Reptile & Amphibian Forums

i am so angry! i went into a pet shop this week. i know i am not supposed to name them so i won't. actually i can't even remember the name but it was a PET shop that is a pretty big COmpany. They had a male veiled in a tiny glass cube type tank. he barely had room to turn around in. how can a PET store be so cruel.
COuld they not see he was stressed. i asked to talk to the manager of the PET retailer and told him i COuld no longer support that PET COmpany. the cham had no basking light or climbing branch and the humidity in the cage read 35% on their guage. i tore up some little yellow PET disCOunt card i had and left my cart full of catfood and supplies right there in the middle of their store. i will not support any PET store or COmpany that treats animals like that.

Did you ask him the reason? You should know the whole story before accusing him. If he doesn't give a good reason than leave that place, that is horrible! Thats not the only petshop that does horrible things. Lets see baby nile monitor in a 2 gallon tank? Adult bearded in a 10 gallon? 5 asian water monitors in a 2x3x4 tank. 10 beardies in a 5 gallon tank??? Life is a B*tch than you die!

He said he was fine in there. That is the housing they provide for him till they sell him. (yeah or till he dies)

Unfortunately, I see them in little tiny enclosures all the time...these stores have true idiots running them. They don't listen...I even saw one basically frying some female Jackson's...temp was up above 95, and the humidity was really low...like the thing hadn't been misted all day. I told someone that actually had the nerve to say, "oh, well, I just sprayed it".

I really wish pet stores would not sell cham's unless they were well versed in how to care for them and will teach the new owner about them. I was shocked to see how little this *unnamed* store knew about Jackson's...I knew more than they did, and I had just started researching cham's at that point.

I feel your pain...and I feel so bad for those guys.
Kristen
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0.1 pygmy leaf
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1.0 jackson

Unfortunately, I see them in little tiny enclosures all the time...these stores have true idiots running them. They don't listen...I even saw one basically frying some female Jackson's...temp was up above 95, and the humidity was really low...like the thing hadn't been misted all day. I told someone that actually had the nerve to say, "oh, well, I just sprayed it".

I really wish pet stores would not sell cham's unless they were well versed in how to care for them and will teach the new owner about them. I was shocked to see how little this *unnamed* store knew about Jackson's...I knew more than they did, and I had just started researching cham's at that point.

I feel your pain...and I feel so bad for those guys.
Kristen

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0.1 pygmy leaf
1.0 carpet
1.0 jackson

Why did you say that two times (copy paste). Anyways, they'll get whats coming to them when they die!

I once punched this guy in his face for telling my little cousin that a nile monitor can be kept in a 10 gallon tank for the rest of its life and it grows max 1.5 feet and it eats crickets and plants. I am now banned from there and they are now also out of business hehe.

and not loading all the way. It does that to me occasionally. Obviously, I didn't do it on purpose.
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0.1 pygmy leaf
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1.0 jackson

Actually, not to disagree with any of you at all (I know 90 percent of places treat chams bad) but I went into a PET COmpany about a year ago here in Vegas and they had a nice big screened cage with about 10 baby veileds in it.... About the only thing they were doing wrong was that they had wood chips in there. But besides that, they had nice climbing branches in it, lots of vines, (plastic, but hey, it's PETCO), plenty of crix to go around, and actually they had a vial of fruit flies right there. But they also had a dripper going nice and fast. I was actually impressed. Apparently they had a guy there that had kept one before and he was pretty on top of things from what I saw. The sad thing is there other reptile stores here specializing in reptiles that have 5 adult male Jacksons chameleons in a small reptarium (like 18 by 18 by 30 inches). Yeah they looked good. And they were supposed to be a specialist in reps? Yeah right. Then they get a 4 month old Ambanja Panther and have the nerve to try to sell it for $600. Please....
-Tyler Stewart

it is just pitiful that you read so many bad experiences about such PET stores, last time i went to one of those PET stores and they simply weren't SMART enough to know that a Jackson's can't be caged in a 20 gallons tank(all glass) together with a Water Dragon and some other exotic lizard...they also weren't SMART enough to know that 2 Veileds shouldn't be housed together, and also failed on knowing that chams don't drink waters from fountains only....well, i also tried to talk to the responsible person ,but it's sadly another waste of time since they say they are too SMART and know about it already but surely don't do anything at all until the animal dies or gets sold to any innocent,uninformed customer who ends up with the loss of money,time and of course a really nice animal.....but the PET store is still SMART huh?

