Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Does anyone ever notice sometimes a certain morph or genetic trait will get talked up real good on the message boards, flattering photos will get posted daily, and after about a few days or week or so, I think I see alot more ads for this or that kinda snake listed?

Maybe I listen to too much Coast to Coast radio at 3am when I cant sleep and I am turning into a paranoid conspiracy theorist? But there are times I actually believe that a group of merchants or clique of breeders are maneuvering the discussions & imagery on the message boards to their financial advantage and this makes me feel like an attempt is being made to manipuate and use people? Then there are other times I believe its just attentive, good business people taking notice & advantage of the buzz factor to move some snakes, which would be very smart of them.

I dont know...maybe I haved to get out more?

you could be right, or it could be kind of like when you buy a new car then after a little while you start to notice that EVERYBODY has that car

Yeah right. But again, for the last week or two a certain morph (and I dont want to say which one) has been getting hyped up with photos and the sliced bread treatment and I have been waiting...sure enough the ads for this heretofore more obscure morph are a runnin' now.

n/p

How can I put this in one word............DUH? Its been going on since these forums on Kingsnake started. Everyone that has a clutch posted in these forums inevitably posts the same pictures in the classifieds. It's marketing on a lower level. While most are meant just to show off, others use it as a direct marketing tool. It falls in the grey area of advertising in the forums vs. classifieds. No conspiracy needed.....
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South Central Herpetological

Ohh..I feel better-txs. However, posting a picture and saying "LOOK! AMAZING & BEAUTIFUL MORPH", then reposting the photo in an ad 3days later would be, however low rent, marginal business slight of hand. Having predetermined discussions between several merchants or breeders with the aim of drawing unsuspecting marks into the observations and discussions over a certain morph via flattering photos and hyped up genetics has the potential of bordering on collusion. I would be VERY suspect of breeders who would collude to seprate me from my money that way...

You'd be surprised how often that " low rent, marginal business slight of hand " is used by every retailer in business. It goes along with the " Any publicity is good publicity " thought, and it works very well. See my signature below? Just worked didn't it?
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South Central Herpetological

I think what you are saying is fine, you are smart for doing it. Kingsnake allows you to put your business website tag on the page also..I looked. I dont think that someone taking a beautiful photo of a newly hatched snake & showing it off & then posting it for sale is really wrong either. Low rent was maybe the wrong way to put it (was the wrong way - sorry). What I maybe should have said is that posting a show-off pic and then having it for sale is maybe a 'white lie' sales technique.

What I do not think is right, and what I sometimes believe happens, is two or more people(or business interests) get together and agree ahead of time to post here (and elsewhere) with the express intent of hyping up a certain type of morph that they have inventory and want to market as the next or greatest thing. They draw unsuspecting hobbiests (you and me) in by posting ultra flattering photos and by describing the superior beauty and breeding potential and money making possibilities of the snake. This is done not for purpose of discussion, or learning, or the sharing of a common passion, but only to draw attention and stir excitement up among the masses (aka potential customers - you and me again). Then a little while later the same 'must have' new trait(or even over looked trait) or morph is available at a ground floor entry price in the classified section.

That aint right.

I have found that people post pics on here and then go straight to the classifieds and post for sale ads for the same animals right after.

Same guys were posting them for sale over and over and over again before it produced anything interesting. Can't blame them for trying to move them now that it's been "proven" and is fresh on peoples minds.
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Tosha
JET Pythons
Toshas Blog

Its gotta be me...? This will be my last post on this one, but..

This isnt the classified section. I am not talking about any one person or group, but if people or businesses are colluding in a discussion forum & trolling for customers using 'pump and dump' techniques, it should be pointed out.

The candle maker may want to sell candles in the worst way, but he knows hucking them to the priest in church on Sunday is not the place. If he is doing the same with 2-3 of his candle making friends by tricking the priest it doesnt make it any better..?

Yes get out more,just smart business tactics.

One thing to remember is some of those people that post a "look at my snake" pic here, and then put it up for sale in the classifieds, are also eager to share their experience and knowledge to questions posted here. Most are not posting in this forum just to sell a snake, but because they love this hobby/business/addiction/sickness as much as everyone else. Just my $.02

Bill J
By the way ----LOOK AT THIS BEAUTIFUL SNAKE!!!

