Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Okay I am new to the snake scene and I am about to attempt my first breeding season, haha wish me luck. Anyways I was wondering if its okay to cool multiple females off in the same tub, working with limited space here so I am trying to make the best of it. Also during the cooling off cycle is it okay for me to check on the females are should I leave the tubs closed? If its okay to open the tubs how often should I do so? Should I give them water during this time?

where i'm from we have a saying................

limited amount of space = limited amount of snakes!

Pitoon
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Oh wow where Im from we have a saying also, dont reply if your comment is of no help! Thanks alot though buddy -Matt

i agree hate when someone replies and is no help! even though im not helping you either! LOL. any way hope you find you help and lots of luck breeding. by the way someone posted the other day about just trying to breed snakes with out cooling them at all. that sounded really good he got some replies that people have breed snakes without any cooling! thought you would like to know that. well any ways good luck!

As far as I know, breeding without cooling is most successful in the Northern states where the days not only get shorter during the winter but the temperature also significantly drops. I could be wrong though.

The first clutch I ever produced was done without cooling, but I'm in Minnesota and the room I had my racks in at the time was drafty and the temperature was easily affected by outside temperatures and wind.

Now, my snakes are in a much better insulated room without windows and I have no choice but to cool them.

that makes sense. thanks for that info i do live in nj and the temps are down this week. its cold!! and my room is on the cool side around 60 degrees but my tubs are 90 degrees. i think im going to try without cooling and see what happens? thanks again.

Not sure what you mean by cooling them off in the same tub???? You cool them in the same tubs you house them in -- no you shouldn't house more than one ball per tub. Yeah you can look at them, feed, clean up after them, play with them, etc. as normal - you're just lowering their night temps it's not major surgery.

Good luck.
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Tosha
JET Pythons
Toshas Blog

First of all, its never a good idea to house multiple snakes together. As far as the cooling off... depending on the room temperature, you may not need to. Its pretty chilly in Iowa right now and if i were breeding, I don't think I'd bother lowering the snake rack temps any more. The room temperature alone is about 68*F. My snakes are still at 90*F.
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Pitoon is right why encourage someone to try to breed when they dont have the room to house the ones he has properly??? I dont get it I mean if he doesnt have the room to seperate for cooling (which is a question I dont get) what is he going to do when he has babies?? Or when the babies get older what then??? You have to think in the long term. And say what you will its a PUBLIC forum and people can voice their opinion.
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Damian Macioce
www.strongholdreptiles.com

exactly........before one breeds one has to make sure they can care for what ever comes.

i wrote what i wrote, which was straight forward, "no icing on the cake"

glad to see someone understood my reply.

Pitoon

Cooling off isn't something that's done in one day or for a short period of time. Its just dropping the overall temperatures a few degrees for the breeding months in all of your snakes' housing -- all adults, males and females. It doesn't involve removing them from their cages/bins or treating them differently. Just punch down the numbers on the Helix's or temp control system on your racks. I personally don't cool, but I live in an old house in New Jersey. Good luck!
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Cheers!
• Chelsea Lynn Gardiner
(and Frank M. Wood)

thank you for taking the time to explain that to me I have been into the turtle and tortoise seen for awhile and just lately made the step to snakes. I live in northeastern pa. So i probaly should be fine?

You should be fine not "cooling" them. (By that I mean not adjusting or changing anything with their environments.) However, if you heat the whole room instead of the racks or tanks, you will need to drop your temperatures.

Also if the room is well insulated you may want to drop the temps since they won't experience much of a flux in temperature due to the change in seasons.

If you are unsure about whether you need to cool them then the answer is: Yes, cool them. Some people only do a drop in temperatures during the night some people drop them round the clock. Either will work as long as it is not so cool that your snakes are at risk for infection and the change isn't so slight that they don't notice. Cooling is just that... not brumation, not hibernation (it's basically just to "get them in the mood".

