being a poor choice for a pet.

>>????really...????
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Rob Carmichael, Curator
The Wildlife Discovery Center at Elawa Farm
Lake Forest, IL

well let us know if you ever get one