Reptile & Amphibian Forums

My great aunt has somewhere around 20 ornate box turtles (as well as one big tortise I have no idea what it is) that live in her yard over in New Mexico. They've come in as neighbors found injured ones over the course of her life (some of these turtles are 40 years old). She has informed me that I'm in her will to get them since I'm the only other person in the family that likes reptiles. Now, I wouldn't worry too much except for the fact that she's somewhere in her mid 70s, although she's in remarkably good health.

Now, she keeps them outside year round, and grows turtle edible plants in her yard for them, and has a huge honking compost pile that they hibernate in. I'd like to keep them outside as well, which I *think* I can do because they are native to my area (Amarillo Texas), but I have no idea how to really turtle proof my yard. To make issues more complicated I have dogs. They're not big--the smaller one is 30 pounds, the bigger one is 40 lbs. We also have a good population of coons around here, and the odd possum and some skunks, all of which I guess might eat turtles?

I'd like to try to work something out that would keep my turtles safe and happy. Any ideas? My experince with chelonians is limited to mud turtles and red ear sliders. What sort of plants should I grow? Is it safe to let my dogs in the yard with them? I guess a big compost heap works for hibernation?

I'm really, really hoping that I have a few years before I wind up with them, but given the PITA that scaping the yard will be, I figure I should start early.

Are you aware Texas law requires permits and fees if you keep that many native turtles?

Tim

Third Eye

yeah. it's the main reason I haven't kept anything much that's native. I just found out about this last month but I've been busy with a sick monitor and family emergencies so I just got around to researching this. I th ink it's an annual permit sorta like a hunting one and probably buyable at walmart, thankfully.

I th ink it's an annual permit sorta like a hunting one and probably buyable at walmart, thankfully.

The hunting permit lets you keep a certain number of individuals (can't remember off the top of my head)...for the larger number of turtles you have in mind you'll need one of the other permits. There should be a breakdown of the various permits and fees on the TPWD web site, and I think you buy it directly from them. TPWD enjoys restructuring their permitting system from time to time, so who knows what it's called now...maybe the "dealer's permit" even though I'm sure you don't plan on selling them.
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Chris McMartin
www.mcmartinville.com
I'm Not a Herpetologist, but I Play One on the Internet

Hell I didn't even plan on keeping them >.< I love native herps but why have them in cages when I can go watch them in the field? There's a nice little nature preserve near my place that has an astonishing number of ornate box turtles (and great plains rat snakes) that I like to go to for that.

I imagine that I'd need to plant turtle friendly plants? And I plan on an outdoor pond for my slider too, but I figure box turtles can probably manage that safely so long as I give the pond an easy entrance/exit.

I admire your willingness to put your elder family member's mind at ease by agreeing to this.

No doubt, your relative is keeping desert box turtles (Terrapene ornata luteola). They are native to New Mexico. In Amarillo, you have the ornate box turtle (Terrapene ornata ornata). They are VERY similar, and only a trained eye can spot the main differences. I keep both, and can give you some very basic information on their care.

One of the most important things to think about is keeping your relative's turtles from escaping into Amarillo. It's just not a good thing for subspecies to mix artificially like that.

You can construct escape proof pens using outdoor lumber, tin sheets, poly sheets of roofing material, and so many other materials. You can incorporate some sort of kickplate or even wire mesh onto your current yard fence in order to make it escape proof. But, since you have dogs, you'll probably need a formal pen setup. I would recommend buying the sections of privacy fencing sold at Lowes or Home Depot. You can simply cut them in half and you create walls of appropriate size to keep out most dogs (unless you have some jumpers). Note - you'll need to purchase another supporting 2X4 for one of the halves. Bury them 8-12 inches into the ground to prevent escapes.

Most native mammals, with the exception of coyotes and fox, are no real danger to an adult box turtles. Young turtles will need to be protected, though. If you are very concerned, I have actually seen people construct pens that resemble chicken coops. Basic hinged screen tops and electric fencing are also options.

Desert box turtles love grasses and sedges in their pens. Yucca is good also. For an edible treat, consider planting a mullberry tree. Just make sure that it doesn't block out too much sun. You're pretty safe to stick with native plants. Opuntia cactus is also a fantastic, edible, fruit bearing choice.

You will have to offer them food. Some favorites of my deserts are cooked sweet potatoes, frozen/thawed carrots (it softens them, but doesn't change the flavor like cooking), PEAS!, green beans, strawberries, blackberries, chicken, and soaked reptomin. If they had their way, they would eat only crickets, grasshoppers, and roaches. But, that is too expensive. Live prey is offered about once or twice weekly. I also offer pinkies about once monthly.

In my opinion, the compost pit is a must.

I hope this is helpful. Keep in mind, there are always people willing to adopt healthy turtles, especially the desert box turtle. Most of mine came from adoptions. The law is often softer on the free exchange of turtles, while their sale is often strictly regulated.

Good luck!

All permit/law talk aside, check out these websites to study up on keeping your ornates happy:

www.boxturtlesite.info
http://turtle_tails.tripod.com/
http://www.austinsturtlepage.com/Care/cs-ornateboxie.htm
http://www.chelonia.org/Articles/plantsthatpoison.htm
http://www.anapsid.org/resources/edible.html

Good luck!