Go ahead and offer them food during this time, but you may notice that they either will stop eating altogether or they will slow down considerably. Offering every other week is generally more than adequate for adults during the winter. Offer more often if they will take it, less if they are refusing.

Separate your males and females before offering food. It can stress them out and possibly be dangerous to feed two animals in the same tub.

Give your males (and females) a couple days rest at least between breedings. I usually give them 3-4 days together followed by 3-4 days separated (the second day of separation is usually when I offer food since they will have had a day to "settle back in" to their tub).

If your rack is dark enough and secure enough, you won't need hides. If the male and female don't seem to be interacting due to one or the other sitting outside of the hide - remove the hides. If the female does not normally have a hide, don't add one. Add the male to the female's enclosure not the other way around... a stressed male is easier to get to breed than a stressed female.

Keep some old sheds from both sexes. Keep them separated during storage. If they don't seem interested in each other, add a shed from either sex to the tub with the potential pair. Be sure that the sheds are from sexually mature animals.

If I pop out sperm plugs from a male I will place them in a female's tub that a different male is in. The idea of competition can drive a lot of breeding behavior... so the scent from another male's sperm plugs or old shed skin, or the scent from a sexually active and mature female can induce them to be a little more competitive.

This is just a long list of some of the tips and tricks I've picked up or tried over the years. All of them work to varying degrees depending on the individual animals. Remember to treat them like individuals - there are many tricks that will work with most of your animals, but there are not any tricks that will work with all of the animals. Each one will have their own preferences. It'll take time to figure out each snake's preferences and also to figure out when each of your females cycle. Some will consistently be ready in the early fall, some will need to be cooled for a longer duration... sometimes as late as late spring or early summer before they are ready.

Brandon. That was a very helpful post.. THANKS!!

That was an extremely informative post.
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Cheers!
• Chelsea Lynn Gardiner
(and Frank M. Wood)

wow you realy know what your talking about thank you so much for taking the time to explain in detail to me what cooling off is realy about. I appreciate it. Thanks - Matt

That's when the debate comes in. A lot of the "non-coolers" will tell you that snakes (especially in the North/NorthEast) have a strong enough internal clock and don't need a cooling off period, or they'll tell you that nature will happen if it's supposed to happen without artificial cooling times, blah blah blah. At the same time, a lot of the "coolers" will tell you how desperately important it is to get your snakes in the mood and get them to slow down eating for breeding, blah blah blah. But when I personally think, when it all comes down to it, it's all about preference.

In my experience, I don't cool -- mainly because I feel my snakes can tell the bitter winter of New Jersey is rolling in. Every year, my adult snakes always stop eating and than pick back up in the spring like clockwork (except for 2, but they'll eat a hamburger if you offer it to them).

However, I also live in a early twentieth century house that isn't that fantastically insulated; its just an old, hardwood-floored, skeleton-keyed-door house. And even though my temps are still the same in all my racks, the overall room temperature of the reptile room itself effects my snakes temperatures pretty efficiently.

Now if you live in a well-insulated, modern home with central heat, etc... well now you have something to consider. And when it comes down to it, it's all about your preference. I know many breeders that don't cool and make out well, and I know many breeders that do cool and make out equally as well.

It's all about your own strategy. I know this probably wasn't helpful -- you were asking someone to tell you whats best and I gave you to road to pick from.... and I also know a lot of people will disagree, but it is true. Some breeders cool and some breeders don't, and it all comes down to their opinions and their personal strategies and preference (and sometimes, their home and location). Good luck!
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Cheers!
• Chelsea Lynn Gardiner
(and Frank M. Wood)

yeh I agree everybody has opinions but what it comes down to what works, I am not expecting a great turn out for my first season so i will learn from my mistakes. My snakes have stopped eating about a week ago so I guess there is no need to cool them off, my males are producing sperm plugs, so I think Im good to go.
thanks -matt