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My rat factory - looooong read

rainbowsrus Dec 17, 2008 02:34 PM

Am planning on posting this on my website so any thoughts, ideas, suggestions for change etc are most welcome......

I get asked how I breed my rodents from time to time so thought I'd document it for others to copy, modify, ignore or even laugh at.

I breed my rats in a method I call cycle breeding. The females are introduced to a male to get impregnated and are removed to give birth and raise up surviving (not fed off) babies. This way I can control my weekly production better and not have larger fluctuations in my weekly numbers.

Bedding - I currently am using Equine Fresh pelleted pine bedding. In the smaller tubs I also add in a handful of pine shavings for nest material.

Food - I'm in a local co-op, we order food directly from some local feed mill "Roger's rodent diet" I guess originally "Roger" set up the mill with a formula and we have picked it up somewhere along the way. Minimum order is 4 tons. That's 160 50# bags or four pallets of 40 bags each. Hence the co-op! None of us individually could afford/store/use that much at one time. So, when it's time to order, we all meet up at the delivery location and split up the load. More or less 40 bags each but we do work with one another to adjust who gets how many so nobody runs out or gets overstocked.

Water - pressure regulated constant supply. No bottles, no buckets to fill - grins!!!

Each of my breeder female rats has her own history tag that follows her around the "factory". I keep many color varieties so I can get multiple animals in a single cage and still be able to tell them apart. Colors I have are...
Black, Tan, Blue, Brown (each in solid and hooded)
White and Siamese
That's a total of 10 colors so you can see that helps identify individuals in a group.

The "factory" is housed in three racks, two 24 tub cat litter pan racks I bought used and one 8 slot large mortar tub rack I made for growing up larger feeder rats.


The left hand cat litter tub rack is my rat "breeding" and mouse rack.

The right hand cat litter tub rack is my rat "birthing and raising" rack.

The mortar tub rack is for growing up larger rats to feed the larger snakes.

None of the tubs are actually numbered but for this document.... The cat litter tubs start with "1" in the upper right corner and serpentine down to the lower right corner so, by level it's...

4, 3, 2, 1.
5, 6, 7, 8.
12, 11, 10, 9.
13. 14, 15, 16.
20, 19, 18, 17,
21, 22, 23 & 24

I know it seems odd but the "next" position in the rack is always one spot away and that's good with hoppers!!!

For the grow-out rack....

2, 1,
4, 3,
6, 5,
8, 7

The whole process hinges around cleaning day. But remember, by each cleaning day, I've fed off various sized feeders to my snake collection so many tubs are not full.

I start by cleaning the grow-out rack, one tub at a time. Starting with the largest rodents and working my way down moving individual rats up as necessary to keep tubs full to capacity.

Tub #1, my largest males. 16 each
Tub #2, next largest males 16 - 20 depending on size
Tub #4, third largest males 16 - 30 depending on size
Tub #6, fourth largest males 16 - 30 depending on size

Tub #3, future breeder females 16 - 20 depending on size
Tub #5, surplus females 16 - 30 depending on size

Tub #7, weaned and unsexed. Typically 30 - 40
Tub #8, weanlings with breeder moms - anywhere from 2 - 6 litters

(tubs 4 - 8 have extended, protected, water line holders so smaller rats can reach nipple without getting at water line)

When all is said and done tub # 8 is usually empty and I have those breeder females set aside to be bred again.

Next to clean is rack #2 - rat birthing and raising.

Starting at tub #1, the "oldest" babies, Typically 2 ˝ - 3 weeks old. I take those and any of the next tubs in sequence that are the same(ish) age, and move those to grow-out rack tub #8 along with enough breeder females to support them. Remember, all tubs are no longer full so some of those breeder females are not needed and again set aside for breeding again. I pick out a group of females that are different colors so I can tell them apart next week when they go to the breeding tubs.

Note: in the rat birthing and raising rack, once babies are born, two females along with 24ish babies are combined into one tub.

After removing the almost weanlings to the grow-out rack, that leaves empty spaces at the top. I clean and cycle the next in line babies up to the last available tub slot. Keeping two females and 24ish babies in each tub. My female rats are extremely good at fostering babies. Not just caring for their own. So each cleaning day, I'm breaking up groups and moving babies around so I get the two females and 24ish babies (the same age within a few days) in any given tub. Sometimes I end up with 12ish babies and one female in a tub. Once all the already born babies are done, now in 2/24ish qty per tub, there are usually some leftover females....

1) Preggo ones get a cleaned tub in the lower area of the rack.
2) Ones that gave birth and had all babies taken are grouped in tubs with others to be bred again.
3) Non-preggo ones either get bred again (only if I'm short on females or is a good reason they did not get pregnant) or surplused into a snakes belly.

