Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Leonardo, my sweet juvenile MTS, started again to sleep during 4, 5 days/nights in a row, without eating, going to the bathroom, drinking water, etc...He behaved like he was hibernating!But MTSs dont hibernate, right?His behavior was making me worried because i was afraid he would lose weight.So i decided to wake him up and to give him vitamins.I did that 4 days ago.Since then he is waking up every night and eating a lot.I continue giving him vitamins.It seems that he slept so much due to a lack of vitamins.Is this possible? If it is how many times a week can i give him vitamins (Nutrical)?Thanks!

SOUTHERN FLORIDA CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (SFCRC)

Location LEE/1.

Flavia,

Sometimes Corucia's will fast-especially under low humidity conditions. The vitamin supplement could have been a coincidence or it may have triggered the right response. But if Leonardo's eating, he should get the vitamins he needs from the right foods. Be careful of too much or too often with the vitamins. You don't want to put him in a Hypervitamin state.

No, Being a tropical Scincidid, Corucia's do not hibernate. If it gets that cold near the equator, were all in big trouble!

Sincerely,
Brian
SFCRC

Low humidity? Where i live is 95% during the dry season!lol!
By the way for how many days/nights he can sleep without meaning he is sick?

Flavia, Your conclusion is a bit of a leap in logic. His becoming active is not necessarily a result of the vitamins that you gave him. It is more likely that his waking up was in spite of it rather than because of it. Vitamins should be given very very sparing if given at all. I would not supplement more than a couple times a month with any multivitamin even one made for reptiles (calcium supplementation is generally a different story, and should not be confused with general vitamin supplementation). You are better off under supplementing than over supplementing. A little goes a long way. You should also consider that PTS are generally nocturnal. You may want to try feeding him in the evening or night. If he is maintaining his weight, he is most likely just fine. As Brian said, PTS (as well as many other tropical Reptiles) will become somewhat more inactive during the dry season. Be careful not to come to conclusions too quickly, as it can sometimes led to disastrous results.

I know you live in a naturally warm and humid area, but has it been cooler recently? My PTS slow down when the temperature drops, before I get my supplemental heating in place. Not every one eats well every night, but I do usually see each individual lurking around the food or the water each night.
Be careful with the Nutrical (if this is the same Nutrical around in the states). The one I am familar with is a high potency vitamin/calorie paste used for dogs and cats recovering from illness, not what I would choose for a vegetarian reptile.
My favorite handfeeding supplement that can also be fed as a whole meal for short periods of time is Oxbow Critical Care. It was designed for handfeeding to chinchillas/rabbits but has been used very successfully with iguanas and torts. I have used it with Gertie with good results when she has bloated. Oxbow Hay Company has an internet site you can look the product up on. You may need to have your vet order it, can't remember if you can order it directly from the site like their other products (grass hay, timothy hay, pellets ect.)
Has your PTS ever had a fecal checked for parasites?
Cheers, Jess b

Good to hear from you anyway. Hope all is well.

James

I read, I reply- I forget to go back and actually make sure my post replies to the one I intended...
My current excuse is I am 'gravid', so I get to drop things and forget things with impunity.
Say hi to the BTSs.
Cheers, Jess b

Nothing better than a gravid female. I said hi to the BTS. Surprisingly, they have not replied. One did stick his tongue at me. Congradulations, and keep up the good work.

n/p
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Edward
Carpe diem

I have 2 kids but id like to have more!Yes, i understand you dropping and forgetting things! Lol!

SOUTHERN FLORIDA CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (SFCRC)

Location: LEE/1.

Congratulations Jess. That is wonderful news. We'll have to place bets whether you have a Singleton or Twins LOL.

Brian
SFCRC

.

Great thanks Brian. Both BTS are doing fine. The one rescued from a demo site will be released shortly (am keeping it long enough to show my Mum who is visiting from NZ soon.)

Unhappily, I have to report there have been quite a few BTS squashed on the road lately - I guess they are starting to come out of hibernation and seeking sun in the wrong places...

You have a very interesting background - invertebrate paleontology - wow. What were the skinks of long ago like?? I wouldn't imagine they've changed that much in a couple of million years - my husband says my BTS looks prehistoric!!

