Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Welcome to kingsnake.com's message board system. Here you may share and discuss information with others about your favorite reptile and amphibian related topics such as care and feeding, caging requirements, permits and licenses, and more. Launched in 1997, the kingsnake.com message board system is one of the oldest and largest systems on the internet.

Click for 65% off Shipping with Reptiles 2 You
Southwestern Center for Herpetological Research
Click here to visit Classifieds

OT- Peregrine Falcon on Back Patio

petie11o5 Mar 25, 2009 04:30 PM

So I'm off for spring break this week and as I was walking into our kitchen I noticed a big bird stuck in our screened-in-patio. It turned out to be a Peregrine Falcon which are very rare and supposedly just made it off the endangered species list in 1999 but are still listed as "rare". There was also another smaller bird in our patio that the falcon had caught and eaten. But the falcon had actually gone through the screens and was stuck in the patio. If you didn't know these birds are the fastest in the world and can easily reach speeds of over 100 mph when the "dive-bomb" after their prey. Which explains how it managed to tear through the metal mesh screen. Here are some pics. Sorry about the quality I didn't want to get too close becasue the Falcon was freaking out everytime it saw us.


-----
1.1 BRB
1.0 Pastel Ball Python
0.1 Spider Ball Python

Replies (24)

FRoberts Mar 25, 2009 05:05 PM

very cool, I hope the little guy is ok n/p
-----
Thanks,

Frank Roberts

saagbay Mar 25, 2009 05:07 PM

your right about that the fastest animal on the planet they reach diving speeds up to 200 mph. gorgeous bird, has been my all time favorite animal since i was 12. thats too bad the pictures didnt come out a little more clear
-----
-Stephen-
-Step-
-Steve Lightning-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
1.0 col redtail boa (Switch, formally known as Dixie)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)
0.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Saphira)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--Brazilian rainbow boas
2 or 3 more? maybe a breeding trio or two pair
-- something for the wifey... my list got to big...

Wyvern Mar 25, 2009 05:12 PM

NOT a peregrine. Sorry. Peregrines are NOT that color and they are MUCH bigger.

It's a sharp-shinned hawk.

They hunt small birds with excellence and adore backyard bird feeders as it's like a McDonald's drive through window to them. They are VERY good at taking down birds as large as mourning doves. Because of the high speeds they fly and fighter-jet type turns they make, they are prone to hitting windows and such because they don't always see them being too focused on their prey and fail at crash control measures.

rainbowsrus Mar 25, 2009 05:21 PM

Still pretty cool!!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Wyvern Mar 25, 2009 05:43 PM

>>Still pretty cool!!!
>>-----
>>Thanks,
>>

Yes still very cool. Below is a red-tail hawk I just finished rehabbing that was released this past weekend (after having spent a week of bed rest and good eating (F/T chicks and rats).

This is "Chicken Hawk Fail" - an adult red-tailed hawk weighing in at 1,145 grams (2.5 lbs). His physical size suggests male, but the weight is more like female.

He earned his name because he was injured trying to raid a local commercial chicken farm - got one of his feet badly tangled in the thin plastic netting covering one of the outdoor pens. The netting was so thin, he probably didn't even realize it was there until he hit it. The damage is not too bad (mostly minor abrasions to the leg and foot and a case of severe exhaustion of fighting with the netting all night long).

For a wild hawk he was wonderfully well behaved - much much better behaved than some of our permanently kept raptors. Of course once "vacation-time" was about over he was quick to drive home the point that it was time to leave. My poor hand suffered (even with an eagle-strength gauntlet for protection) after a near full strength "slap-grab" with his talons. I totally feel sorry for any squirrel that gets hit by him at actual full strength.

.

.

.

.

.

.

rainbowsrus Mar 25, 2009 06:00 PM

Way cool, looks ready to rip a chunk out of you if you were to drop your guard for even a second!!
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

rainbowsrus Mar 25, 2009 06:02 PM

My sincere thanks for stepping in and taking care of our wild friends when / as needed!!!

What;s the back story on "failed chicken hawk"? Get caught in a chicken coop by a farmer?
-----
Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count:
26.49 BRB
20.21 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

Wyvern Mar 25, 2009 07:33 PM

>>Way cool, looks ready to rip a chunk out of you if you were to drop your guard for even a second!!

>>My sincere thanks for stepping in and taking care of our wild friends when / as needed!!!
>>
>>What;s the back story on "failed chicken hawk"? Get caught in a chicken coop by a farmer?

Small commercial chicken farmer down the road found him tangled up in one of his movable pens (the kind that can be moved indoors and brought out in good weather). His are built to be lightweight to roll around and don't have tops on them, just a net covering. I'm guessing the farmer is gonna need to find a better quality of "roofing material" LOL. He cut the bird free of the pen and dumped him in a box and brought him to us. Took me about 20 minutes to cut the full tangled mess off from around the hawk's foot.

