Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hey guys, so i've been doing a lot of research over the past year and i've tentatively decided that i'd like to get either a water monitor or an ionides monitor, however i have run across a problem.

Both of these animals get very large and need large enclosures. The options i've heard on this issue are pretty much either give them their own room or build a custom cage. I'd prefer to just give them a room, but from what i've read here the better option would be to build a custom cage for the sake of maintaining the proper temperature and humidity requirements.

The problem i have with this is not how to constructi it or where to put it or anything like that but, how do you get a cage large enough for a full grown monitor lizard through doorways in a house, and then out again when you move? I keep trying to think up some kind of crazy modular cage design that i could disassemble but it just gets more complicated the more i think about it. So basically what i'm asking is where do hobbyists who keep the guys keep their cages???

Mine are built to be disassembled are reassembled in several sections if I ever had to move them.

We basically built them in the room they were staying in
-----
1.0.0 YBS
1.3.0 RES
1.0.0 red belly cooter
1.0.0 Fire belly toad
0.0.1 Savannah Monitor
0.0.1 Blackthroat monitor
0.1.0 Leopard Gecko
cats, dog, ferret, rabbit, rats, mice and hamsters

I also have been searching long and hard for a good caging solution. I had a handyman over the other day to fix some things in my basement and spoke to him about having a dedicated room for my new croc monitor. He mentioned that the walls would end up absorbing the moisture over time and the house would start to stink.

I asked him what he would do and he said it would be a good idea to build out a room size enclosure in my garage. He said he would build out a room size enclosure with sliding doors and insulate it so that it stays warm during the cold winders. My thought is I would use one half of the garage to build my cage and the other for everything else.

This way, I would not have to worry about my house rotting and I could tear down the cage if I ever moved. Also, it would be easier to clean the cage and wash out their water area.

I will probably be having him build it within a couple of months and will let you know how it goes. I will send some pics too.

It might be a good idea to call a carpenter or handyman and see what they could do for you. Mine will build it at relatively small expense.

You can see the enclosure I just built, it is pretty big. I am moving out within a year (graduating, still live with parents as of now but built the cage anyways). There is no way I could disassemble the cage and put it back up anywhere else. I think to do that one would have to be a master of his craft. I think it's safe to say with an enclosure big enough to fit a croc or a water it's going to be 95% permanent, if it's built right.

However, anyone who patents the 'pop-up tent' version of a 10x10 solid enclosure would be a millionaire

I plan on letting my parents deal with the tear down of my new enclosure when I leave (ha ha) and building a new one wherever I will move to.

>>I plan on letting my parents deal with the tear down of my new enclosure when I leave (ha ha) and building a new one wherever I will move to.

Ha ha ha, very funny! I'm sure your parents will appreciate that about as much as your new landlord will appreciate having a huge cage with tons of dirt ruining his rental unit.

Ha ha that is true... It was a joke son, relax!

>>Ha ha that is true... It was a joke son, relax!

I moved out of my parents house many many years ago SON.

By the way, since it was a joke, what will become of your sav when you move from your mommy and daddy's house. Your not likely to find a rental property owner who is willing to allow you to accomodate a proper habitat for a large monitor.

This does not relate to my monitors behaviors or conditions.

However in answer to your question I will become a millionaire and have a 'monitor heaven' in my back yard by next year, if everything goes according to plan.

Heh, heh, of course, why didn't I think of that.

Not that any of this really relates to the topic of this thread, but it very directly relates to the future condition of your monitor. Let me guess, you are different than all of the other kids who think it's neat to get large species monitors while still living under their parents care. I do hope so, since an overwhelming majority of them drop their monitors like a bad habit when they get lives of their own and no longer have the parents to pay the bills and actually have to fend for themselves.

I would never get rid of them. They are like my children. Even if I have actual children I would feed my actual children to my lizard children, cause i like them better.

>>I would never get rid of them. They are like my children. Even if I have actual children I would feed my actual children to my lizard children, cause i like them better.

I'll admit, that's a little bit funny. But as a father of the cutest little girl, I assure you, nothing takes priority over my little girl. We would be eating Blackthroat for dinner if it came down any sort of choice.