Take care.

Susan

I didnt know BTS hibernate! My BTSs dont hibernate!They are active all year long!

Hi Flavia
That must be 'cos you live in Malaysia where it doesn't get cold! Here in Sydney it gets cold enough in the winter (around 10C at night, and colder inland) that BTS in the wild DO hibernate (or is it brumate? Not sure of the difference, maybe someone can enlighten me.) I've heard that they don't necessarily go into a 'full-on' hibernation like some mammals, especially if its a mild winter. On a warmer winter's day they might come out of their winter hiding place to soak up some sun.

Hope your herp family is doing well.
Susan

SOUTHERN FLORIDA CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (SFCRC)

Location: LEE/1.

Hey Sue,

Hibernation is the more involved process of a slowing down of all body processes during the winter. In the Summer, the term is Estivation. This is usually involving a endothermic animal by deviating from the set body temperature and conditions. Brumation is a wintertime cooling term used primarily for Reptiles and Amphibians. It was erected by Mayhew in 1965.

Of Course, the ultimate is Cryptobiosis. This is practiced by Water Bears (A Tartigrade), Rotifers, and certain Nematodes. They become completely dehydrated in drought conditions. They can have absolutely zero metabolitic activity-thus they die to live. In some cases, they have been subjected to 150 C.(Several minutes) to -200 C. (For days) with complete survival. In one case, A Rotifer and a Tartigrade were subjected to a brief exposure near absolute zero- 0.008 K. They survived! They must dry slowly to achieve this state and as long as there molecular structure is not damaged, they can be revived. Cryptobiosis is truely a deathlike state and the subject can stay this way for years (Over a century has been recorded).

Sincerely,
Brian
SFCRC

Thanks for that Brian - I wasn't sure about the exact meaning of the two terms before.

Cryptobiosis sounds incredible ...but then it's always amazed me that in the IVF field human sperm (and ovum?) can be frozen for long periods and still be viable.

Re. the poor squashed blueys - its not so much the highways I've seen them on, but the suburban streets round where I live - it's a pity drivers can't take a little more care, as the speed limit is only 50k/h so they should have more of a chance of stopping than on a 100k/h highway. That being said, they can be difficult to see.

Susan

SOUTHERN FLORIDA CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (SFCRC)

Location: LEE/1.

Hi Susan,

Yes, Freezing Embryos and Sperm always amazed me too.

The poor Blueys! Blue tongues are such a nice animal and the best reptile for a child to hold. It would floor me to see them squashed.

Sincerely,
Brian
SFCRC

SOUTHERN FLORIDA CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (SFCRC)

Location: LEE/1.

Sorry for the typos. There/their Metabolitic/metabolic

n/p
-----
Edward
Carpe diem

SOUTHERN FLORIDA CORUCIA RESEARCH CENTER (SFCRC)

Location: LEE/1.

Hi Sue,

It's too bad a low wall or fence couldn't be erected along the highway to help those poor blues. I saw something recently about fencing put up along with service pass thrus to the other side to help Koalas and Wombats from becoming Road kill.

The Skinks of long ago were a little different. The big difference is some is size-they were bigger.

Keep up the good work watching over our BTS friends over there.

Sincerely,
Brian
SFCRC

Yes, i already de-wormed him twice and saturday i took him and his poop to my vet.I woke Leonardo up to go to the vet because he was sleeping.Well, the trip was made during the day so he had an excuse to be sleepy!lol!
The first thing my vet said when i introduced Leonardo (my MTS's name)to him was : " What is that??I never saw that in my whole life!".But he checked Leo's poop and said he doesnt have any worms.
Where i live the temp falls from 95F to 85F, thats all.We dont have a winter, only a very hot season and a less hot season.When it 's raining like today can fall until 81F.So i really dont believe that is the reason for Leonardo to sleep so much!Thanks anyway for your advices.Ill try to find the product you mention here!Thanks again!

I know that he is nocturnal and i feed him at night but when the next morning i see that he is still sleeping on the same place, the food bowl is still intact and the pothos plant leaves as well and there is no poop around i start to become worried!Mainly when such a situation lasts for 5 or 6 days in a row!