By this time the rat birthing/raising rack is all clean and there is about half of it empty. Again, several females set aside in the lower area ready to be bred again.

Next is the rat breeding / mouse rack. The last 14 tub slots hold 13 tubs. Each with a breeder male and his current harem. The 14th slot is so I can move the rats to stay in the breeding rack to the adjacent empty slot.

Each breeding tub contains it's breeder male and up to three breeding females. On the front are the females record tags. The right hand tag has been there three weeks, the middle tag has been there two weeks and the left hand tag only one week.

So, depending on which way the breeding tubs are currently, I place a clean tub in either the first or last slot and move the adjacent tub male and the two least amount of time females to the clean tub. I also move their tags and at the same time move them one position to the right. The middle tag will now be the right hand tag and the left hand tag will now be in the middle of the tub leaving the left hand position open for a new female to be added.

The remaining female, matching the right hand card, is moved to a clean individual tub in the birthing rack along with her tag, placed on the left side so I know to check her for babies. Once born and recorded, the tag is moved to the right.

Now there is a new empty slot in the breeding rack, repeat process for each breeding tub.

Two or three times as I go, I will add in a new breeder female to each cleaned breeding tub. Watching colors so I don't get two of the same color females in the same tub. Of course if I don't want to "start" 13 litters, I don't add in 13 females. That is just about maximum production.

Last on the cleaning list is the 10 mouse tubs on top. Those are pull the tub, replace with a clean one and add back in the mice and babies. I only use them to produce mouse hoppers and even that, not enough

Phew, sounds complicated as I write it all down but really is just several steps repeated many times each week. I like the cycle process because I can closely control my production levels. Yes, some will crap out so I don't always get 13 litters. And not all litters are exactly 12 babies. Still, all in all I get a pretty consistent weekly volume of babies born and the "rat factory" is working for me!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Replies (17)

Bighurt Dec 18, 2008 06:29 AM

Thanks for the post Dave.

Although I think its a complicated way of describing a simple task. I like the idea of using different colored females to keep track of things.

One thing you left out is how many males you use and how often they are replaced.

I only have 10 tubs in my system but manage to produce 40 feeders a month. Average.

Tubs are only 7 gal so I consider it mildly successful. I rotate mine counterclockwise...LOL
-----
Jeremy Payne
JB Reptile
Specializing in Boa Morph's

1.0 Snow "Kahl"
0.2 Triple Het Moonglow "Kahl"
0.1 Orange Tail Hypo Het Leopard
1.1 Double Het "Sharp" Snow
1.0 Ghost
0.1 Possible Super Hypo
0.1 DH Ghost
1.1 "Kahl" Albino
1.0 Hypomelenistic
1.3 Pastel Hypo
0.1 Suriname/Columbian cross
0.1 Anerthrystic

rainbowsrus Dec 18, 2008 01:28 PM

Hey Jeremy, thanks and yeah was a long drawn out explanation but is intended as a "instruction manual" of sorts.

I see your point on how many males, was implied but not necessarily clear...

"Next is the rat breeding / mouse rack. The last 14 tub slots hold 13 tubs. Each with a breeder male and his current harem."

so, 13 breeder males and I try to get them rotated out once a year. Been slacking lately and need to rotate most of them out.

I estimate my system is producing around 500 - 600 feeders a month.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Bighurt Dec 18, 2008 06:04 PM

With a harem in each tub what is your cleaning cycle every 3 days?

Also what gal mixing tub do you use? What source?

Cheers
-----
Jeremy Payne
JB Reptile
Specializing in Boa Morph's

1.0 Snow "Kahl"
0.2 Triple Het Moonglow "Kahl"
0.1 Orange Tail Hypo Het Leopard
1.1 Double Het "Sharp" Snow
1.0 Ghost
0.1 Possible Super Hypo
0.1 DH Ghost
1.1 "Kahl" Albino
1.0 Hypomelenistic
1.3 Pastel Hypo
0.1 Suriname/Columbian cross
0.1 Anerthrystic

rainbowsrus Dec 18, 2008 09:32 PM

Still only once a week, the pelleted horse bedding works great!!! The Harem at max production is three females in with one male at any given time.

The "cat litter" tubs are 20 x 14 x 5 - came with the racks

The growout tubs are 35 x 14 x 8 (id) and I got the from Home depot but they were closing them out, I bought 24 and have so far used only 8. They are sold as mortar mixing tubs.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Bighurt Dec 19, 2008 07:42 AM

>>The growout tubs are 35 x 14 x 8 (id) and I got the from Home depot but they were closing them out, I bought 24 and have so far used only 8. They are sold as mortar mixing tubs.