I notice this many times, so many posters here are teenagers, and younger kids, or at most around 20 yrs old. These people assume this about the rest of us too easily.
I also own my house, and picked it just for features making Sobeks cage easier to assemble in the basement (the most consistant temps in the house).
Ive always been for restricting medium to large reptile ownership to adults at least 18 or older, their lives are more stable, and they have a bit of a clue of how to support themselves a bit, let alone support pets on their own. Kids dont know whats going to happen from 3 months to the next, or if they will be living in the same state in 3 months. They also require their parents to provide them food, a roof, heat, electricity, water, etc. So that tells me the pets are these kids parents pets in reality.

I would agree with that. I live with my parents still, I am 23 and will move out as soon as I graduate at the end of this year. I am not going to give a bio of my life or anything but I have had animals my entire life, my parents met working at the zoo when they were my age so yes they help me pay for things and my dad helps me build things because he likes to; not cause I am uneducated or poor, but because as long as i live at their house they pay for some things. Wherever I go my lizards will go though, and I will not move out until I am ready to do that and able to support that.

Growing up, sigh.

It seems like a long time ago, yet it seems like just yesterday.
After 21 you lose track of how old you are, lol.

Give the guy a break. How many of us started out with some sort of big lizard? My first exotic lizard was a savannah monitor. I bought him when I was 16. Just cause he lives with his parents doesnt make him an idiot. Chill out. Good luck man.

Thanks man

And maybe you will to when you look back in life at how your parents should take credit for your bosc monitor when you were 16, not you.
I have no problem with someone who lives at home with their parents with their monitors, not all of us were able to just step into a big house of our own at 18 years old, in fact it takes much time for the average person to begin to consider owning a home.
Its the age of minors, the lifestyle thats not under their control, the requirement for mom and dad to provide everything they and their pets need that makes me say that anything but small simple reptiles should not be kept by minors.
I do not need to chill. I chill any further I will be a block of ice.

You made a funny SHvar! Yes!

By the way, the only thing my parents did was allow me to have it in the house. I worked when I was 16 therefore I paid for everything. I bought the animal, cage, food, bedding etc. I took care of it. My parents did not care for reptiles that much. The condition that I was given that I had to pay for everything and take care of the animal myself, or I could not have it. They wanted to teach me responsibility I guess. So I give them credit for letting me have it. As far as anything else that concerned the reptiles I had. It was up to me. Grow up.

" I worked when I was 16 therefore I paid for everything. I bought the animal, cage, food, bedding etc. I took care of it."

Really, so you paid your part of the mortgage, or rent to them, you paid your usage of electricity, of water, heat, sewage, etc?
I dont need to grow, up, but you do.
The point is that a teenagers lifestyle is out of their control until they are responsible for themselves, as a minor you rely on your parents decisions and changes to your life. So why get a lizard that you can not take proper care of on your own, by this I mean thousands of dollars for a PROPER cage, proper substrate (hundreds to thousands of pounds of dirt), a freezer to keep the rodents in, the increase in electricity required for the cage and freezer for feeders, and what happens when you either go to college, move to an appartment that does not allow pets, or go off to the military?
If you are taking proper care of the monitor it would be alive when you are in your 30s and more. If you shortcut the lizards care it is unfair to it (would you starve your dog since you cant afford to feed it, or simply just not get the dog by using common sense?)
I already understand and know these things because I grew up a long time ago. My parents understood these things when I was growing up, they allowed pets that they knew I could handle on my own many reptiles, no tegus (back then I had never seen a varanid in a petstrore anywhere, actually it was after I was out of the army before I saw one for sale). Se my parents made me understand that if I could not handle the responsibility on my own, it was completely unfair to the pet, that was the important part, my parents liked animals of all kinds, to this day my mom loves to see Sobek when she visits the house.

Well that is just touching. (if it were true).
I am not going to sit here and argue over something this stupid. You have no idea about my childhood or what I paid for in my life. Frankly none of your buisness. If a teenager wants to have a monitor than so be it. Everyone has to start somewhere. It is none of your buisness what he has or does not have. He comes on here for help and questions along with thousands of others and there are children like you who pretend they know alot(but actually dont) and criticize him for having one. like I said before grow up.

