Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Ok, so im going to get 2 female leopard geckos and put them in a 20 gallon long, but what do I need. Ive heard females will lay eggs but will be unfertile, (so I need like and egg box where they can lay them, like damp soil)But I also heard I need a steady amount of calcium to lick and dust the crickets once a week? What else do I need? Basically a whole set up, I ve read the care sheets, tell me how this sounds:
20 gallon long(2 females)
reptile carpet
water/calcium dish
U.T.H.
heat lamp, what size for a 20 long?
hides, how many?
moist box
basking spot
Is that all, please help me out, whats good or bad, suggestions, Thank you, thomas!

"20 gallon long(2 females)
reptile carpet
water/calcium dish
U.T.H.
heat lamp, what size for a 20 long?
hides, how many?
moist box
basking spot
Is that all, please help me out, whats good or bad, suggestions, Thank you, thomas!"

-A twenty gallon long is ideal for two Leos.
-Lose the reptile carpet, their toes get caught and potentially removed. Switch to paper towels or news paper, although they aren't very appealing, they are safest.
-If you have a UTH running all day then you don't need any type of light or basking area.
-Shallow water dish provided daily and calcium dish is optional depending on how often you dust. I actually use Fluker's "Liquid Vitamin" which is the equivalent.
-There are many different opinions on how many hides to provide so I'll leave that to the rest of the responses.

-Patrick

ok, ill have the heat mat running 24/7, and im going to also get a thermostat!

also, what calcium should I use, what size heat mat and anything else you can think ouf!?

The heat mat should cover between 25 and 33% of the area of the floor, and be placed at one end to provide a temperature gradient. Calcium-wise, get a powder that's just calcium, not calcium D3. As far as number of hides goes, at least one on each end, but since you've got 2 geckos, 3-4 would probably be best; that way they don't have to choose between being crowded and being the temperature they want to be.

Also be prepared for the fact that even a pair of females has the potential to not get along. Because of this, you should probably at least have a 10 gallon on hand to move one of them to if they decide to fight.

Finally, with regard to the size of the tank, a 20 gallon is adequate for a pair, but I have a single gecko living in a tank that size. Yes, she's spoiled, but more space is never a bad thing - if you can put the pair in a 30, it'll both give them more space to explore and more options for avoiding each other if they want to. Really, as long as there are enough hides in the tank, there's no such thing as too big, apart from too big for you to be happy about cleaning.

One final word, and be aware that I don't mean to be preachy. It sounds like this pair are going to be your first leopard geckos. They're pretty easy to take care of, but if they're your first, why not start with one to see how you like it rather than going straight to having a pair to worry about? You can always get a second (third, fourth, etc) later.
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear

well I already have a blizzard male so I know about leopard geckos, and I really need a 30 long for 2, that seems like that would be good for 5or 6, but thanks anyways!

>>well I already have a blizzard male so I know about leopard geckos, and I really need a 30 long for 2, that seems like that would be good for 5or 6, but thanks anyways!

I didn't say it was needed. I said more space is better, and that the geckos would appreciate it. 20 is "enough," but I personally like to give mine as much space as I reasonably can.
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear

Also make sure you have a digital thermometer to measure the temps.

a 20long really isnt big enough for two adult leos. Some people may think so, in my experience, i disagree. I keep all my adults in 20 gallon longs, alone...there is barely enough room for their hides. You need twice as many hides for 2 geckos, im not sure how you would fit that in a 20long.

Where are you getting the leos from? And how old will they be? Another thing to consider - if you are going to put them together they should be adults already...housing hatchlings together is stressful on them and makes it harder for them to thrive and grow...only put two adult females together. If you buy them as adults that is fine - if you buy them as hatchlings or Juvis, you can house them separately until they are full grown then introduce them.

You can house multiple leos together but there are certain considerations to think about...i have included my "care sheet" on multiple leos...I typed this up after answers questions about multiple leos over and over again - saves my fingers! Please read all of the info below - im not trying to talk you out of it, i just want to make sure you make an educated decision and that you are prepared and do all the things you need to in order to make it work properly.

