Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Greetings All,

I just got a applegate special pyro. I am trying to get him to eat. My first attempt was last 2 nights ago and i tried with the smallest pinkie i can find. I feel that is it still too big for him so i cut the head and then split that in half. The pyro took it immediately, but maybe due to size (or other reasons) he dropped it after a few seconds. Now he won't take anything. I even went and got a newborn anole, which i know for sure that it is small enough....yet he still seems uninterested. Any advice on proper size prey for neonate pyros? Are they too small to handle even the smallest mouse pinky?

tia,
Kenny

Heck no, hatchling pyros are troopers. They can eat pinks easily, larger than you would think. The snake in the picture can easily eat a pinky, and not just a small one.

Make sure the snake has access to a nice toasty humid tight area, then try feeding.

Lizard scenting is a good idea to try as well. I still think the temp and humidity range plays more of a role than lizard flavor, but no harm in providing all three.
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Mark

since it ate the cut up parts it may want to smell blood and brains

give it two pinks and if it doesn';t eat them, cut the head open to let the brains' smell out....

yes...they can eat pinks and bigger at that size....you'll see

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two digit morphs...who woulda thunk it.......

Thanks for the reply. the pyro just seem so tiny. I currrently have a hide, but its not humid. I will replace tonight with a smaller humid hide. I appreciate the help.

Hey again stranger,

first off, B R E A T H E . . . .

take it easy, that pyro you have is thick and good-sized and by no means a runt in any sense. I would first hope you would've asked all the basics of the provider of that pyro. That is the seller's/breeder's ultimate responsibility.

A simple plastic shoebox, a simple substrate such as aspen bedding, Care Fresh, or paper towels, a clean bowl of water, and a good secure shelter (tighter is very appropriate for pyros and zonata). Also, room temperature (or slightly above) is sufficient for these montane snakes to survive extremely well.

If that snake took a pinky part right off the bat, then it is likely eating pinks with no issues. Again, the person you got the animal from should have been instructing you accordingly. Nevertheless, something may not have been right in order for it to spit it out. I'd recommend slowing it down man, and just let the snake adjust. After several days, take a small piece of cardboard (i.e.: a cut-away from a cereal box), place it on top of the substrate near the opening of the shelter and place a small thawed pinky on it. If that does not work, throw up another post and we can all go from there. NO need to be overly concerned, but it IS a sign that you care about that pyro and in the end it's all good.
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Jerry Kruse

"Fall is my favorite season in Los Angeles, watching the birds change color and fall from the trees."
David Letterman

MPO...

.care fresh sucks........

.and my pyro and knobs like 82 degrees more than 75....I bought them to fill bottom of racks...cooler....they stop eating till I bump them up to 82 and more....sucks....

just my thoughts is all.....

IF snakes are raised and adjust to cooler temps they'll be ok....watch them...they'll tell you if it's too hot or cold....

(I had a burm loooong ago...on floor, no heat,like 65 to 70 degrees... 55Gal. tank,wood lid -and she did fine......and this was back in the paper and kitty litter days...)...it's all in the snake....

good luck
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two digit morphs...who woulda thunk it.......

Thanks again for the advice. I will monitor him closely to see what kind of temp he prefers. I have been "googling" a bit and i have seen sugestions for cooler temps as well as warmer. I guess you are right with each snake having their own preferences.

I am new to this forum and u must say You guys are great and very helpful. I really appreciate all the help that i am getting.

Regards,
Kenny

Hey Jerry,

The breeder advised that up to date, he has been "assist feeding" mouse tail to the pyro. He did say that it "should be able" to handle a whole pinky. That's why i wasn't sure.

Thanks for all the advice. I will take it easy as you suggested. The good thing is that he seems very inquisitive and come to me when i pull his tub out...i guess that's a good sign. He is currently in a 12qt tub rack, back heated, set to the 80-82f (on the warm side) and mid 70's on the cool. The bedding is aspen shavings. So far, he mostly hangs out towards the front of the tub (cool end).

