Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Why are they dropping so fast? a german shepherd 15 years ago cost about the same amount then as it does now, how can they drop so drasticly in one year?

Have you noticed the recession, thousands of layoffs, consumers squeezing their wallet more and more. Snakes are a luxury most people can't afford right now and breeders are unfortunately slashing market prices like crazy in an effort to get a piece of the big pie.

I've exported all my stuff overseas where they are worth much more

There are way more bp breeders then German shepperd breeders I'm sure..
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http://www.myspace.com/jasballpythons
http://www.reptileradio.net/reptileradio/index.php

That Question is asked a hundred times every year. And the answers are always the same....

German Sheppards have been around hundreds of years. You're comparing apples to oranges. Nope, apples to car tires.
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www.strictlyballs.ca

Im gonna catch hell for this but one word comes to mind GREED. If everyone quit trying to undercut everyone else for a quick buck and look at the bigger picture, "the future of the industry" wouldnt look at bleak as it does to alot of people. I know people are going to say its competion, and free enterprise blah blah blah but it boils down to plain old greed. If you cant afford to keep the animals you produce without cutting the next guys throat to make a sale then you probably shouldnt be in business after all. But thats what makes big business who can you screw to get on top......... BTW Im not one of the people that come on here and jump in on the threads about how bad the market is and Im glad to see that those type of threads have fallen off.
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Damian Macioce
www.strongholdreptiles.com

it always amuses me when people make comments like this. The entire western civilization (actually any and every country that uses some form of currency instead of barter system) runs on pretty much the same principal. To make a buck.
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PHLdyPayne

As I said in my post thats the way of business to cut each others throat
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Damian Macioce
www.strongholdreptiles.com

It is really about two words, "supply" and "demand". Basic economics says that price is a result of supply and demand. Since there are more people breeding ball morphs, and captive populations are growing exponentially, supply is rising fast. Think about it. You breed a pastel to a normal. She lays 6 eggs, half which theoreticaly should be pastels. You now have 4 pastels (3 hatchlings the sire). Four pastels bred to 4 normals, average 6 eggs each, thats 24 eggs, half pastels (in theory) now there are 16 pastels. And on and on. It really doesn't take long to get to 1,000 then 10,000. Next thing you know they are taking over the world.

Bill J.
Sick Boy Reptiles

If the Weinie tots would hold on to the Market Price things would smooth out,but when joe blow and his pals buy a handful of lessers,pastels,spiders and Pinstripes and see them selling for 300.00 to 800.00 they are the ones that go price lower. Because the Tots down the way just listed even lower, this will make People hold out and wait to buy..... I would think shepards are selling for less then they were years ago. Enjoy what You do.!!! stop worrying about prices!! Maybe everything will smooth when the Tots turn into Taters........ What can You do its not the old west anymore, Or I would have a Solution for the Market crashers..lol .. I'm Van and I approve of this of this message. J/K

Van
http://www.myspace.com/gregvanzweden

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Forever Trust in what we are,and nothing else Matters

People need to realize that we don't need to drop prices automatically every year........why not try them at the previous years prices? You just might be surprised what could happen!

Brandon

how the system works.

you have a clown you are selling for $2500

i also have a clown but i want to sell it faster so i drop the price to $2000

then mike/peter/paul also have clowns and want to sell them faster than both you and me and sell theirs for $1800

and it keeps going like that.

ball python morphs is all about money. it always was and will always be about the money.

i've seen spiders now going for $100 even less. i've seen some normals 3 times that. i've seen baby normals for $10, it's a crazy market.

Pitoon

.....and most hobbiest don't care about business models or marketing stratagies. I am a hobbiest breeder and I breed the animals I love so I can produce some really nice examples to keep myself and sell the surplus. That is essentially the heart of the reptile hobby, and it is the right of any keeper to breed how ever many of what ever they want and to sell their surplus offspring at what ever price. Anything less and this will not be the hobby I have loved for over twenty years.