In the pictures he was just showing off. If he really wanted to take a chunk out of someone he would have attacked the camera that was in his face instead of posing for it LOL. He didn't even try to bait or get away while I was holding him. That first photo the camera was about 10 inches from his face - definitely in easy strike range.

Overall, I think the hawk would have been a good candidate for a hunting bird - he really was that well behaved. Most wild birds have difficulty with sitting a glove that easy right away, being leashed, being messed with generally speaking, etc. - he took it all in stride without a fuss.

With a wild untrained hawk like this one it should have taken two people to get the almeryis and jesses on, but he was such a good boy I could do it one handed while restraining him with the other hand. Not once did he try to attack my bare hand during that process and he could have quite easily. With leash on, he took to the glove like a trained pro.

Early on the hawk's good behavior could be attributed to the exhaustion and such but even after that was essentially taken care of he still was a well behaved bird (or he was just sucking up to keep getting his free chickens for lunch since chickens is what got him in trouble in the first place).

saagbay Mar 25, 2009 06:04 PM

wow thats impressive is that your job or a hobby?

ive allways wanted to get into falconry but never had a good chance where i had the time to devote but ive promised myself many many many times that is one thing i will do
-----
-Stephen-
-Step-
-Steve Lightning-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
1.0 col redtail boa (Switch, formally known as Dixie)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)
0.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Saphira)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--Brazilian rainbow boas
2 or 3 more? maybe a breeding trio or two pair
-- something for the wifey... my list got to big...

Wyvern Mar 25, 2009 07:47 PM

>>wow thats impressive is that your job or a hobby?
>>
>>ive allways wanted to get into falconry but never had a good chance where i had the time to devote but ive promised myself many many many times that is one thing i will do

Mostly it's part of the job. I work at a nature center and we have several hawks and owls and a bald eagle. Sometimes we get birds that eventually are releasable, but mostly birds we get are not releasable and are used for educational programs. We actually had a red-tail that had been deemed unreleasable (due to amputation of two talons on one foot) until a situation occurred about a year later that made us and our vet re-evaluate his condition (he caught a wild chipmunk in his cage as it was zipping through the fence lol). Ultimately we sent him out to a specialized raptor rehab center in another state that worked with him to give their opinion on the matter. They deemed him able to successfully hunt despite his missing talons so he went through special training to re-condition him to be able to hunt and survive again in the wild. Once he finished flight and hunting school, he was brought back here, banded and successfully released last fall at a nearby protected park area.

As for falconry.. that is so not a hobby to take lightly. You have to apprentice for up to two years minimum and the guidelines to follow...whew... and people thought reptile regulations were tough lol. I like what I do.. I get the fun of playing with birds and doing a lot of things falconers do, but none of the pressures or time factors that falconers have to deal with.

saagbay Mar 25, 2009 10:33 PM

As for falconry.. that is so not a hobby to take lightly. You have to apprentice for up to two years minimum and the guidelines to follow

yeah no kidding i did look into it a bit a few years back thats why im thinking not until i have the time to devote to it. like i said its been a dream for me since the 6th grade i think, and now has become more or a "someday" wish... i dont know why but for me there is just something that so awe inspiring about raptor birds... i know im crazy but isnt everyone?
-----
-Stephen-
-Step-
-Steve Lightning-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
1.0 col redtail boa (Switch, formally known as Dixie)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)
0.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Saphira)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--Brazilian rainbow boas
2 or 3 more? maybe a breeding trio or two pair
-- something for the wifey... my list got to big...

petie11o5 Mar 26, 2009 12:54 AM

I think that would be an awesome thing to do also. I would love to someday devote my time to falcons & hawks. They are such neat animals there is just something about them that makes them so cool.
-----
1.1 BRB
1.0 Pastel Ball Python
0.1 Spider Ball Python

gaboonx Mar 26, 2009 07:42 AM

>>>>wow thats impressive is that your job or a hobby?
>>>>
>>>>ive allways wanted to get into falconry but never had a good chance where i had the time to devote but ive promised myself many many many times that is one thing i will do
>>
>>
>>Mostly it's part of the job. I work at a nature center and we have several hawks and owls and a bald eagle. Sometimes we get birds that eventually are releasable, but mostly birds we get are not releasable and are used for educational programs. We actually had a red-tail that had been deemed unreleasable (due to amputation of two talons on one foot) until a situation occurred about a year later that made us and our vet re-evaluate his condition (he caught a wild chipmunk in his cage as it was zipping through the fence lol). Ultimately we sent him out to a specialized raptor rehab center in another state that worked with him to give their opinion on the matter. They deemed him able to successfully hunt despite his missing talons so he went through special training to re-condition him to be able to hunt and survive again in the wild. Once he finished flight and hunting school, he was brought back here, banded and successfully released last fall at a nearby protected park area.
>>
>>
>>As for falconry.. that is so not a hobby to take lightly. You have to apprentice for up to two years minimum and the guidelines to follow...whew... and people thought reptile regulations were tough lol. I like what I do.. I get the fun of playing with birds and doing a lot of things falconers do, but none of the pressures or time factors that falconers have to deal with.