MULTIPLE LEOPARD GECKOS

1. Dominance Aggression/Stress: Many people make the mistake of assuming that aggression is displayed only through physical aggression, but this is incorrect. While its true that these are SOME of the ways that dominance/aggression can be shown there are other, subtler, and probably more dangerous (because they can be harder to notice) ways. When multiple Leo’s are housed together, even females, one of them will be more dominant than the other one, the more dominant one will usually take the best hiding spots and the most food. Getting less food and taking second best spots chronically will lead to one of the Leos becoming stress; chronic stress will lead to failure to grow and thrive and parasite infections. Even if the more dominant Leo doesn't "take" the most food, their presence will often lead to the less dominant one not eating us much. A good analogy is to imagine you are back in school, you are sitting down, about to eat your lunch and the class bully plops down right next to you to eat his lunch...you are probably going to lose your appetite. Right? Now what if that happened every day?

2. Physical Aggression: Not much needs to be said about this, physical aggression is when they actually fight. Chasing, biting, etc. Obviously this leads to drastic problems such as stress, infections and lost limbs. Sometimes Leo’s will appear ok with each other for months or even years and then one day they begin fighting. Any combination of sex can lead to fighting, even two females…especially if you have a female that was incubated at male temps – or a “hot” female, as they are referred to.

3. Positive Sex Identification: This is a problem that frequently gets over looked when people consider putting two Leos together. Leos cannot be sexed with the naked eye until they are close to a year of age. Educated guesses can be made, but there is no sure fire way to tell, without using special equipment. There are a few problems that can arise from this. If you get two baby Leos and house them together and they turn out to be a male and a female, they will figure this out before you do and they may mate, and possibly when they are too young. Mating when they are too young causes serious problems for the female, producing eggs takes a lot of nutrients and energy...energy that young Leos need to be using to grow. Young Leo’s that are bred are more likely to get sick or become egg bound or have other problems related to reproduction. If it turns out they are two males, the Leo’s will be able to tell before you do and you could come home one day to find they have been fighting. It’s possible that one may even kill the other.

4. Disease, spreading and identifying: Another issue when Leo’s are housed together is disease. First and most obvious, if one Leo gets sick, its housemate is more likely to get sick also and then you will have two Leos to treat, not just one. Also, say you come home one day to find a suspicious looking poo (smelly, runny, and nasty) or some vomit, there is no way to tell which Leo is having a problem, unless you can constantly observe them, precious time is wasted trying to figure out which Leo is ill. Or, how do you tell if they are both defecating? If one Leo was to become impacted (or has another issue causing constipation) you may not be able to tell until it’s too late. You will still be seeing fecals, but will be unable to tell which Leo they belong to. Also, one early symptom of disease is lack of appetite, when Leos are housed together it’s harder to tell who is eating how much. This is especially true if you keep a bowl of insects in the tank constantly, or often. You may set out the insects, walk off, come back later and find them all eaten...but who has eaten them? There is no real way to tell, you may not notice one Leo isn't eating until you see significant weight loss.

Its definitely possible to keep Leos together, many people do – and many with great success. The important thing is to identify the risks and take steps to reduce this risk as much as possible. It is also something that is easier to do if you have a certain degree of experience with Leos…with experience comes the ability to pick up on subtle cues in Leopard Gecko behavior, cues which may lead to early recognition of disease. If you do decide to keep multiple Leos together the set up should be as follows:

1. Tank Size: This is very important, a 30 or 40gallon tank should be used when housing multiple Leos, bigger tanks for more geckos, of course. The size is mostly relevant when it comes to having proper hides. You need to have three hides per lizard. For each Leo, there needs to be a warm hide, cool hide and humid hide. Even if all the hides are not frequently used, it’s important they have the choice – no Leo should ever have to choose between being near another Leo and be warm, or be cold.

2. Heat Pad Size: This really is an add-on to the above. You need to have a large enough heat pad to be able to fit three warm hides on it.

3. Feeding: Since it’s harder to monitor food intake with multiple Leos, you should take steps to make this easier. Instead of just throwing in crickets you can either take the Leos out one by one and feed in a separate tank, or feed insects one by one to each Leo.