Its been many years since I was a teenager, heck if I stayed in the military I would be able to retire in the next year, not a child in the slightest bit.
I have more years keeping monitors than some of these people have been alive. Not including the many years before keeping other reptiles.
When you are a minor your options in life revolve around your parents decisions and limitations. If someone wants to allow their kids to keep monitors, to live with the long term care decisions, the responsibility of having to provide for those creatures because their kids cannot possibly do so on their own, and possibly have to take over 100% care if the kids decide to go to college, etc, then so be it. They need to realize that they have to take over the animals care, if life takes that course because they allowed the child to have such a creature as a captive. If not then the child should never have one until such time that mommy and daddy are not needed to fix their childs mistakes.
Now you grow up, I did a long time ago.

You know, your right, lets start allowing teenagers to start keeping human children without their parents help, and allow them to keep them in a 10 gallon aquarium.
Its not fair to the animals, its not fair to the kid who doesnt know any better and doesnt know that they cannot properly care for them. Its people that allow this kind of abuse to occur, then many people outside of our wonderful hobby then want to pass laws preventing us from enjoying our hobby responsibly, as adults, all because some parents cannot use common sense.

"Give the guy a break. How many of us started out with some sort of big lizard? My first exotic lizard was a savannah monitor. I bought him when I was 16. Just cause he lives with his parents doesnt make him an idiot. Chill out. Good luck man"

And where are all those big lizards now? Dead? Bounced around from petshop to petshop leading miserable lives? Hmmmm....
Some believe these animals deserve better than that. Where is the sav you started out with when you were 16? Do you have any clue about how long the lifespan of a healthy monitor is?

That monitor(Harley) died almost a year ago. I am 30yrs old now. I bought him when he was almost 2ft long. So what that would make it about 13yrs that I owned him and he was a yr or less when I purchased him. So that would make him around 14 when he died. He is greatly missed. So who are u to lecture?

Your theories, you know untested and unproven ideas...
1."I bought him when he was almost 2ft long"
ok this is clearly understood, the lizard was almost 24 inches long.

2."he was a yr or less when I purchased him"
So, how do you know that the lizard was a year of less old? Do you know the breeder, do you know which litter it came from?
I can tell you that Frank Retes identified a male cape banded WT I was given, this lizard was one of hundreds he hatched in a period of so many years, he hatched it over 6 years beforehand. I can tell you that the breeders of 3 of the albigs Ive kept have given the ages, and some the date of birth many years ago. I can tell you that it wasnt hard to get the age of all but one of my captve bred monitors from the breeders. In fact FR identified a male storrs he hatched that I had years ago, from 5 years prior.
But anyone who assumes the age of a monitor, unless you know 100% that they have been captive bred and born is almost certain to be years off. In the wild monitors grow very slow, so wild caught monitors can be far older than anyone could assume. Heck, even CBB monitors can be alot older than you think by the time you get them. I know of several instances of CBB albigs that were hatchling sized or a bit more and were anywhere from 4-7 years old, this is a result of husbandry.
I had freshly imported albigs that were from 2 to 4ft long, this tells me that these lizards could have been running wild for around 3-10 years.

3 "So who are u to lecture"
Who are we to lecture, no, not lecturing, but trying to get an inexperienced, newer keeper who does not want to admit to it over pride to do what is best for their captive.

Do you know me? I dont think so. I wish we could keep liars and fakes of here but you are still here. You are one of those who think he/she is an expert and know it all. But in reality you are not. You have to try and contradict everyone on here who doesnt agree with you or whos opinion differs from yours. You dont have a clue about my monitor that I had. nor the age. I have looked at some of your pics. its funny no new ones. I bet all your monitors are dead. I have never once stated that I was an expert. keeping these animals is a lifetime learning experience. Anyone can say aniything on here like "I have hatched generations of monitors" Where is your proof. You also stated that "all books that are written on monitors are keepers who have never had them or had them and they died early" Its funny you say that becuase you have talked about so highly of Rob faust. Didnt he write a book on Nile monitors? I am sure he would appreciate that kind of comment. Like I said Before GROW UP!

