Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Just a quick question aimed at those that support this bill (yes do not think that they don't troll these forums). What do you think will happen to the hundreds of thousands pythons in breeders' collections if this bill passes? I know I would never release an animal into the wild and have been cutting back to make it to where I don't need to breed to feed my animals but there are quite a few breeders that have thousands upon thousands of pythons and boas. I'm sure most of these breeders would not be willing to euthanize their animals and would not be able to keep them all for pets. Even if the average or professional breeder were to do what HSUS and PETA would like them to do, these Representatives and Congressman would be signing a death sentence to hundreds of thousands of snakes. Because afterall we know that these two organizations advocate killing pet animals over owning them. There is a reason that HSUS does not own one single shelter and that PETA runs several that have the highest kill ratio of any shelter in the country.

How many other hobby breeders out there are limiting their breeding this year? I know I am. I am concentrating on 10-12 clutches this year and giving most of my females the year off that way if the bill does go through, I don't have many animals that I can't do anything with and if it doesn't I will have quite a few females that have had 1-3 yrs off.

Let me know how everyone feels.
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Josh & Krysty Hutto
J&K Reptiles

Various Ball Pythons, boas, dogs, cats, fish, an amel tiger retic female, a couple sulcatas and a few other odds and ends.

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

Maybe I'm not as informed as I would like to think I am. But it seems they tried to pass the same thing with burmese and Retics. Instead they opted for a Reptiles of Concern (ROC) permit (and microchips..I think) It seems that this would be a better alternative as they could require this in any state where there is a concern. (ex: Florida) It seems a fairer compromise to people who are responsible owners. I know I would have no problem applying for a permit. Most of it's just paying a fee, and submitting the paperwork. And If I don't plan on releasing my animals into the streets, I should have no problem microchipping them. I think this would be a better and fairer alternative than banning them all together.

Just my opinion..
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This is courage.. to bear unflinching what heaven sends. -unknown

2.0 chocolate lab (Harley) and basset (Capone)
0.1 leopard gecko (Nacho)
1.0 Normal ball python (Arwen)
1.0 pastel ball python (Merlin)
0.1 Spider ball python (Rogue)
1.0 Normal ball (Arwen)

i would have to agree with that. i have owned reptiles since i was in middle school i would much rather buy a permit than have to get rid of them as long as the permit was not stupidly priced and i would think that bannin something like a retic that gets 20' is alot more reasnoble than banning all pythons i mean come on a ball python is a very sweet snake and 99% of the time non aggresive i have some that you can do anything to and they will not bite you and the chances of them living here in the wild where i live are very slim and if one did get outwhat would it do? i cant really see this bill passing to ban all pythons and boas and i can not see any of us giving up one snake that we spent $500 dollars or 10,000 on, what they should be trying to ban is the breeding of cats and dogs if you look at an animal shelter how many snakes or reptiles do you see? how many dogs cats and birds or rabbits do you see? there has to be another way in stead of bannin them
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reed at www.ReedsDragons.com & www.KillerEnclosures.com

The problem with that logic is that the lobbying groups behind these legislations are PETA and HSUS. These groups are very vocal about there beliefs that no person should own an animal, ANY ANIMAL!!! These groups are the strogest anti-pet groups in the world and they have alot of money to spend. They are responsible for most of the breed specific legislation regarding pit bulls, rotties, and alot of the mastif breeds. These are just starting grounds for these groups, like I said earlier, their ultimate goal is to ban all keeping of animals. They used lies to help ban these breeds of dogs and are using lies now to try to ban these snakes. WE CANNOT CAVE IN AND SAY IT'S OK TO BAN THE BIG GUYS BECAUSE THEY WILL COME AFTER ALL SNAKES EVENTUALLY AND WILL HAVE PRECIDENCE IF WE LET THEM WIN!!!!
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Josh & Krysty Hutto
J&K Reptiles

Various Ball Pythons, boas, dogs, cats, fish, an amel tiger retic female, a couple sulcatas and a few other odds and ends.

a BAD dog is MADE not bred, support the American Pit Bull Terrier as the greatest breed of dogs on Earth!!!!!

grossly misunderstanding this bill!! It is NOT just aimed at boas/pythons-if passed as written, it would essentially ban ALL exotic (non-native to the U.S.) reptiles and Amphibians!

Everyone in the herp community should read this bill. Everyone.
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Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

The Avalanche has already started-it is too late for the pebbles to vote....

This is not limited to reptiles and amphibians. This would essentially ban all non native wildlife. Section 14 Paragraph 5-D outlines a list of animals that would be approved to keep. The list is very short when you consider all the animals that people keep as pets.

Here is what would be left if HR669 passes:
Cat, Cattle or Oxen, Chicken, Dog, Donkey or Ass, Domesticated Geese, Duck, Goat, Goldfish, Horse, Llama, Mule or Hinny, Pig or Hog, Domesticated variety of Rabbit, and Sheep.

Something to think about.
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Randy and Michelle
Art In Scales
(719) 439-4199
info@artinscales.com

thats true i dont think its right to ban any of them how ever i can see a permit for large snakes just to keep track of them
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reed at www.ReedsDragons.com & www.KillerEnclosures.com

The current mess started in Florida where there are some wealthy self serving and connected people who hate what we do. What was originally asked for by the people that would like to stick it to us was that all exotics be banned here in Florida.

During this time there was a series of work shops where the reptile guys got their say and whatever. In the end a permit and micro chip system is what Florida Fish and Game felt was a fair deal. Sure they did because included in this deal was a sneaky secret last minute addition involving class one animals that made them nice money. That the way it works.

Most people for some reason thought it would end there. No way. I thought it would take a year but the Anti ownership people were on it months before the permit micro chip decision was even made .

The problem is this issue go's beyond animals and now there's people with a lot of government pull behind this thing. Make no mistake their not looking for a compromise something along the lines of lets just get rid of the big snakes and leave it at that. This a serious effort . What many people don't understand is that long before the burms in the everglades hoopla they went after ball pythons as part of a package deal at that time they didn't have nearly the backing they do now.

Most people that collect reptiles or other exotics do it as a hobby . It's something they have a passion for and enjoy . It's suppose to be fun. It can't be expected for the average person to get rapped up in all the intricacies involved with legislative attacks. Most people don't follow political issues that involve their full time life. It is important that when given the opportunity that everyone takes at least a little time to speak up on their own behalf. This is a broad range attack and we need a broad range of support.

The way I look at it is,

We're living in a grass hut on a small island and there`s a category five hurricane coming our way . Sometimes hurricanes lose momentum , sometimes they change direction and sometimes they hit dead on. Right now we're in the cone of uncertainty but the projected path is not good. If you get missed by this one next year hurricane season starts again.

Ernie Eison
WESTWOOD ACRES REPTILE FARM INC.

This fight is far from over and i think once all of these questions are considered the bill will either die or undergoe significant revision.

And even if this bill or a similar one does pass... people will still keep and breed Ball Pythons. The Government simply does not have the resources to regulate the millions of reptiles already in the country.

As far as the Giants go... some regulation is unavoidable. It's important the Herp community play a part in what that regulation looks like in the end.

Oz
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OZZYBOIDS

here is a link to the bill, you can track its progress and read the exact wording of the it.

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h111-669

If anybody at all in Washington understands pythons and boas and they actually go by what is stated in sec. 3 of the bill we should all be ok because there is just no credible evidence to support banning these reptiles for the entire U.S.

They can have my snakes at the same time they take my guns ,, when I run out of bullets or they take them from my dead hands . David