I actually laugh at the "wannabe" mini business mogels that spend so much time at shows visibly networking and acting like their on the floor of the NYSE. Although that is not my idea of the hobby, more power to them, but I also have the right to be amused by it and choose a different path.

To play devils advocate for a minute, I have seen many under fed yearlings for sale at shows this year. The high dollar morphs or keepers are 2 to 3 times the size of the less "valuable" inventoried yearlings. How is that about the love for the animals? And it is some well know breeders tables that I have noticed this. I get not wanting to feed a bunch of surplus offspring, so drop the price to a level that you are not stuck with stuff that you don't want.

There is a lot of resentment towards ball pythons in the general herp hobby and it has less to do with people being turned off by BPs and a lot more to do with the greed that is associated with BP keepers. I feel this is unfair because most of us, like myself, keep them because we really like them regardless of the "market" conditions for a decent return on investment. Unfortunately, the minority of BP breeders obsessed with ROI have given this part of the hobby a very negative image.

There is nothing wrong with trying to make money off of a hobby that you love as long as you are willing and understand the risks involved. The thing with herps is that they are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them. You can hold onto your spiders all you want and try to get price A, but if the herp buying public only wants to pay price Z, then you will just end up keeping a lot of extra spiders that will end up turning into underfed yearlings that will end up selling at or close to price Z in the end. Yeah, that makes sense!

The "business" people will probabley get ticked off by my post, and that is cool with me, but I think most hobbiest get where I am coming from. Bottom line in my opinion the market crasher is a myth, and that people who drop prices are simply doing so to move their animals at a pace that is best for them. This is also a way of brining "back door" pricing to the public and allows everyone to see the real selling price.

I think that was very well said.
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Cheers!
• Chelsea Lynn Gardiner
(and Frank M. Wood)

i seriously cracks me up whenever i see another worn out rant about "irresponsible" breeders who commit the odious sin of advertising animals THEY OWN at prices the sanctified breeders disagree with! this is not the Soviet Union! lol!

how pathetic would Ford Motors be if they ranted at Toyota for advertising suv's and hybrids for far less than what Ford wanted to sell them for?

"Dear Toyota or other competitor,
Do you realize you are destroying the vehicle market! We at Ford developed the assembly line, windsheild wipers and a lot of other things newbies like you stand on the shoulders of today! We have spent 100 years building this company and re-investing billions, and we are not gonna let a relative new guy on the block destroy by offering higher quality at cheaper prices! We demand you stop advertising your cars at prices they might actually sell for, and start inflating them immediately! Can't you understand this? The sheep will not know the difference, and by artificially inflating the market in this way, we'll all be able to make occasional sales to clueless newbie consumers for far higher retail amounts than what they currently should be paying (at least based on whatever resale price these clueless morons will be able to get on down the road after we cave in and let the bubble burst heh, heh, heh wink, wink C'mon Toyota! Join the guild! Let's all get ours while the gettin's good!

Truly,
Ford"

The only thing for certain is change.
I'm sure the dinosaurs were pissed about climate change back in the jurrassic period, and look where it got them?

If Ford got pissed at Toyota and advertised and sold '09 Mustangs for 90% off for 6 months, would that destroy the price of convertible muscle cars forever? Does any American company have the balls, drive or determination to stop looking for government handouts and start being truly competitive anymore?

Some people say the bp market is totally bogus and based on a lotta fluff because of the unscrupulous lowball advertising antics of the unenlightened??
Here's a news flash: The ball python market is as real as it gets! A living, breathing, puffed up, cuttthroat, competitive, volatile, always-trying-to-get-an-edge-on-the-competition, FREE MARKET where all the laws of the jungle apply! kill or be killed! adapt and adjust or become extinct. my advice is: pass through the pathetic price police phase as fast as possible, and figure out a way to make money off thousands of $10 pieds

couldnt have said it better myself

They are just dropping to the prices they should be at. Anything more than 1K for a ball python is kinda funny too me. Thats just my opinion of course but to me the price is finally coming down to where a ball python should be priced at...I don't really care what color it is.

Of course, if you can get more than 1K for a snake jump all over it!

Jason