Who am I to express my opinion?

To answer your question, I am someone just like everyonelse who has posted on this thread with an opinion on a forum where all should be allowed to express their opinions freely so long as they are nonthreatening and pertain to the topic of the forum.

Who are you to question how others should express themselves here?

I am of the opinion that large monitors don't belong in the hands of kids who can't even support themselves and have no clue about where they are headed in life. The reasons for this opinion are obvious and any adult who has kept any monitors for any length of time in proper conditions would agree, that is if they had even a shred of common sense.

Kind of like getting a parrot for your teen for a pet, something that lives a long life, and requires dedication to be in for it every step of the way.
I understand that sometimes a persons life takes a direction beyond their control, or that important decisions involving the direction of ones life cause pets to be rehomed, but they are adults taking care of their own pets.
Anyone with one shred of common sense wont allow their kids to get a large lizard for a captive, not just for the unpredictable lifestyle of a teenager, but for the kids safety. Many parents would view a lizard as a disposable pet, so that if needed the lizard is released into the wild, ditched, etc. The again look at the numbers of unwanted dogs and cats in this country, a part of them were some kids pets until their became old enough to move on with becoming an adult, not alot of them, but some.

For it to be the size you need, the only real option is to built it where you want it.

I built mine in sections in my garage (walls, floor, roof, door) and then assembled them inside my basement where they reside. They can be disassembled reasonably easily if I ever need to move them, but I don't really ever plan on moving so they're pretty much a permanent fixture in my basement.

As it sits currently, my large enclosure probably weighs over a thousand pounds.

Building a cage.
To do this the cage must be strong enough to hold the monitor securely, next contained enough to hold a proper environment, and the worst part strong enough to hold thousands of pounds of dirt and water, logs, etc.
The cage should be placed off of the floor with an insulating airspace between the floor and it (I use cinderblocks), otherwise the ground temperatures conduct through the cage, through the substrates, and the cage is far to cool for a monitor to be healthy.
Or you could spend hundreds or more in heating to heat the bottom of the cage with thermostats to try to prevent the problem.
I used as thick of plywood (not fiberboard, not compressed cardboard, not that stuff made from chips or pieces of wood), it is almost 1 inch thick, keep in mind, not cheap at all, a bit expensive. Next every piece is lined with overlapping pieces of FRP (fiber reinforced plastic), then as it is assembled it is sealed with GE silicone 2.
All doors must be in the sides, all vents must be in the sides, none in the tops (solid tops only). Plexiglas is not a good choice for tops, etc, and its very expensive.

.....anyone who has to think about ways to make cages disassemblable should not own a large species monitor. They are best left to those who own their own homes and who's lives are established. I can't even count the amount of posts I'v seen on various fora where the posters said they have to get rid of their monitor because they are moving or their landlord won't allow a huge cage full of tons of dirt in their house or apartment.

>>....."anyone who has to think about ways to make cages disassemblable should not own a large species monitor".

My enclosures are disassemblable only because they were built in sections, and can be disassembled the same way. However, I own my house, have no intentions of moving and honestly can't see any reason why I'd ever have to move or disassemble an enclosure.

I built mine to last forever and could probably contain a gorilla for a period of time without escape. It's damn near sound proof, internally water resistant, and would most likely still be standing if the house collapsed in on it. I didn't see it as an option to build it any less. It was expensive, but WELL worth it.

My enclosures are disassemblable only because they were built in sections, and can be disassembled the same way. However, I own my house, have no intentions of moving and honestly can't see any reason why I'd ever have to move or disassemble an enclosure.

Mine too. My husband builds everything in sections. I own my house, but twice have had tornados rip sections of the roof, so disaster rebuild plan is part of everything we do.
Our cages are framed with same framing materials the homes in this areas are built with.
Of course we dont have basements here to work with, or an attic
-----
1.0.0 YBS
1.3.0 RES
1.0.0 red belly cooter
1.0.0 Fire belly toad
0.0.1 Savannah Monitor
0.0.1 Blackthroat monitor
0.1.0 Leopard Gecko
cats, dog, ferret, rabbit, rats, mice and hamsters

Yeah, they can be disassembled, but if they are all sealed properly, they are not going to just come apart as easy as one might think. It's not just the actual enclosure that needs to be dealt with, but also the clearing of 3/2 ton of dirt, plus logs, rocks, etc.
-----
www.frogfreaks.com

Just because a person's life is established does not mean they will never need to move. Work may take them to a different city, they may decide to sell in order to purchase a larger home and increase their (and their monitor's) standard of living or any number of other legitimate reasons.

