Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Pretty much what the subject says. I have a snake that I've poured a bunch of money into for vet bills, and two different antibiotic treatments have not cleared up his swollen head and it's just getting worse. He's losing weight, he seems miserable, and it looks like he'll have to be put down. Rather than paying the vet another $35 to put him down, I'm wondering how humane freezing the snake is?
From what I know they go to sleep quickly and then die after that, but I'd be worried about the water crystallizing in their blood and that being very painful before they die. Thanks in advance.

I don't think it is, people argue that it isn't even for more simplistic animals like fish. Just because you don't see it happening or the animal can't struggle or move doesn't mean it isn't painful. Here's an anapsid article discussing euthanasia that I think will help more than anything I can say - http://www.anapsid.org/euth.html
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Danne
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1.0 '07 BRB "Monroe"
1.0 '08 BRB 66% het Anery "Ace"
1.0 '08 Pastel BP "Sebastian"
1.1 Leos "Bowser & Peach"
0.2 Dumbo (non-feeder) rats "Josie & Holly"

Email = dshoback@eden.rutgers.edu

Well when people freeze to death they go into a coma before the water can do anything. I would pay the vet 35$ if I were you, but then again I'm the kind of person that won't slit eggs or do alot of the things people on here do. I guess it's up to you.
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Pastel 1.0
Spider 1.0
Normals 1.2
Het Pied 1.0
Leopard Geckos 1.1
American Bulldog 1.0

pay the 35.00 why take that chance.

Thats what I would do as well.
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Pastel 1.0
Spider 1.0
Normals 1.2
Het Pied 1.0
Leopard Geckos 1.1
American Bulldog 1.0

A euthanasia chamber is a box or bucket that you put in CO2. One of the reptile distributers here has one that I think was required by game and fish dept. That is their preferred method, rather than freezing. They said it doesn't work very well, and from my own experience gassing snakes does not work nearly as well as it does for mammals (rodents).

Dry Ice is CO2, it will gas rodents fine, I'm not sure how well it would work with a snake.

Yeah, but after the supplies you're pretty much at what it would cost to just bring the snake to the vet and have it put down.

Unless you're planning on other snakes needing to be put down, I'd just take it to the vet.
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"What is man without the beasts?
If all the beasts were gone,
men would die from great loneliness of spirit.
For what happens to the beasts,
soon happens to men.
All things are connected."

-Chief Seattle (Duwamish Tribe)

yeah but if you already have co2 to put your feeders to sleep them it would cost a thing.

i think co2 is more humane in my opinion

PItoon

humane?...not really...but once the door shuts you won't know a thing....?

.....small of a bag as possible....it should suffocate before freezing...the cold will make it slow down...but! it will also feel very badly on the skin....it will feel the cold....real cold...like outside today here.....5 degrees...

some people prefer the shovel?.....clever?......works faster

....all up to you....

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...JY

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If you want to be responsible for a pet, then be responsible for your pet. $35 is not expensive when it comes to the welfare of your animal. Freezing it will definitely kill it after a measurable amount of pain. Reptiles don’t process CO2 the way mammals do, sodium pentobarbital is the best for reptiles. If you have to do it yourself, the most humane is cervical dislocation or do your best to stop brain activity as quickly as possible.

Does anyone know what a reptile goes through when they hibernate ? Do you think that process is painful.I would think the snake would cool down and freeze withnout any pain.

Do you really think snakes hibernate at freezing temperatures? I hope you don’t brumate your snakes that low before breeding.

Only snow snakes !

Does anyone know what a reptile goes through when they hibernate?

For a brief description check out the Wikipedia definition http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dormancy. Many animals use the earth's thermal inertia to prevent them from experiencing freezing temperatures. Some species have evolved the capability to survive freezing temps including the Wood Frog (Rana sylvatica) and a few species of turtles.

Do you think that process is painful.

No, a natural brumation cycle is not a painful event although the risk of respiratory infection does exist (most folks who have field herped have found newly emerged snakes that have an RI). Freezing an animal causes ice crystals to form in the tissues causing pain.

I would think the snake would cool down and freeze withnout any pain.

And that is why euthanasia should be left to qualified individuals. I agree with an earlier post that laments the miserly attitude with regards to reptile health.

I have a difficult time understanding why people think that going from a balmy 85 degree environment directly into a sub 30 degree environment is the "same as hibernation".

In the wild any animal that hibernates has a chance to begin to adjust to the changing temperatures through the natural change in seasons. It doesn't happen at the flick of a switch. Their bodies receive information from the varying temperatures and day cycles that tells them to begin preparing to get cold. All sorts of biological processes are switched on (or off as the case may be) during this transition.

Yes, cooling a reptile down will also slow them down and eventually cause them to "sleep". At THIS point they would most likely be in enough of a stupor that they would not notice the cold or pain. However, going directly from a very warm environment to a very cold one will ALWAYS result in discomfort.

The animals you are throwing into the freezer without proper preparation are not dying from the cold so much as they are dying from the SHOCK. Death by shock is a very traumatic thing for any species.

Whether the animal is ectothermic or endothermic has very little to do with how they will "feel" when going from one temperature extreme to another. Either way it will be a shock to the system. Beyond that a reptile will have much less ability to adjust to the temperature change and will most likely die from shock before any of it's tissues actually freeze. Endothermic animals (mammals, ect) would take longer to die in this type of environment, but their bodies would go through all types of phases that would allow them to slip into death in a more comfortable manner.

Ever been taking a shower and have someone run the hot water somewhere else in the house? Your hot shower is suddenly ice cold... imagine if it was ice and you couldn't escape.

Bring it to the vet... despite what so many people say vets aren't the morons you might think.... of course I'm a vet student so I'm a little biased.

The best way to do it is with Acetaminophen, the pain killer that's in Tylenol. Just use an extra strength (500 mg)pill and it works fast and pain less.