Those are the Argee 14 gal mixing tubs no longer sold by HD. However you can buy them direct from the manufacture at a minimum of 200 units.

I decided not to...

I had a bunch but they chewed through them.

I just use their 7 gal units now, same as the cat box units you use. Although I again only have 10.

I hope to build a Rat shed this comming spring at which time I might expand production.

Last night I offed about 50 rats so my production has been increasing.

I find that males gfrow twice as fast as females so current rat production weans off females not kept for future replacement. While males are left to grow to supplement my large feeder requirement.

I don't know if you noticed anything similar, or choose feeders by sex.

I'm using Lab 5000 and pine shavings, hey they are feeders, most don't make it to respiratory problems.

Good Thread

Cheers
-----
Jeremy Payne
JB Reptile
Specializing in Boa Morph's

1.0 Snow "Kahl"
0.2 Triple Het Moonglow "Kahl"
0.1 Orange Tail Hypo Het Leopard
1.1 Double Het "Sharp" Snow
1.0 Ghost
0.1 Possible Super Hypo
0.1 DH Ghost
1.1 "Kahl" Albino
1.0 Hypomelenistic
1.3 Pastel Hypo
0.1 Suriname/Columbian cross
0.1 Anerthrystic

rainbowsrus Dec 19, 2008 11:04 AM

Hmmmm, I've been using the same set for quite some time, built the rack 2 years ago and have not had one single instance of chewing. Oh crap, now that I've said something

Yeah, I see the same thing with my males, that's why 1/2 of the growout rack is for growing up males, 1 tub for future breeder females, 1 tub for surplus females and two tubs for new arrivals. For any smaller feeders, I use up females first!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

luckydog Dec 19, 2008 04:31 PM

Well done Dave,
Lil more intense than what we want to put forth but possibly worth it.Time is always a valuable asset to all of us. Our time on rodents likes to be a minimum so no records or order is kept..We are now Rat less due to a non performing colony..
We use 1/2 x1/2 wire cages for grow out so feces drop to the floor.small feeders are generally female and growers males.
Thanks for the heads up on the mortar pans,will have to get to
HD for what they have left..
TNT Mead.

rainbowsrus Dec 19, 2008 05:03 PM

Thanks, it's actually not that hard, I spend a couple of hours once a week cleaning. Rearranging as I go, moving litters and individuals through the process. the post was more of a long winded, precise description of how I do it. The plus side of the females having tags is I know who is producing what and can see just by looking at the tag she's ready to retire BEFORE she craps out on me.

Only other time spent is a 5 - 15 minutes each on Friday - Saturday checking/marking babies born.

I've seen growout racks done in wire and pull out dropping trays - way cool and way easy!!! On my list of todo's.

Sorry on HD, they closed them out two years ago, good luck finding any. I heard Ace hardware has them but at a much higher price.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

SnakeyLakey Dec 18, 2008 08:24 PM

I thought that pine, and other softwood, shavings were bad for thei respiratory systems.

rainbowsrus Dec 18, 2008 09:39 PM

So it is said. While I don't dispute it, for many years I used pine shavings exclusively. I also know a local larger breeder and all his deliveries come in pine shavings. I think it's worse if that's all there is. The mix of pelleted product with a little shavings for nesting is working fine for me. My factory is pumping out 500 - 600 rats per month.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

ge Dec 20, 2008 07:02 AM

what kind of pellet bedding do you use. where do you get it . whats the cost. how does it hold up compared to shavings. i use shavings because of availibility , the consistancy sucks no two bags seem to be the same

rainbowsrus Dec 20, 2008 01:43 PM

I've tried two.....

Eagle Valley ABM - worked just fine but my local distributor stopped carrying it.

Equine Fresh - Also working just fine, I get it through Tractor Supply at around $6/ 40# bag. That per bag price is for a full pallet so if just buying bags would be a bit more.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

ge Dec 21, 2008 06:05 AM

i had looked at that the last time i was at tractor supply, the directions said to wet it for horses, so i thought it must be dusty, you've had no problems with it? the person there thought i was crazy when i told them what i wanted it for. i've been wanting to go to pellets for a while. how deep do you fill tubs. next time i go there i'll keep my mouth shut about what i'm useing it for

rainbowsrus Dec 22, 2008 10:42 AM

It can get dusty but have had no problems with it (other than thick dust outside the tubs)
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

ge Dec 23, 2008 03:56 AM

how deep do you put it how often do you need to change it

rainbowsrus Dec 23, 2008 03:26 PM

A thin layer, not much more than one layer deep. You have to play with it a little to figure out how much to use. It does EXPAND so be carefull, too much and rats plastered to screen?

I clean once a week.
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

ge Dec 24, 2008 03:55 AM

thanks i picked up some yesterday and will use on next cleaning day

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