Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Just a couple to mix it up . . . I anticipate these are going to be just killer when adults . . . finally off scented and growing nicely at just over a foot.

Male

Female

" alt="Image">
-----
Jerry Kruse

"One often meets his destiny on the path he takes to avoid it". - Master Oogway

Jerry -- nice animals! Good luck with them.

Jerry,

Both of these specimens are very, very nice (always nice when they start taking frozen/thawed)! Thanks for posting them...I've been meaning to work with them as well so if you can post, who did you get them from?

Later,
Jim.
-----
CSRAJim

I got these from Shannon last year. Sweet snakes and ate like champs from the start as I'd gotten them out of the egg. I had a greeri back in the 90's that looked just like the female I have now, but was just a pet. Sold her off several years back and decided to get greeri again but KEEP them this time around. They also accent the zonata collection in a nice way too. Thanks again Jim....
-----
Jerry Kruse

"One often meets his destiny on the path he takes to avoid it". - Master Oogway

Jerry,

SB...I should have known...Thanks man.

Later,
Jim.
-----
CSRAJim

anytime brother. See ya around.....
-----
Jerry Kruse

"One often meets his destiny on the path he takes to avoid it". - Master Oogway

Jerry,

Check your email...

Later,
Jim.
-----
CSRAJim

.
-----
Jerry Kruse

"One often meets his destiny on the path he takes to avoid it". - Master Oogway

>>Just a couple to mix it up . . . I anticipate these are going to be just killer when adults . . . finally off scented and growing nicely at just over a foot.

Great looking greeri Jerry...
The top one has got to have the highest band count I have seen in Greeri...The bottom is one of those CLEAN ones from Shannon....
Great choices.....
-----
John Lassiter

"Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part....."

Well...
Maybe not the highest band count...lol I just counted and compared both....but the first one has wide saddles/bands....Cool Greeri Jerry....
-----
John Lassiter

"Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part....."

LOL.....I thought the same thing when I got them in, as it was a sight unseen kinda thing. But for sure one of the weirdest looking greeri I've seen especially due to the width of the bands . . . . the depth of green pigment on him is awesome. The female is getting lighter (hopefully Shannon can post a pic of the sire) over time, but either way, they're both great looking and I couldn't be happier. Shannon posted a pic on the kingsnake forum to show the dam as well as the clutch pic from '08.
-----
Jerry Kruse

"One often meets his destiny on the path he takes to avoid it". - Master Oogway

I like the green ones. Mines a Thayeri though

-----
Darwin Rocks!

these are actually not the same snake?!!?!?!?!?!! Are you sure???????? Because the hybrid police may beg to differ. LOL.

Oh brothERRRRRRRRRR!!!! I'm just giddy today . . .

.....and a wee bit tired........

.........sorry...........

........looks like something yohe would do right??..........

................LMAO.................

...................yohe don't be mad u know i got ya back even tho you like hybrids....................................

..........................LMAO again......................
-----
Jerry Kruse

"One often meets his destiny on the path he takes to avoid it". - Master Oogway

Its not that I like hybrid I jsut don't see them as an abomination like others do.

As for the two snakes. Yes they look alike. Sometimes greeri look like thayeri and some times thayeri look like greeri. No point just an obvious reality yet people continue to throw stones and assume moral platitudes about something as ridiculus as a friggin pet snake. Good thing there aren't any real issues to worry about.
-----
Darwin Rocks!

the economy? Talk about a hybrid problem........
-----
Jerry Kruse

"One often meets his destiny on the path he takes to avoid it". - Master Oogway

as far as hybrid issues go I think some of the concerns over GM food stocks is much more worthy of consideration than whether or not there is a little thayeri in your greeri wood pile.

The inconsistency here is when some champion those who ask questions or throw disparagements when they don’t have a dog in the fight and take offence when they do.

IMHO your first greeri is a little thayeri-ish but, for a captive-bred animal, I find that neither, surprising, suspicious or alarming. It’s a great looking snake, the info you have indicates no known or deliberate crossing which is about as good as it gets. Speculating otherwise is wrong on a personal level and a complete waste of time. End of story.
-----
Darwin Rocks!

It all boils down to integrity. If there's something in the wood pile Jerry has a right to know it, and the fact that there is a common link between the last greeri hybrid posted here and this snake would not be a comfort if it were my dollar.

Question all you want, but don't take it too seriously, like you said. It's only a pet snake.
-----
Herp Conservation Unlimited
Mexicana Group Directory
Photography by Joseph E. Forks

That other animal is a completely different issue. That it had "some" thayeri in it was obvious. Come to think of it what wasn't obvious was that that thayeri had any greeri influence!

I think Jerry's animal is a different story. Given the expected phenotypic drift CB animals experience and the likely hood that somewhere way back most CB mexicana have some level of hybrid influence his animal was not out of line with what one would expect from a line bred pedigree. His only mistake was calling it pure which is way too common. As I've learned form you and Aaron the only thing that can be pure is locality. Even with this, there is little agreement on what constitutes locality.
-----
Darwin Rocks!

luckily the light phase has manifested itself in the Mimbres line and also animals from the Don Wilson/ Randy L. line, just not the degree it is manifested in the "Applegate / german" line, so we know that trait is not borrowed from another species or subspecies.

There was something else very troubling though, if you read what he said and were paying attention to details. I don't feel like expanding on that though, I'm threw stomping on naivety for a few days. It gets very depressing when you see three different examples that you know are screwed up in a single day.
-----
Herp Conservation Unlimited
Mexicana Group Directory
Photography by Joseph E. Forks

oh, and I thought it was you and Frank that got me to quit using the word "pure".

Locality probably only refers to WC and F1's. After that I don't know what to call them anymore, except in some cases it's clear they are mutts.
-----
Herp Conservation Unlimited
Mexicana Group Directory
Photography by Joseph E. Forks

Actually it was you, Aaron and Kjun who pulled me around to your way of thinking on the locality issue and it being the only real "pure". In any case they were fun and informative conversations some might have thought them argumentative but I viewed them as spirited and I learned a lot!

I still see things as generally less structured than many locality guys though. Number one I don't see locality as the end all to be all of reptile breeding. It's a personal preference for those who look to buy F1s and beyond and I think there is a real trophy collecting aspect for the guys who are dealing with founder stocks. None of this is bad but neither is it something upon which to make morality judgments about others who don't hold the same preferences.

As for generics I think my stand is a bit more infuriating for some people. I think it best to completely drop the word "pure" as a descriptor and to assume that there is always the potential for some unnatural influence in generic stocks even from "well-respected" breeders who have a very vocal distain for hybrids. For all intensive purposes generic stock are domesticated animals and they can have pedigree and be purebred irrespective of their wild origins.
-----
Darwin Rocks!