I can only imagine how many people buy reptiles from pet stores and end up having them get sick and die due to the bad care advice they give. I know for a fact that Roan would be dead if it wasn't for this site. When we were buying all of the supplies we needed, we went by there recommendations, since the manager had a veiled. (although she said it now had mdb and didn't know why) She said we need a glass enclosure. A 20 gallon aquarium would do him for life, real plants didn't make a difference. Even when buying the bulbs, she went over to the wall where there were many kinds and gave us a daylight lamp instead of a basking light. For the shake and bake, she gave us the 2:1 which is for herbavoirs, not omnivoirs (spell check...long time since biology). Told us nothing of misting, humidity, temperatures, feeding a variety of foods instead of crix (which they sell 1000 for $100) When we got Roan, he was 5 weeks old, and hadn't been fed in a week because they didn't know they needed pinheads. You could see all his ribs and he was majorly dehydrated. We went inabout a week after getting him to get the proper supplies (thanks to this site) and they other female there which we didn't take was walking around with a wood chip stuck to her tongue and she was freaking out. God knows how long it had been there. And when we told the lady working, she said that they could use their front feet to get it off. But she did go and take it off. She ended up dying before she was sold.
Now, I am helping a friend who's sister baught a fire crested gecko, and said that they should feed it 2 1/2 inch crix every second day, and feed it peach baby food once a week. I know nothing of gecko's but I think they need special lights and enclosures like almost all reptiles. They said a 60 watt normal bulb would be fine. Said that they should provide it something for it to hide in, like a paper towel roll.
There is another chameleon there that we want to save, but right now we don't have the time or money to spend on a 2 month old veiled, but I wish we could. We're to busy taking care of Roan and my three month old baby. But chances are who ever they sell it to will take care of it all wrong, and it will die.

Is there anything we can do to stop pet stores from being so cruel to their animals and giving false information?

Stop buying from them. If you stop giving them your cash - they will lose money. That is what hurts a business the most. Unfortunately - our cash is very little compared to their net income, but as one person that is what I can do...

Let people know where to get a good reptile. I often go to my local shops ( i wont give names) and look. when I see people interested in a herp I tell them that they can get it 1/2 the price and much healthier at a local store here in Portland. If they are dead set on getting it there I usually stick around and listen to the advice of the seller...and correct them when needed. If they are receptive - I give them my email to ask me any question at any time.

A few stores over the years have learned not to appreciate me.

Sometimes if the shop seems defensive about me pushing care info on them I do a couple of other things. I print out some good care info and mail it to them (backs up what I said in person and gives them references), or I offer my home phone # in case future cham buyers want to talk about care or problems. If the shop seems interested in care (and if I am sly and sort of sneak it into the conversation) I download care pages with nice pics, share books and experience, literally flood them with info, and ask to order supplies if they will carry them. Again, I am friendly, chatty, swap herp stories, and do all I can to convince them I am a good potential customer not just a know-it-all.

I'd have to say it just depends who works at the store. I've been to several stores that don't know what they are doing, yet I go to another store in the same chain and they have very nice enclosures. I agree, 90% of the stores don't know what they are doing, but it isn't the store, rather its the people who work in the store that determine the fate of these creatures. Just my observation.

The pershop around my college is "boarding" a female chameleon for someone. I saw it in the there other day. It has only flourescent light, no basking. Is in a hexagonal glass tank and there are maybe 2 things to climpup on, everything else is ground cover. ( and the 2 things to climb on are both plastic fish plants with scution cups.) The chameleon was a light green / pasty white color and did not look happy. I dont know who's to blame here, the petshop for said reasons above, or the owner for not seehing how it would be taken care of...

Chances are the owner had brought their own enclosure.
It's amazing how little people know abouttheir pets. It's amazing how pet stores,a nd some breeders can sell animals to people, and NOT at least give them basic info.

When I was bringing my deremensis to the vet, there was a guy picking up his female veild. she was all torn up. He said that the female was messing withthe male, and he fought back, clamped down, and nipped off her tail. I mentioned that they shouldn't be kept together(but wouldn't say too much, because I didn't want to play doctor in a vet's office), and the guy says--picture Boomhower from King of the hill, looked like him, sounded JUST like him--Well, when sh' gets nasty wit'hm, sometines I'l jus tap'er on the nose or tap on da glass near'er face an sh'll stop and'll quit buggin'him." Oh, sure, why not spray her in the face while your at it and say "Bad!"?

common sense would dictate that if you keep two animals in a glass tank, and one of the animals inflicts damage on the other one totalling over $300 over several treatments(I heard the vet give himthe bill), that you would st the very least remove one of the animals. We kept our first WC veidls together, for lack of knowledge, but when the gravid female tried to kill them male, I made the decisionon my own that they would be better off apart...
If I could do that when I was 15, surely other people should be able to do that too.

Good for you, Sonia.
Ignorance is bliss with some folks...

I have made it a point to go to our local pet company to check on their reptiles. They actually offered me a job - but I said that it wouldn't take full time, and I would rather teach someone they already employed than to "take a job" from someone. Besides - I really don't have THAT much extra time...

Anyhow, they are no longer offering chameleons (not sure how long it will last) - because the last shipment they got was mostly lost. Between the fact that the chams were tiny (about 4-5 weeks old) and their lack of proper care, almost all perished.

Now they are considering letting me put chams in on "managed system" - I take care of them. We supply the lights; cage; etc. And my offer was 2 at a time only. Once they sell those, they could get more. There will be a "needed to purchase for ownership" list.... and care sheets.

They are only a few blocks from our house - and several of the folks there have been to our facility - and we take chams in when we shop (on occassion). The "managed system" is the only way we can figure out to insure the chams aren't neglected.

But at least - for now - this one pet company has learned its lesson and is not carrying chameleons. Thank goodness for someone that has a conscience there...
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