Very neat, birds evolved from Reptiles so it makes sense. I always point that out to my norrow minded snake hating friends .
-----
Jason A.
"Long time Herper, first year Breeder `07."

Jeff Clark Mar 26, 2009 02:32 AM

Sharp Shinned Hawks are common around here. They take a bunch of Doves from around the feeders in the neighborhood. I do not see them making their kills but often find them on the trail in the woods behind my house eating Doves. They seem to almost exclusively eat Doves. They usually leave just the feathers in a perfect round circular pattern where they eat them. The bigger hawks are also common in the neighborhoood and they eat the squirrels. I have seen them make several kills. Last year one of them killed a squirrel in the front yard and sat on top of the mailbox with it. Another squirrel made a run from one tree to another and the hawk killed it and left the dead one on the mailbox. I also see lots of Ospreys and the occasional Bald Eagle in the area. The Eagles take fish from the Ospreys.

>>NOT a peregrine. Sorry. Peregrines are NOT that color and they are MUCH bigger.
>>
>>It's a sharp-shinned hawk.
>>
>>They hunt small birds with excellence and adore backyard bird feeders as it's like a McDonald's drive through window to them. They are VERY good at taking down birds as large as mourning doves. Because of the high speeds they fly and fighter-jet type turns they make, they are prone to hitting windows and such because they don't always see them being too focused on their prey and fail at crash control measures.

saagbay Mar 26, 2009 09:17 AM

that must have been a sight to see!! where i am now there are red tails but also there are some falcons. i was driving home from work one day and could see up ahead a bunch of white fuzzies floating across the street as i got closer i saw a hawk up un a roof plucking a fresh killed pigeon. other that that you dont ever see them but i have found owl pellets while hiking in the foothills
-----
-Stephen-
-Step-
-Steve Lightning-

0.1 soon to be wifey (hopefully)
1.0 rotwiler/chow (Boomer-wifey's pooch)
1.0 norm corn (Jake aka grumpy old terdhead)
1.0 col redtail boa (Switch, formally known as Dixie)
0.1 ball python (Bella- wifey's baby girl)
0.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boa (Saphira)

hopeful for not to distant future:
--Brazilian rainbow boas
2 or 3 more? maybe a breeding trio or two pair
-- something for the wifey... my list got to big...

Wyvern Mar 26, 2009 04:59 PM

>> They seem to almost exclusively eat Doves. They usually leave just the feathers in a perfect round circular pattern where they eat them.

They like the doves because the doves are SLOW compared to other songbirds. Doves also have a hard time trying to change course once they take off making it easier for the sharpie to nail it. The neatest thing in the world is watching a silly sharpie think he's "top gun" enough to catch a gold finch... them little goldies can turn on a dime much better than a sharpie so they tend to outmaneuver the faster moving sharpie. Like watching an air show jet dog-fight on a military base with birds instead of planes.

paulbuck Mar 27, 2009 01:57 AM

I'm fairly certain what we have here is a Cooper's Hawk. Sharpie's have much smaller heads compared to the shoulders. A male Coopers is just about the same size as a big female Sharpie.
Paul

Jeff Clark Mar 28, 2009 08:20 PM

Paul,
...Sharp Shinned and Cooper's hawks seem too similar to me to tell from the PICs. The first PIC does look like it has a bigger head but the other PICs maybe not. I would not bet money either way. They both have big ranges and this time of year are moving back north across most of the country.
Jeff

paulbuck Mar 28, 2009 10:18 PM

Jeff,
They are confusingly similar. I've had both in hand and have spent endless hours trying to identify birds. The clues that have me leaning towards Cooper's are that the original poster thought it was a Peregrine; a big female Cooper's is about the same size. Then the fact this bird blasted through a screen window. I just don't see a sharp-shinned hawk doing that (though again, a big female...). But mainly, the head is just too big for a sharpie in my opinion and the tail looked rounded (this is hard to ascertain with a ruffled bird but a sharpie has a squared off tail).
Really, the only certainty is Accipiter species.
Paul

Wyvern Mar 31, 2009 11:40 AM

>>I'm fairly certain what we have here is a Cooper's Hawk. Sharpie's have much smaller heads compared to the shoulders. A male Coopers is just about the same size as a big female Sharpie.
>>Paul

I took into account for the possibility of it being a Cooper's Hawk, but ultimately rejected the idea.