I've seen several dealers post pics here than hardly ever post. Then they post the same animals for sale. It doesn't happen all the time, but you can easily spot the ones that deliberately do it. It doesn't just happen on this forum.
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www.brandonosbornereptiles.com

I agree.......
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Damian Macioce
www.strongholdreptiles.com

Ive seen the same thing. I have no prblem with it for 2 reasons. 1. I really want to see the pics of the animals they are producing and 2. For the most part these are they guys that are paying most of the bills here.
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I am number Nine.

jeff pfeifer

It's smart advertising. Plus i enjoy seeing all the stuff on the forum, because i'm not interested in buying anything so i don't bother to look at the classifieds.

I've definately noticed a similar trend. I've noticed that if i am selling a particular snake, i may have a set of babies for 6 months, but then REPTILES has a centerfold article on that snake, in the next 2-3 months i couldn't have enough to meet the demand.

Check in the classifieds...lol. Just kidding. NFS. Thanks for the complement.

Amen,

Part of the fun is learning about this awesome hobby and or "side business". We all have to start somewhere and I am sure we have all purchased snakes that we may have regretted. But if some breeders are selling snakes because of hype on the forums than who is at fault there. The good news is when you find a breeder you can trust and you can learn what a morph should look like... Well than you are in the driver seat and you can play the game right back at the not so honest breeders. It makes me laugh when you see an add that says High end morphs. These morphs came from the following breeders......and the pics look like junk and snakes are clearly low on the High end morph category. I am sure a lot of us even say who in the world is buying these.....Well that is what makes this a fun venture. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and if you need to be told what the beauty is than you will keep a lot of the sidewinder breeders in business for years to come. On a side note when I am selling something I want people to think it is the best too. Why not. It is just good business.

Just my .357 cents worth also,
Bill

Although I am one that doesn't seem to mind hyping up a morph and then selling it in the classifieds, I give Zefdin points for posting his opinion on this topic. It created a few responses of other peoples opinions which is great for these forums, and we learn about how others in here feel about the hobby at the same time. Not to mention that maybe Zefdin also informed some in here that this does happen, like me. I feel kind of naive because I didn't even know this until Zef did point this out. I need to look at the classifieds more.

Good post Zef...

By the way, I still like that killer snake Reptile Junkie posted.

..require many questions -- rightly so. If a breeder just put a new/complex project or morph on the classifieds with no backstory/history, he would likely have a big headache from explaining EVERY detail to many newer keepers who have little basic genetic background.

The forums are just that -- "a forum" for such discussions and explorations.

I have a few projects in the works that even when thoroughly PROVEN will not be "black and white". Some have been posted in part, even though I have not let any of the animals from these projects leave my collection. They will be posted in the future as I discover more about them. I would prefer someone who contacts me about buying an animal to have a basic understanding of what they are considering involvement in if possible -- my 2 cents.
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Bill Buchman

Where else can one show other enthusiasts what they have hatched,AND get open and public feedback on the animals?.Certainly not in the classifieds(no feedback there)..So posting in an open forum is the only way to separate ones self from those that prefer to not have an openly public opinion of what they are selling..In fact,it is the only way to be distinguished from "undesireable sellers",since any negative opinion about an animal or seller in the forum is deleted..So by comparison the idea of showing on forums and then selling in classifieds isn't born of evil,it's actually a way to be more open and honest about things.

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Charles Glaspie
http://www.myspace.com/coldthumb

its a hobby and a business. we all know which recent situation you are speaking of. that individual clearly enjoys talking about his hobby, his discoveries AND he tries to help and give advice at times. so it's all good. you give / you get.

what's annoying is the few breeders who will never come here to post and help others, and the only post you'll ever see from them is a look what i just created sort of post. then you don't hear from them until the next morph... like everyone into balls, they troll here for sure as its smart to... for many reasons. but if they make a guest visit, its only going to be about them.

in my book, that's a lame game. if you're here looking, help a nubie or say something once in awhile that has nothing to do with your business.

...and shake my head when I see their OCCASIONAL "see my stuff post" lol
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Bill Buchman