Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Hi All, I came to this forum for help thinking it would be the best place to ask, due to all the ball python imports each year. What does everyone use for deworming? Looking for the product with the best results. Also instructions on use. Please help. Thank you, Lee

I have used Flagyl and Panacure in the past. Both seemed to work great. I can not help with instructions as all my meds come from a vet. Hope it helps.
Jason

I know my vet prescribed Droncit for tapeworms and Panacure for Strongyloides. I'm not sure which nasties Flagyl is recommended for but those are the big three. I know he mentioned that the doses he was having me use where fairly low compared to what they used to use but per recent studies they appeared to be sufficient. At any rate, best to check with a vet for dosage and perhaps a fecal exam if you don't feel that shotgunning is the way to go.

Panacur is the best dewormer hands down... it will take care of all your nematode parasites, and has some effect on tapeworms. Panacur is the safest med you will ever come across, very large margin of safety here. The recommended dosage is 25-50mg/kg.

Flagyl is also a must, it takes care of most protozoan problems and will also kill gram negative bacteria in the GI tract. Dosing is somewhat controversial, most reptilians call for 25-50mg/kg, but some experts recommend a dose of 125mg/kg for boids.

"Understanding Reptile Parasites" by Roger J. Klingenberg D.V.M. is a great book that you should probably pick up. It's very easy to find online.

Good luck.
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-Ross Payan - www.LeosAnonymous.com

Leos Anonymous

Ball Pythons, Red Striped Leos, W.Hognose and Screaming AFT's

It's fortunate that I happen to live in the town where Dr. Klingenberg practices since I'm too lazy to re-read my copy of his book. I just went through a complete collection treatment due to my foolish assumption that a pet store girl that did very well was clean but hopefully by the time I need to treat for anything again there will be new meds and/or doses. I’m not at all sure I’m reading his notes right on the current recommendations and the strength of the medicine I got vs. how much they get per KG but if anyone is interested we can try to figure it out (I just gave each what he told me to give them in my situation). I THINK the doses may be less than what he recomended in that book 10 years ago.

The rest of us are lucky to find a vet that knows didly about reptiles, but you just take your animals straight to Klingenberg himself, lol. Must be nice.

It would be great if you asked him if he uses new dosages or treatment programs that are more effective, I would love to hear the latest info.

And just so you know... my post was intended for the original poster, I didn't mean to insult your intelligence or anything like that.

Take care.
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-Ross Payan - www.LeosAnonymous.com

Leos Anonymous

Ball Pythons, Red Striped Leos, W.Hognose and Screaming AFT's

No offence taken. I'm pretty intellectually lazy some times and try not to waste my time getting educated about anything I don't have to. I finally got around to learning how to pop hatchlings in the last year or two after 10 years of producing.

At any rate, for those more studious than me here is what Dr. K wrote on the spreadsheet I made up in preparation for treating my snakes. This was for my particular situation (i.e. no stool samples really called for Flagyl but he went ahead and prescribed one dose at my request since I was going through and treating everything anyway) and shouldn't be a substitute for direct veterinary assistance in your situation.

If I can read the writing correct it looks like:

"Panacur 100 mg/cc
giving ~ 25 mg/Kg

Flagyl 50 mg/cc
giving ~ 25 mg/Kg

Droncit giving .1 cc per Kg"

One of my snakes was an even 1,000 grams and her doses where 0.3 cc of the Panacure, 1.10 cc of the Flagyl, and 0.1 cc of the Droncit. I'm thinking the first line for each med above is the strength of the mix and the 2nd is how much of the actual medicine you want to give them but even then I can't see where he came up with the Flagyl dose. Maybe since I was only giving one dose of Flagyl and it's fairly safe he went with a high dose? The Panacure was given once a day for 3 days and then repeated in 10 days. The Droncit was given twice with two weeks in between. What fun that was, 9 doses times my entire adult collection (the babies are maintained separately)! I'll be much more careful from now on!

As some people have told you in their answer Flagyl and Panacur are basic products for deworming, both at 50mg/kg.
But there's a third kind of worms that are not killed by Flagyl or Panacur. To kill these ones use Telmin KH (mebendazole) from JANSSEN-CILAG lab. (box of 10 pills with 100mg active product/pill).
Posology is around 25mg/kg, which means that for a baby ball python weighting 100 grams you should give only a very little part of one pill. I'm using this third product on boids for many years without any problem and it works fine.
Try to get some...

Would the third kind of worm that Flagyl and Panacure don't get and that you use Telmin KH (mebendazole) for be tapeworms? That's what Dr. Klingenberg had me use Droncit for but it's rather expensive (but I presume, or at least hope, is rather good at killing them). How expensive is the Telmin and do you just stick the pill down their throat? I injected the Droncit and they swelled up pretty good for a few days around the injection site. Of course feeding needles (Flagyl and Panacure) aren’t much fun for snake or keeper ether. To bad misting with Ivomectin hasn’t worked out so well, that would be the easiest.

As I'm french (sorry! ) I don't know what you're calling tapeworms.
Telmin KH is killing some specific kinds of ascarids and tenias. Price of the 10 pills box is around $8, here in France. As balls are not too heavy snakes and deworming should not be done too often (once every 3 months?) one single box provides you what you need for quite a long time...

As often as possible I try to avoid "hard injections" with needles or force feeding.

I'm using Flagyl and Telmin under the pill form. I break the pills in little pieces, and calculate the appropriate size depending of the weight of the snake.
I use Panacur under the powder form and here also calculate the amount of powder needed.

With dead prey put the little pieces of pills in one hear of the prey before giving it to the snake. Funny way, indeed, but it works pretty fine without any stress for the snake, and obviously for the prey, as it's a dead one!

With live preys carefully open the mouth of the snake.
A tip for that? While holding him behind the head tickle the nose gently with a pen for a while and he will wide open his mouth himself. At that point put the pen between his jaws. Drop inside the mouth, just before the pen, the pieces of pills (make sure that they're not going inside the hole of the trachea!) and then move the pen before them. Push gently the pen to the back and pieces of pills are going at the begining of the throat without stressing too much the animal. Retire the pen, wait for a few minutes, feed with a little mouse, and all that (mice and pieces of pills) goes right into the stomach!

Regarding the powder wet half of the fur of the prey and give it like that to the snake. When the prey is half ingested drop the powder on the wet part of the fur. It stays on, like glued, and the snake is eating it without even notice the product.

I found a site that tells me that tapeworms are "parasitic flatworms forming the class Cestoda". It sounds like you are using the Telmin KH for something else.

Thanks for the interesting administration techniques! I'm pretty new to the stuff myself but I think most US keepers are using liquid Flagyl and Panacure via a feeding needle. With good dead rodent eating snakes it sounds like your method would be much less stressfull.

I know I've used Ivomectin as a poor on for cattle so I had hopes that it would do well as a spray on for snakes as that would also be relatively painless. However, when my vet wrote his book it sounds like he was rather disappointed with Ivomectin regardless of how it was administered. Checking when the book was published I wonder if that wasn't about the year that the Mob put the counterfeit Ivomectin out so I was wondering if anyone had tried it more recently and had better luck. It would sure be nice if you had something safe you could use to kill all the internal and external parasites with just a quick spray.

Are your snakes getting parasites from their feeders or why do you treat every 3 months? I'm HOPING that I cleaned my collection up with one round of treatments and that they will stay clean. I'm waiting a month or two more before starting follow up fecal exams to double check that the meds did their job. If captive bred feeders are a common source of parasites I'll be pretty upset about it.

As it appears that it's interresting a several people I send a message for everybody about deworming.
check it out.

P.