4. Close monitoring: Always keep an eye out for signs of aggression, stress or weight loss. If any symptoms of disease are noticed in one Leo, that animal should be separated immediately to a quarantine cage. If any weight loss is noted, that animal should be more closely focused on, and potentially removed. Routine weight monitoring with a digital scale will help track any weight loss trends. Any serious aggression should be remedied by separating the lizards. Keep in mind that while some Leos may thrive in a multi-Leo habitat, others will not…so always be prepared to make adjustments if necessary.

5. Spare tanks: Make sure you always have spare tanks available in case a Leo falls ill, or aggression becomes an issue. You want to be able to split them up easily if needed.

6. Ratios: Always combine Leos in sensible ratios, and only house adults in multiple animal enclosures. Only keep one male Leo per any enclosure…one male can be housed with 2 or more females…however you must compensate breeding activity with increased food and supplementation. Multiple females can be housed together. No Leos should be housed together unless the are old enough to be positively sexed.
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1.1 Bearded Dragons
2.2 Leopard Geckos
1.0 Uromastyx (Mali)
1.1 Corn snakes
0.1 Mexican Black Kingsnake
1.0 Bairds Ratsnake
1.0 Rosy Boa
1.1 Green Anoles
1.1 House Geckos
0.0.2 Flying Geckos
0.0.1 Red Eye Tree Frog

I think im just going to buy another male an keep him in a 20 long, along with my blizzard, seprate 20 longs

Great idea.

In my experience leos thrive much better when housed alone anyway
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1.1 Bearded Dragons
2.2 Leopard Geckos
1.0 Uromastyx (Mali)
1.1 Corn snakes
0.1 Mexican Black Kingsnake
1.0 Bairds Ratsnake
1.0 Rosy Boa
1.1 Green Anoles
1.1 House Geckos
0.0.2 Flying Geckos
0.0.1 Red Eye Tree Frog

hey mimc85, what size exo terra tank would I need for 1 leopard gecko, like in demensions? would a 18x18x18 be ok?

>>hey mimc85, what size exo terra tank would I need for 1 leopard gecko, like in demensions? would a 18x18x18 be ok?

18x18x18 is roughly 25 gallons, but it's considerably more vertical space than a leo needs. A 20 gallon long aquarium, for example, is 30x12x12. It's a pretty similar amount of floor area though, so it ought to be ok. (18x18 floor is 2.25 square feet, 30x12 is 2.5 square feet.)
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear

A tank like you are describing would be better suited for an arboreal (climbing) gecko. Leopard geckos are ground dwellers...and all of their hides, water dish etc will be on the ground...you need to have plenty of ground space.

I keep all my adult Leos in 20gallon Long tanks which are approx 30inches long by 12inches wide...this size works perectly.
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1.1 Bearded Dragons
2.2 Leopard Geckos
1.0 Uromastyx (Mali)
1.1 Corn snakes
0.1 Mexican Black Kingsnake
1.0 Bairds Ratsnake
1.0 Rosy Boa
1.1 Green Anoles
1.1 House Geckos
0.0.2 Flying Geckos
0.0.1 Red Eye Tree Frog

As per my previous post, the floor area is very similar, differing by only 1/4 square foot, so fitting all the hides, etc, in the 18 inch cube exo-terra shouldn't be a problem. The big difference, really, is price. 20 gallon long aquariums/terrariums can be had pretty cheaply (I think I got mine for
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear

...cut off my reply because I tried to use a 'less than' symbol and the forum doesn't parse that properly.

As per my previous post, the floor area is very similar, differing by only 1/4 square foot, so fitting all the hides, etc, in the 18 inch cube exo-terra shouldn't be a problem. The big difference, really, is price. 20 gallon long aquariums/terrariums can be had pretty cheaply (I think I got mine for less than $30), whereas the exo-terra is considerably more expensive. The choice is pretty clear unless you're getting the exo-terra for free, because it doesn't provide any real-world benefit over a 20 long for a leo. That said, if for some reason you personally like the exo-terra much better, it should work for your needs.
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0.1 Albino Leopard Gecko - Tigger
0.1 Crested Gecko - Pooh-Bear