Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I now have 3 adult northern copperheads, 4 baby northern copperheads, an adult broad banded copperhead, and an adult southern copperhead.
I probed the four nothern babies....all female
I probed the three northern adults..... all male
The southern i already knew is a male, and i havent probed the broad banded yet because it has a very pissy attitude right now.
I was hoping for at least a male and female northern :/
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0.1.0 albino burmese
1.0.0 normal burmese
1.0.0 redtail boa
1.0.0 albino corn
0.1.0 creamsicle corn
0.1.0 okeetee corn
1.0.0 black rat snake
1.1.0 leopard geckos
0.0.7 northern copperheads
1.0.0 southern copperhead
0.0.1 broadband copperhead
0.0.1 timber rattler
1.0.0 green iguana
0.0.1 veiled chameleon
2.1.0 ball pythons
0.0.1 mexican red knee tarantula
0.0.3 emperor scorpion
0.0.1 cobalt blue tarantula
0.0.1 orange baboon tarantula
and a bunch of breeder mice and rats

I dont think it sucks. As long as they are healthy. I know I may take some heat here. But when the females grow up you can breed the northern and southern together. I have seen some great looking intergrades. They can come out beautiful. I am by no means a fan of hybrids. However I think that now northern and southern copperheads are not viewed as seprate any more (Taxonomy speaking). Same goes for Timbers and canebrakes I think. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong. I have also wondered about what some timber x canbrake crosses could look like color wise. I have seen some high pink canebrakes, and some really nice yellow timbers as well as jet black. However I could see timbers and canebrakes being a problem because of the venom evolution in canebrakes as opposed to timbers etc.. I do not think it would be good if these animals made it into the wild. It is just food for thought, I honestly have no intentions on dooing this. I have seen some weird hybrids lately that look interesting , but I dont agree with, like Batwings. Sorry for the long post

http://www.chuckhurd.com/ take a gander at Chuck's site....there are some intergrades pictured in the photo section.

Chuck - any chances you could make some more of the pics larger/expandable? Great collection you got going there.
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1.3.0 Leopard Geckos
0.1.0 California Kingsnake
0.1.0 Copperhead
1.1.0 Eastern Box Tutles

Haha,
y'all must have been reading my mind. My male southern is a high pink animal.... very good looking animal.

Two of my adult northerns are dark grey in color, and the other adult northern has alot of orange in him.

I was actually hoping to be able to breed one of the northerns with my southern.

I havent probed my broad banded yet. If it does turn out to be a female, Has anyone ever attempted to cross a broad banded with either a northern or a southern copperhead? If so, does anyone have any pictures?
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0.1.0 albino burmese
1.0.0 normal burmese
1.0.0 redtail boa
1.0.0 albino corn
0.1.0 creamsicle corn
0.1.0 okeetee corn
1.0.0 black rat snake
1.1.0 leopard geckos
0.0.7 northern copperheads
1.0.0 southern copperhead
0.0.1 broadband copperhead
0.0.1 timber rattler
1.0.0 green iguana
0.0.1 veiled chameleon
2.1.0 ball pythons
0.0.1 mexican red knee tarantula
0.0.3 emperor scorpion
0.0.1 cobalt blue tarantula
0.0.1 orange baboon tarantula
and a bunch of breeder mice and rats

Go for it.

The reasoning behind the Canebrake removal has always been doubtful in my eyes, especially since only Western Timbers ( which have some differing traits in themselves are all that close). But then, I know the mood is towards lumping these days.
As for Coppers, I live in North/Central Texas & all the C. contortrix here are intergrades. SouthernxBroad-band. Very pretty snakes. But if you want purity I guess you try next year!

Matthew
Just a few random thoughts..

"lumping"..........I was under the impression everyone was trying to separate. I grew up learning 15 families of snakes and Crotalinae was still a subfamily 100%............I think we will see a lot of new families come out of Colubridae in the next 10-20 years.

The Director over at http://www.CNAH.org takes any biochemist's word 100% whenever anyone does DNA comparison......and I believe that's why the canebrake and the timber were found to be one species.

I do agree on the copperhead thing, though.........it's becoming increasingly rare to find a "pure" copperhead nowadays...or at least where I'm from.
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1.3.0 Leopard Geckos
0.1.0 California Kingsnake
0.1.0 Copperhead
1.1.0 Eastern Box Tutles

Yup not the best situation. It would have been nicer if it were the other war around as the males could breed at two years no problem. But look at it this way you have a nice group started and in a couple of years you can offer unrelated pairs.
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Dan S.
Crotalus & Company-- Captive Bred Reptiles
Venom-Center -- Venomous Community
Wisconsin Reptile Community
Hybrid Herps-- Hybrid Community

>>Yup not the best situation. It would have been nicer if it were the other war around as the males could breed at two years no problem. But look at it this way you have a nice group started and in a couple of years you can offer unrelated pairs.
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>>Dan S.
>> Crotalus & Company-- Captive Bred Reptiles
>>Venom-Center -- Venomous Community
>>Wisconsin Reptile Community
>> Hybrid Herps-- Hybrid Community

Yea that is true... i also need to find a nice female southern for my male
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0.1.0 albino burmese
1.0.0 normal burmese
1.0.0 redtail boa
1.0.0 albino corn
0.1.0 creamsicle corn
0.1.0 okeetee corn
1.0.0 black rat snake
1.1.0 leopard geckos
0.0.7 northern copperheads
1.0.0 southern copperhead
0.0.1 broadband copperhead
0.0.1 timber rattler
1.0.0 green iguana
0.0.1 veiled chameleon
2.1.0 ball pythons
0.0.1 mexican red knee tarantula
0.0.3 emperor scorpion
0.0.1 cobalt blue tarantula
0.0.1 orange baboon tarantula
and a bunch of breeder mice and rats