Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Well, it was feeding time last night, and everything was going as it always did, until…

It was time to feed my big girl Nyoka – She grabbed the live rat by the butt, and the rat turned around, and bit her in the head.

There was a scuffle, with a lot of squeaking by the rat. Before I could find something to pry the rat off my snake, the snake let go off the rat. The rat ran to the corner, leaving the snake behind, bleeding profusely from the top of her head and mouth.

I looked around for something to stop the bleeding, but couldn’t find anything, so I just used my shirt.

There was SO much blood, I was really scared!

I was able to stop the bleeding, but her jaw was pretty messed up. It was around 10pm, and there was no place to take her at that hour, so I had to wait till this morning, to take her to the Vet. I didn’t get much sleep, wondering if she would make it through the night.

She made it through the night, and I got her to Dr. Greek (in Yorba Linda CA), first thing in the morning. He gave her a complete examination, and diagnosed her with swelling only, and no broken bones. He was able to take some of the swelling down from the top of her head, but her upper jaw is still really swollen, and she can’t close her mouth. She’s breathing fine, and flicking her tongue out. Dr. Greek thinks she’ll make a full recovery.

I have an Anti-inflammatory and Antibiotics to give her for two weeks. It’s gonna be a long two weeks!

Nyoka holds a special place in my heart – she gave me my first clutch of eggs in 2007, and she’s been paired with my Spider this year.

I think I better try switching to frozen!
Thank you Dr. Greek! - Pictures below are from this morning at the Vet’s office.

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0.1 Mojave Ball Python (Mitena)
1.0 Spider Ball Python (Sarki)
0.1 Pastel Ball Python (Panthea)
0.1 100% Het Albino Ball Python (Hazina Adamma)
1.0 Albino Ball Python (Apu)
0.5 Normal Ball Pythons (Norma, Nova, Nala, Nimeesha, Nyoka)

1.0 Desert Tortoise (Tubbs) from Tortoise Rescue
1.0 Boxer (Shadow)


www.ocballs.net
kvandoren@ocballs.net

>>Well, it was feeding time last night, and everything was going as it always did, until…
>>
>>It was time to feed my big girl Nyoka – She grabbed the live rat by the butt, and the rat turned around, and bit her in the head.
>>
>>There was a scuffle, with a lot of squeaking by the rat. Before I could find something to pry the rat off my snake, the snake let go off the rat. The rat ran to the corner, leaving the snake behind, bleeding profusely from the top of her head and mouth.
>>
>>I looked around for something to stop the bleeding, but couldn’t find anything, so I just used my shirt.
>>
>>There was SO much blood, I was really scared!
>>
>>I was able to stop the bleeding, but her jaw was pretty messed up. It was around 10pm, and there was no place to take her at that hour, so I had to wait till this morning, to take her to the Vet. I didn’t get much sleep, wondering if she would make it through the night.
>>
>>She made it through the night, and I got her to Dr. Greek (in Yorba Linda CA), first thing in the morning. He gave her a complete examination, and diagnosed her with swelling only, and no broken bones. He was able to take some of the swelling down from the top of her head, but her upper jaw is still really swollen, and she can’t close her mouth. She’s breathing fine, and flicking her tongue out. Dr. Greek thinks she’ll make a full recovery.
>>
>>I have an Anti-inflammatory and Antibiotics to give her for two weeks. It’s gonna be a long two weeks!
>>
>>Nyoka holds a special place in my heart – she gave me my first clutch of eggs in 2007, and she’s been paired with my Spider this year.
>>
>>I think I better try switching to frozen!
>>Thank you Dr. Greek! - Pictures below are from this morning at the Vet’s office.
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>>0.1 Mojave Ball Python (Mitena)
>>1.0 Spider Ball Python (Sarki)
>>0.1 Pastel Ball Python (Panthea)
>>0.1 100% Het Albino Ball Python (Hazina Adamma)
>>1.0 Albino Ball Python (Apu)
>>0.5 Normal Ball Pythons (Norma, Nova, Nala, Nimeesha, Nyoka)
>>
>>1.0 Desert Tortoise (Tubbs) from Tortoise Rescue
>>1.0 Boxer (Shadow)
>>
>>
>>www.ocballs.net
>>kvandoren@ocballs.net
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Thanks,

Frank Roberts

I trust Dr. Greek's opinion. He is my vet as well. GREAT VET/GUY -- I feel lucky to have him when I need him.

I am sure she will be fine. It is very rare that this kind of thing happens. I feed live, and have for 2 years -- A LOT of rats thrown in tubs. lol

Don't let it freak you out too badly. 2 weeks will pass before you know it. Good luck!!!
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Bill Buchman

I hope you don’t have trouble getting her to eat after this , as it so often happens with Balls that have a traumatic experience wile feeding . It can take quite a wile with some of them depending on how severe and all the other circumstances .good luck with her and keep us informed , and if I can help with any advice just ask . David

It almost looks like she just needs to "re-align" her jaw! I'm sure it will work out!