I have constructed solid enclosures for salvator and odatiads. All the cages were built with energy retention in mind. 2X3 framed, ply walls, energy efficient windows, frp lining. They are also able to be taken down with ease and set back up in minutes. Insulating the walls helps keep internal temps from fluctuating especially with cages in the basement.

Heres some pics...

Reptile room cages- the room fluctuates 78- 85F. These cages are solid ceiling, waterproof walls. I house Glauerti, Storri, Tristis and ackies in here. the room is insulated and draft proof.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3084/2908598494_d5900442ed_o.jpg

Salvator cage:

This cage is insulated. 8 x 4 x 5 with 18" of leaf/ sand mix, 45gallon pond, and a bay of flood lamps for basking. Could have gone larger but I would have had a harder time retaining and heating this up.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3145/2666416748_a4cc635f3a_o.jpg

I have constructed solid enclosures for salvator and odatiads. All the cages were built with energy retention in mind. 2X3 framed, ply walls, energy efficient windows, frp lining. They are also able to be taken down with ease and set back up in minutes. Insulating the walls helps keep internal temps from fluctuating especially with cages in the basement.

Heres some pics...

Reptile room cages- the room fluctuates 78- 85F. These cages are solid ceiling, waterproof walls. I house Glauerti, Storri, Tristis and ackies in here. the room is insulated and draft proof.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3084/2908598494_d5900442ed_o.jpg

Salvator cage:

This cage is insulated. 8 x 4 x 5 with 18" of leaf/ sand mix, 45gallon pond, and a bay of flood lamps for basking. Could have gone larger but I would have had a harder time retaining and heating this up.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3145/2666416748_a4cc635f3a_o.jpg

Alright, so i've pretty much got to build something permanent and replace it when i move or get real creative and figure out some way to design a cage that comes apart but still holds heat, humidity and most importantly a full grown, well muscled monitor... this will be interesting.

"...get real creative and figure out some way to design a cage that comes apart but still holds heat, humidity and most importantly a full grown, well muscled monitor... this will be interesting.

This can be done, and it's not as hard as it may seem at first. It does take a lot of planning & calculating, though.

This cage is 4ft wide X 6ft long.

The bottom section is FRP with fiberglassed joints, and it's on casters. It's just under 36 inches high, including casters, and will fit through a 34-inch doorway.

The top part is the same height, also fitting through doorways. The top & bottom sections bolt together and I use a pliable plastic trim piece siliconed into place to seal them once assembled.

The two center posts have been cut to allow for a face plate with sliding glass doors, the third & final piece of this 3-piece modular cage. (I'll try to update photos later, when I have time.)

There's not a single nail in this cage. Everything is glued, screwed or bolted. I can disassemble that cage within 1 hour, easily.

For larger monitors you could easily double the size of the two halves and make them to where they can be easily joined together & sealed. The planning stage is a killer, and most people don't make it past that stage because it can be so difficult. But as you can see here, the end results can be very rewarding.

Later!
HH
-----
Due to political correctness run amuck,
this ol' hillbilly is now referred to as an:
Appalachian American

www.natures-signature.com

Nice enclosure. I have a question though, how does something 36 inches go through a 34 inch door? Or did I misread?
-----
www.frogfreaks.com

"Nice enclosure. I have a question though, how does something 36 inches go through a 34 inch door? Or did I misread?"

I'm a hillbilly, and I've got a chainsaw. Ha! Ha!

Nah, I think you might've misread what I wrote: "It's just under 36 inches high, including casters, and will fit through a 34-inch doorway."

Thanks for the compliment!

Take care!
HH
-----
Due to political correctness run amuck,
this ol' hillbilly is now referred to as an:
Appalachian American

www.natures-signature.com