I know that a male cooper can be of similar size to a female sharpie and I know that both birds have similar color phases to one another.

When you look at the first picture -- it is the best shot of the bird in a natural profile pose compared to the other two photos with the head turned off kilter. My leanings toward it being a sharpie was this:

The legs are thin and yellow color is dull. Coopers have thicker and more noticeably bright yellow chicken legs.

The head is more rounded and short where a cooper's would be a bit flatter and longer.

The beak is short/tucked in looking - not sticking further out like a cooper's.

The tail feathers appear more squared off instead of rounded (a little hard to see because they are splayed out a bit).

The tail feathers are lacking the noticeable white terminal band you would see in a cooper's. The terminal band you see in the photo is dark gray which is what you normally see in a sharpie (occasionally sharpies can have a very thin white tipping below the gray terminal band, but even that is not showing in the photo).

The acrobatic behavior of the bird having flown through a window screen at high speed while chasing a songbird does not match the normal flight behavior of a cooper's, but does match the behavior of a sharpie.

paulbuck Mar 31, 2009 09:58 PM

"I took into account for the possibility of it being a Cooper's Hawk, but ultimately rejected the idea."

Rejected the idea of a Cooper's based on these photo's? The two species are far too similar to reject one over the other. All we can safely do is give an opinion based on experience.

"I know that a male cooper can be of similar size to a female sharpie and I know that both birds have similar color phases to one another."

Correct. When you stated a Peregrine is far larger than the bird pictured you could not have been considering a female Cooper's at all. Instead, I took that as a clue as to what bird this could possibly be (Cooper's).

"When you look at the first picture -- it is the best shot of the bird in a natural profile pose compared to the other two photos with the head turned off kilter. My leanings toward it being a sharpie was this:

The legs are thin and yellow color is dull. Coopers have thicker and more noticeably bright yellow chicken legs."

The legs do not look 'thin' to me at all and the color cannot be ascertained by these poor quality photos.

"The head is more rounded and short where a cooper's would be a bit flatter and longer."

Absolutely opposite of what I'm seeing. The head is far too large to be a Sharpie in my opinion and has that flattish look I see almost daily in the Cooper's that's terrorizing my yard almost daily. I have photos of a Sharpie that crashed into my window that clearly shows the smallish head so indicative of this species.

"The beak is short/tucked in looking - not sticking further out like a cooper's."

This is something I've never noticed before. I've also never seen it mentioned in any of the guides I've seen. However; you've probably had more of these birds in hand as a rehaber than I have so I'll defer on this one. But again, from a poor-quality picture?

"The tail feathers appear more squared off instead of rounded (a little hard to see because they are splayed out a bit)."

Again, I see a long, roundish tail. However, this is a ruffled, upset bird. Can't tell from the photos.

"The tail feathers are lacking the noticeable white terminal band you would see in a cooper's. The terminal band you see in the photo is dark gray which is what you normally see in a sharpie (occasionally sharpies can have a very thin white tipping below the gray terminal band, but even that is not showing in the photo)."

I too don't see the whitish terminal band. But nothing definitive.

"The acrobatic behavior of the bird having flown through a window screen at high speed while chasing a songbird does not match the normal flight behavior of a cooper's, but does match the behavior of a sharpie."

This is incorrect. The normal flight pattern of all the Accipiters is flap, flap, flap....glide. They look awkward when just flying as in migration. However; all Accipiters display the high speed acrobatic behavior you state when chasing down prey. The Cooper's is particularly fast and powerful. The Sharpie is just a light-weight in comparison.

When you corrected the original poster what you should have said was this is an Accipiter species and in your opinion a Sharp-shinned hawk. From the photos and description you cannot tell for certain. This is why I stated it 'probably' was a Cooper's.

Thanks for the discussion. Birds are awesome.
Paul

petie11o5 Mar 25, 2009 05:44 PM

I could have sworn it was a falcon. In person it looked more like one. Oh well, still pretty neat haha
-----
1.1 BRB
1.0 Pastel Ball Python
0.1 Spider Ball Python

Jeff Clark Mar 28, 2009 08:05 PM

No worries. The birds of prey keep me confused. I see a bunch of different ones around here. When I have them about figured out there will be one that is not supposed to be in this part of the country to mess me up even further.

petie11o5 Mar 30, 2009 07:22 PM

Yeah haha they keep me confused also.
-----
1.1 BRB
1.0 Pastel Ball Python
0.1 Spider Ball Python

Site Tools