I’m not talking about the physical aspects but the mental . David

If you are going to feed live it is always smart to keep a pair of tongs on hand as well because a live rat when injured will bite at what ever is closest to its face. Tongs can act as a second defense. Lets face it, this does not have to be a fair playing field of hunter vs pray because we all want to do all we can to keep pray from getting the slightest hit on the hunter!

Matt

For the few I have to feed live to , I keep a pencil or a small wooden dowel on hand to stick in the rodents mouth in case of a bad strike and let them bite that and not my reptiles. David

What size rat did you feed?? You can't go by the same rules of size when feeding live that you can when using frozen thawed. When using live I only use weaners whatever the size of the snake.

Very good point. When feeding live I always watch with a snake hook in my hand.Hope she gets well soon.

Sorry to hear about your snake. Looks like she'll be just fine and you did all you could. Hope she feels better soon man.
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Morph Evolutions
www.morphevolutions.com
www.myspace.com/morphevolutions

I know how you feel. I got a pretty good scare a few weeks ago when my YB boy got a bad strike. He'd been flawless til then but this rat got him on the head too, nothing too severe tho. I was glad I had tongs at hand! Now weaning everyone onto f/t or pk. I almost had a heart attack!

Hope all goes well. And good luck with the Spiders!

I don't use tong's or a pencil.
If they wrap it in a position that the prey item can bite,
a good thump on the head of the rodent solve's the biting!
Never had a problem doing it this way.

Pre-killed is the way to go !! When ever I would feed live to ANYTHING in my collection, a good thump on the head and there is NO CHANCE of biting by the prey.

Walter

Thanks for all the kind words!
Nyoka is doing much better today, most of the swelling has gone down. I wanted to take a new picture, but I left the camera at work last night. I'll take a new one tonight.

When I was checking on her last night, she actually struck at me. She's never done this before, but I'm kinda glad she did. I look at it as a sign of normal Ball Python behavior, and she's on her way to recovery!

I'm still very much a newbee, but I've been feeding live for just short of 4 years now, and I've never had this problem. Yes, this rat was a little larger than what I normally feed (it was an adult female). I normally feed small to medium rats, for this very reason. A friend bought this rat, to feed his snake, but it didn't eat, so he offered it to me. It's hard to turn down a free meal! Next time, the rat will have to take a little "nap" before it's offered to my snake.

This all happened in a matter of seconds, with little or no time to react.
I'm just glad the worst is over, and she's doing better!

Thanks again,
Ken

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0.1 Mojave Ball Python (Mitena)
1.0 Spider Ball Python (Sarki)
0.1 Pastel Ball Python (Panthea)
0.1 100% Het Albino Ball Python (Hazina Adamma)
1.0 Albino Ball Python (Apu)
0.5 Normal Ball Pythons (Norma, Nova, Nala, Nimeesha, Nyoka)

1.0 Desert Tortoise (Tubbs) from Tortoise Rescue
1.0 Boxer (Shadow)


www.ocballs.net
kvandoren@ocballs.net

The strike was probably more of a faint and was a warning that she is hurting and stressed and scared . But still a good sign , if she feels as though she could withstand striking something , she should be ok . David

My largest adult female had a similar incident a couple months ago - she's capable of eating jumbo rats, given the chance, and I had one on hand and figured what the hell? Why not?
She nailed it and nearly knocked her cage over, and swallowed it no problem - I thought all was well.

The next day, however, while cleaning water bowls I noticed her eye was a little funny. The rat had managed to bite the spectacle halfway off! It looked pretty awful initially, but I cleaned her off and looked at it closely again. The eye itself was fine, just the spectacle was damaged.
Swabbed some teramyacin on there and waited, figuring that if it didn't improve over the next few days I'd take her into the vet.

The eye scabbed over a little, but never got infected, and when she shed a month later, her eye was totally back to normal.

Moral of the story? Be careful with large prey items, but don't underestimate a good cleaning and the snake's natural ability to heal! They can come back from some crazy things with good care.
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"We call them dumb animals, and so they are, for they cannot tell us how they feel, but they do not suffer less because they have no words."
- Anna Sewell (1820-1878)

when in need.....grab.....fingers get bloody too but you feel good about doing it......yes....I have bled and yes if you grab rat hard enough...it will not bite....it will gasp only......

.also.why I don't feed anything bigger than small rats almost 99% of the time....well...actually more....fuzz, hops and smalls......

.....that's a bad one......bad spot........

good luck.....
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...JY

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Bottom line is you should never feed adult rats to ball pythons.

Wow poor thing... hope those medications don't muck up her developing babies.
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-Diana
www.LunarBoids.com