As you can see, meeting you at the show had inspired me get into mountain kings ... i couldn't stop thinking about them...lol. I know that i have a lot to learn, i guess it good practice for me before i get the zonata(s) from you next year...lol

Thanks Again,
Kenny

Hey Kenny,

everyone in this forum for the most part are good people and have lots of experience. We speak from our own experiences, whether they be from the field or from the snake room, but nevertheless it's a good place to be in this forum most of the time. I'd like to think we'd want you, or anyone else for that matter, move forward in your husbandry endeavors and enjoy Lampropeltis ssp. as much a we do.

Having said that, it sounds like what you have provided for the pyro is most appropriate. I use aspen bedding myself and have also heard good things about Care Fresh from reliable friends, well, 'cept for jyohe......LOL.......again, we all have differing opinions and/or experiences given the number of combined years working with herps. Unfortunately, a number of substrate materials' prices have risen, so paper towels and newspaper are sometimes the way to go depending on one's individual budget.

My only concern is that this morph of pyro can sometimes go for quite a bit of coin.......a pyro that is only eating tails "assist-fed" SHOULD be (and this is MY opinion and personal practice) priced accordingly if it is not feeding voluntarily.

You observed SOME feeding response, so go with that as I'd suggested earlier. Let the lil buger settle in, and in a couple days place a small thawed pink on a piece of cardboard or even on the inside of a cleaned jar lid and see what happens. Keep us posted.

Can't wait for 2009 either......we'll talk again hopefully at the 11/30 White Plains show.

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Jerry Kruse

"Fall is my favorite season in Los Angeles, watching the birds change color and fall from the trees."
David Letterman

I used it a little.....it sucked....dry,fluffy,dusty shredded toilet paper...

I used it for egg laying boxes then to get rid of it...wetted it worked for that

I have a customer that uses it....for sand boas....

he sued it for hondurans...they all died....see.....

as for pyros....they live underground alot and I don't think they would like being totally dry like shredded toilet paper would make it.....mine are on aspen, they have moist hides for months in a year....

....my opinions.....you can feel the carefresh and see for yourself.....dusty...

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......this will only hurt alot..........

LOL......

Great analogy! How funny.

Unless the ambient humidity is reasonable, that stuff sucks the moisture right out of the poor animal living on it. I think it is great for rodents and such, but not for snakes except rosies and sandboas perhaps. Way dusty.
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Mark

I'm not really sure what is a fair price for this pyro. I know that when i saw him, i just HAVE to get him...lol.

I am pretty sure that i will be at the white plains show...unless somethings comes up. So far i am bringing 3 peeps with me. I just can't wait. I am looking forward to meeting with you again.

Regards,
Kenny

Don't forget to update us on that pyro, k? Take it slow and remember to place the first 1/3 of your tank into the fridge. Later bro.
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Jerry Kruse

"Fall is my favorite season in Los Angeles, watching the birds change color and fall from the trees."
David Letterman

Hey Jerry, i did think about the exploiting fridge...as i am actually trying to find a spot in my home that is cool enough to brumate a pair of adult southern hoggies. Too bad my family uses it to store food

As for the pyro, I have added a second, smaller hide and left a pinky overnight. The pyro seem interested, he snooped around for a while but did not take a bite. I will wait another few days before i make another attempt and post updates i as i keep trying. For some reason, i have not seen him use either hide. He buries himself under the aspen when not active. I won't be able to stop worrying until he take a meal on his own.

Regards,
Kenny

there are many technique to try, and this is just the beginning. I would not be housing that pyro in anything larger than a shoebox at most. If another pink does not work, try slicing the top of the head and exposing some of the brain material (it's the yellow-white fluid)and give it a smear around the head and face. But try a nice warm pink or even a small live pink next time. But don't worry too much.

Sometimes snakes will go off feed this time of year. All of my zonata have stopped feeding, some since the end of August believe it or not. Zonata and pyromelana are notorious for this. I look forward to meeting you again as well. Take care for now.
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Jerry Kruse

"Fall is my favorite season in Los Angeles, watching the birds change color and fall from the trees."
David Letterman