Reptile & Amphibian Forums

hi there,

next season i will be breeding a superpastel female to my pewter male,both are doing great and pounding rats..i know it could be an interesting clutch to hatch but since im rather bad in genetics im asking what would be the odd ratio?! i know i could get sterling pastels and silver streaks, is that right?

thanks in advance..

bye

25% pastels
25% super pastels
25% pewters
25% sterling pastels if your pewter is from a cinnamon and silver streaks if your pewter is from a black pastel.

If you get can get a pastel from that combo then why aren't you getting any cinnamons, not trying to criticize I am just trying to figure out how to work a punnet square with two double co-dom parents.

All of the offspring would be pastel from the super. Therefore anywhere the cinny gene landed would end up pewter.
-----
Primeval-Beauty
"Finding beauty where other's fear to tread"

yeah but a pastel is a pastel gene and a normal gene so how can you have that from a super pastel paired with a pewter so shouldn't that leave the possibility for a cinnamon which is a cinnamon gene and a normal gene because if not then you shouldn't be able to get a pastel.

Because you are using a super pastel there is no normal gene that is why you would get pastels and any place the cinny gene lands is going to be with the pastel so the percetages he gave you are correct...
-----
1.1 spider
0.2 pastel
0.1 pastel het ghost
1.0 mojave het ghost

I worked this out and you were correct odds should:

Sterling 1/4 25%
pewter 1/4 25%
super pastel 1/4 25%
pastel 1/8 12.5%
cinny 1/16 6.25%
normal 1/16 6.25%

You will have a 1/16 chance to hit a cinny and normal...
If I'm wrong some one please let me know
-----
1.1 spider
0.2 pastel
0.1 pastel het ghost
1.0 mojave het ghost

That is wrong. Will never have a normal from a SuperPastel pairing to anything. The first response is the correct answer.
-----
1.0 Pastel Ball
1.1 Het VPI Axanthic Balls
1.1 Het Albino Balls
0.1 Normal Balls
1.0 Albino Nelsons Milksnake
1.1 Room mates
2.2 Dogs
0.1 Cat

lol too tired and trying to do to many things at once. my apologies don't know what I was thinking. thanks for correcting me...
-----
1.1 spider
0.2 pastel
0.1 pastel het ghost
1.0 mojave het ghost

No reason to apologize. Being corrected should be celebrated as it furthers your knowledge/understanding.
-----
1.0 Pastel Ball
1.1 Het VPI Axanthic Balls
1.1 Het Albino Balls
0.1 Normal Balls
1.0 Albino Nelsons Milksnake
1.1 Room mates
2.2 Dogs
0.1 Cat

"Posted by: sparky5969 at Thu Jan 8 15:59:11 2009 [ Report Abuse ] [ Email Message ]

I worked this out and you were correct odds should:

Sterling 1/4 25%
pewter 1/4 25%
super pastel 1/4 25%
pastel 1/8 12.5%
cinny 1/16 6.25%
normal 1/16 6.25%

You will have a 1/16 chance to hit a cinny and normal...
If I'm wrong some one please let me know"

Thats what I got whenever I worked it out as well. I understand that you shouldn't have a normal if you have parents that are both double co-doms, but at the same time you can't have a pastel without a normal gene and if you can I want somebody to tell me how that is because a pastel is the visible het of a super pastel so it has to have a normal gene. For that reason I believe the above is correct.

Pastel and cinnamon/black pastel have been proven to be different locus. As far as we know so far, there are two versions of the pastel gene; normal for pastel and pastel. It looks like maybe for the separate cinnamon/black pastel gene we have the normal version of that gene, the cinnamon version, or the black pastel version.

Each parent only has two copies of each gene (one from each of its parents).

So both the super pastel's copies of the pastel gene are the pastel mutant version so that is the only version it can give to the baby. However, the super pastel has two normal copies of the separate cinnamon/black pastel gene so for that different gene locus it can only give the normal version.

The pewter has one pastel mutant and one normal for pastel copy of the pastel gene so each baby has a 50/50 chance which type of the pastel locus gene it will get from the pewter parent. The pewter also has one cinnamon (or black pastel) copy and one normal copy of that separate gene so in a completely separate roll of the dice each baby either gets cinnamon/black pastel or normal for cinnamon/black pastel at 50/50 odds.

So, when you combine the two the super pastel's contribution is boring, always pastel and normal for cinnamon/black pastel.

However, the pewter’s contribution is either:

1. normal for both pastel and cinnamon/black pastel (making a pastel with the super pastel's contribution)

2. pastel with normal for cinnamon/black pastel (making a super pastel with the super pastel's contribution).

3. cinnamon/black pastel with normal for pastel (making a pewter with the super pastel's contribution).

4. both cinnamon/black pastel and pastel (making a homozygous pastel with either cinnamon or black pastel, whatever those are called).

that makes a lot of sense is there any way anybody could could send me an e-mail (defiall@hotmail.com) of a spreadsheet of the punnet square for that. I'm really not trying to be difficult or hard headed but I've tried understanding it looking online and I can't get it to work out so any help would be greatly appreciated.

sorry I had to read over that last post a couple more times but I've finally got the square to work out and I know what I was doing wrong before. Thanks for the help and sorry for being "that guy".
PC ] pC ] Pc ] pc = pewter parent
p / pPC] ppC ] pPc ] ppc
p / pPC] ppC ] pPC ] ppc
pastel parent

pPC= pastel (25% chance)
ppC= super pastel (25% chance)
pPc= pewter (25% chance)
ppc= sterling/ silver streak (25% chance)

the ratios are right...now, when i first read the message i guess i was half asleep or something and i thought the question was the ratios from a pewter x silver streak...i tried to make out that combination and got REALLY messed up...any help here? what would be the ratios from a pewter x silver streak combination?
-----
Neutiquam erro. Hostes alienigeni me abduxerunt.

I worked it out and hope to god its right so maybe I have gained a little better understanding anyway I got. oh yeah this is assuming we are using cinnamons just to cut down on names/names.

pastel=12.5%
pewter=25%
super pastel=12.5%
sterling=25%
pastel super cinny=12.5%
super pastel super cinny=12.5%

----->PC ] Pc ] pC ] pc = pewter parent
pC ]PCpC ] PcpC ] pCpC ] pcpC
pc ]PCpc ] Pcpc ] pCpc ] pcpc
^sterling parents

PCpC=pastel
PcpC=pewter
pCpC=super pastel
pcpC=sterling
PCpc=pewter
Pcpc=pastel super cinny
pCpc=sterling
pcpc=super pastel super cinny

That is correct.

.....

thanks, that's what i thought, but my problem was if we consider Black and Cinnamon being two different morphs (therefore two different gene mutations) would that matter? would that affect the final outcome?
-----
Neutiquam erro. Hostes alienigeni me abduxerunt.

Black pastel and cinnamon are probably two different mutations of the same gene (alleles).