Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I posted this down below but didn't want it to get lost down there....
refers to babies produced by three females in the Burkes collection. These are Hypo het Albino females purchased from D&M Breeders. Ruby as named by Damion of D&M is the nicest of these females and subsequently produced the first "Lipstick" Sunglows. As the name grew in popularity any animals produced from those females came to be known as the Lipstick line. As far as I know all the males used in these breedings were coral albino males that came from Pete.

You are correct that the three females came from dm. However that is where the line ends. Tom uses one albino male bred to those three females to produce the lipsticks. He has tried using a different male to the same females and a different female to the same male and none of those breedings produced lipsticks. The only true lipsticks produced came from that combo of the one male and the three females and that combo only.

That's also good info to know John in addition to what Vin stated.
I knew at least a founding fem came from DM but did not know the rest of this great info.

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

No prob Lar. But that is part of the problem. Some people who have animals from D&M produce sunglows and call them lipsticks because they think they are the same, when in all actuality they are not.

Wow John I didn't even know people were making that ridiculous leap.
John I am curious though about D M Candy Cane Line is there any
connection between those and Ruby that you know of ?

thanks

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

As far as the relation of the Candy Cane line to the Lipstick line. The parents of both lines are decendants from the same imported hypo female which is believed to be as least partially responsible for the some traits associated both lines.

I actually started the Candy Cane line by breeding a D&M female that proved out as a super hypo het albino to a D&M male Albino that was actually litter mate to one of the first proven Super Sunglows. This litter had four Paradox Sunglows and nine Hypos with amazing colors and patterns. All of these animals are knows as the Candy Cane line.

I had no idea about this Vin. Thankyou I love to know info like this.
How closely have you Damian worked on other projects . Or is the Candy Cane the only project you developed with him.
How come the Candy Cane Line ended up more associated with DM Damian not you?
Or is it just because the Candy Cane Line is marketed on DM website ?
Thanks Vin

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

Alot of my original stuff came from Damion and he lives close to me so it works out well. I really do this more as a hobby rather than a living and the animals I used to start the project were produced by D&M so we are really partners in the project. I just feel like its the right thing to do to give him credit where due. Just because I bought the animals and breed them doesnt give me the right to take full credit in my eyes.

I understand where your coming from. Sounds like a good relationship for both of you.
Nothing better than to have someone close by that your close to and can share this great hobby with !

Also you didn't by cnance come to Tinley Chi. show this past '08 ?
. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

Yea I was actually there with Damion this year.... maybe I met you.

As I'm talking with you here I had a feeling.
Yes I met you I'm pretty certain of it.
You Damian and Damians Son
LOL How about that

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

Yea that was me im trying to remember who you were. As far as the paradox genetics we are very confident they are genetic its just the mode of inheritence that needs to be iorned out. We will both have females from the original paradox litter ready to go next year so that should answer alot of questions. This year we have the original female breeding a partialy related paradox male.

You saw so many people that day,that weekend,LOL. I'm sure you could not remember me.
I was there on Saturday afternoon,dark hair, 5'7".
I was actually talking to all of you guys about Sunsets of course and the Paradox
Albinos and Damians son was explaining how he thought the
genetics worked with them.
He doesn't think its recessive is what I took away from what he said I thought he mentioned Codom.
I personally don't think they would be Codom.
You would have an answer already I would think,but yours are
all fems aren't they ,so maybe not ? LOL
I hope you guys get some real answers and understand what they
are a little better.
. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

I actually have a theory of how the gene works. I feel like it may be a double recessive where one or both of the genes may be very subtle or not visible at all but if you get both of those genes together you get paradox.

Interesting idea theory. Sounds closer to the possible truth.This might also explain why some Hypo Boas have that Black pigment that looks like its embedded in a couple layers of the skin. I'm not talking about the typical black pigment specks that appear on Hypo Boas .That is obviously on the very surface .
You probably know what I'm speaking about because the black I'm referring to looks more almost distorted even charcoal gray in color in some areas on these certain rare Hypo Boas.
I certainly hope you guys sort it out.
Its a Kool project the "Paradox Albino"

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

Great set of pictures ! Did that particular Paradox Glow make it ? Its beautiful !
I talk to damian from time to time and
always when I see him at Tinley.
He mentioned he thinks he has this Paradox thing
almost figured out.
Have you or him learned anymore ?

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

Thats very intresting that it only seems to be that male with those females kinda makes you wonder if there is a mild recessive color morph hiding in there.

That's a very good point Vin. I wonder about color
in certain Boa Lines quite often.
Coplor is genetic with Blood Boas,also appears to be with the Marron Boas.
Nobody knows what's with Chocolate Sharps yet.
Corals aren't fullt explained etc...

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz

How much hog island blood was in the hypo het females?
Bill Kirby

No Hog blood at all