Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Ive heard that its illegal to import basins, but Ive seen on a few breeders pages that have a few WC. Im sure tons of emeralds are imported every year... do you think any basins are being smuggled into the US as well. I.e. snakes being captured in Brazil then smuggled to Suriname then shipped to US? Just wondering...

Not any longer.

you can never say never, maybe someone takes very few to suriname, its impossible to tell.

I am from Brazil, I keep and breed basins. The guy who used to take them to Suriname was caught, and this is why basins stopped being smuggled since 2002. From 2002 to 2008, there are a few new laws, much harder on animal smuggling, it is not a very smart option. It is considered as biopiracy rather than just taking a pet away.

But I heard someone here is sending babies (also other species) straight to USA. I never saw any of his basin babies (that are supposed to be good CBB and expensive), but I have seen seen the snakes he receives in return.

As for the WCs you see around. They are all from before 2002, probably.

Just as we speak, brazilian government is making a list of all animals that will be allowed to be sold as pets, both for selling here and exporting. There is a chance that Boa, Epicrates and Corallus will be there. Not garanteed.
Only CBB will be allowed to be sold, so even if exportations take place in a few months, do not expect U$150 ETBs.

Not any longer.

you can never say never, maybe someone takes very few to suriname, its impossible to tell.

I am from Brazil, I keep and breed basins. The guy who used to take them to Suriname was caught, and this is why basins stopped being smuggled since 2002. From 2002 to 2008, there are a few new laws, much harder on animal smuggling, it is not a very smart option. It is considered as biopiracy rather than just taking a pet away.

But I heard someone here is sending babies (also other species) straight to USA. I never saw any of his basin babies (that are supposed to be good CBB and expensive), but I have seen seen the snakes he receives in return.

As for the WCs you see around. They are all from before 2002, probably.

Just as we speak, brazilian government is making a list of all animals that will be allowed to be sold as pets, both for selling here and exporting. There is a chance that Boa, Epicrates and Corallus will be there. Not garanteed.
Only CBB will be allowed to be sold, so even if exportations take place in a few months, do not expect U$150 ETBs.

Thanks for the repsonds! I think I saw some of your animals on another site. I remember someone posting from Brazil that had an awesome collection that was WC and CB...I wouldnt doubt that someone is still exporting babies to the US still. I hope the Brazilian government does decide to export CB babies. I just hope the market doesnt get flooded like the GTP market!

Unfortunately there still are some that are smuggling them into Suriname and exporting them to the US. I know of a few shipments that came in within the last 2 years as I have seen some of the animals that arrived to the importer.
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....I would rather have a Bottle in front of me.....than a Frontal Lobotomy....

Rob Trenor
RK Reptiles
www.rkreptiles.com
www.rkreptiles.net
www.ballpythonmorphs.net

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Every WC basin currently in the pet trade originated as a smuggled animal. As you said snakes being captured in Brazil then smuggled in to Suriname then shipped to the US is exactly right. As far as I know it's been several years since the last basins were shipped to the US. For a while they were coming in regularly . This was common knowledge but often denied. Dealers and collectors tried to say things like the animals were being collected from some remote area of Suriname and stuff like that. Not true. From a legal standpoint there wasn't a lot that could be done or probably should have been done considering the over all circumstances . From an ethical standpoint I guess everybody can make their own argument.

Ernie Eison
Westwood Acres Reptile farms

Every WC basin currently in the pet trade originated as a smuggled animal. As you said snakes being captured in Brazil then smuggled in to Suriname then shipped to the US is exactly right. As far as I know it's been several years since the last basins were shipped to the US. For a while they were coming in regularly . This was common knowledge but often denied. Dealers and collectors tried to say things like the animals were being collected from some remote area of Suriname and stuff like that. Not true. From a legal standpoint there wasn't a lot that could be done or probably should have been done considering the over all circumstances . From an ethical standpoint I guess everybody can make their own argument.

Ernie Eison
Westwood Acres Reptile farms

This scenario reminds me of the movie BLOOD DIAMOND. The diamonds were being smuggled into another country that allowed importation but didnt even produce any diamonds. I guess it wouldnt hurt the hobby if there were more genetic diversity floating around. I bet there are tons of different extremes (pied, calico, super high white, super high black) out there that we'd never see will all of the destruction of the rain forest going on.

FWC has been tipped off also, and if they find one, it'll be confiscated. Even though they have no proof of origin, it's still considered a smuggled animal because no one has come up with any proof of populations in the Exporting countries. It's one of those things that they take the liberty of enforcing. Same reason why we can't import some captive bred animals from Europe. With that being said, many Basins have come in from Surinam in the mid 90's on up to the early 2000's.
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South Central Herpetological

IMO, it is just the same situation as the african and SE Asian animals. With the difference that many of these leave their original countries legally. Even Suriname WCs.

They are just animals that are collected from the wild, and this should not happen, especially when there are so many species with a stable population in captivity, such as Boa constrictor, Corallus caninus (both forms), Epicrates c. cenchria Corallus hortulanus, Python regius, Iguana iguana, Morelia viridis, chameleons... And so on..

There´s just no reason to keep collecting these species. CBBs are far more adaptable, and also far more beautiful. With basins for example, to end up with a WC just as nice as a U$3500 CBB you have to collect at least 20 or 30 snakes, and this makes a lot of impact, especially considering that 99% of them come from a very small area, the Marajó Island, in the state of Pará, the most devastated state in the Amazon Forest area.

I believe that cheap WC animals lead to poor captive life, especially in species where it might be cheaper to buy a new animal instead of taking the sick one to the vet.

I think any commonly bred animal shouldnt be taken from the wild. The only exception would be morphs... I know I sound like a hypocrite, but I love seeing new morphs =). But definitely... ball pythons, iguanas, emeralds and amazons, green trees, corns, and leopard geckos shouldnt be taken from the wild!

Yeah, morphs could be collected. The thing with morphs is that you have to buy 1000 normals to get a morph.

Off course it must be awesome to see a new shipment with hundreds of reptiles and select the best 10 or so. But for many species it is no longer necessary.