Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Today, I introduced my smaller/younger BT 'Dozer', to my big male 'Brutus'. I filmed Dozer's first steps and saw, what looks like hemipenes as s/he marked the new territory.
I've seen what a fully developed male Albig's hemipenes looks like and this wasn't it. Soooo, is it the female equivalent, or an underdeveloped male??
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I don't have any experience because neither of my albigs have ever everted anything that I have seen in the last two years. She did show something smaller I think than a full hemipene as I have heard the hemipenes of albigs are very large. And I could see no decorations, could you? Maybe you could try this again and get a better look. It is funny how Brutus did not come down and check it out. From his personality I would have thought he would be going right down there. It WAS his enclosure! Nice enclosure by the way.

[She did show something smaller I think than a full hemipene as I have heard the hemipenes of albigs are very large. And I could see no decorations, could you?]

Yes, an adult male's hemipenes are very large and flowered, as Brutus has everted since he was smaller than Dozer is now and even then, his was more developed than what you see in the vid.

Last year, when I was asking about Brutus everting, I think it was Ed (DRZrider) who said he had a female (species?) who everted long thin tubes, which makes me wonder if this is what we might be seeing with Dozer.

I have some follow up vids of Brutus coming down to investigate.
He gets himself wedged up on that shelf, but he was watching her every move till he had to get a closer look. You can see their very first touch and how carefully he approached her
Talk about fireworks!! Dozer was like greased lightening and he wasn't far behind!
There was no biting or clawing, just him pinning her till she got free and headed for the highest spot!
They both took food from me, after a couple hours rest, but it's far from over.
I'll upload the other vids.)

Ah young love.

Perhaps an experienced albigularis keeper will give an opinion.

I have seen my mature female albig Mama Quah (AKA Old Hissy) one single time display an arrangement looking just like your girl but it was more pointed. It is a puzzlement.

Too bad we can't just shine a brilliant penlight through their tail bases as in the new discovery used for sexing baby varanids.

[I have seen my mature female albig Mama Quah (AKA Old Hissy) one single time display an arrangement looking just like your girl]

This is interesting. Have you ever had eggs from her? Otherwise, are you sure she's female?
Also, if you're sure she is, when you saw her evert, was it over an inch and half long?

Here's the next video of Brutus climbing down to meet Dozer.

That's a pretty impressive set-up you have there! VERY COOL!
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mike Heinrich,
Mike@amazontreeboa.org
www.amazontreeboa.org

No. Never any eggs. Never any signs of being gravid. Head and tail look female, dainty nose and flat ventral tail surface. No mounting of others. Just a real character. Maybe she is an old lady. She came from a "monitor farm".

Brutus really is the most beautiful Albig I have ever seen. Those perfect huge dorsal spots, his masculine conformation. Who bred this animal?

Thanks!) I bought Brutus, thinking he's w/c, but the person I got him from has successfully bred and hatched Albigs in the past. I don't think Brutus was one of his babies, but I'm not sure?
Dan, who owns Tarpit Reptiles in FL, sold him to me last March.

Mike- Thank you!). I'm doing the best I can, but the 'enclosure/room' continues to be a WIP. I'm able to maitain heat well and humidity of 65% and there's always a lot of natural-looking activity, so it seems to be working okay. Time will tell!)

There's a lot more video I have to edit and upload...

Same day, just a little while later..

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>>Same day, just a little while later..
>>
>>.

Says it's a private video viewable by "friends" only. I sent a friends request
My YouTube page

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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mike Heinrich,
Mike@amazontreeboa.org
www.amazontreeboa.org

Sorry about that, it should work now?

That was 5.5ft long and had similar markings (those big well defined white spots) but he had pure black around the spots, no lacey pattern, no brown, gray, etc. He was cool looking, and I think Dan had a male similar to that.
The eversion I saw in the video could be just a partial (didnt evert very far), but the features of the tail say female from what I can see.
A good friend had 2 albigs, a big reddish whitehroat male and what was called a female cape banded whitethroat by a well known reptile business. We introduced them from 4ft away, but my opinion from the beginning was that the cape banded was a male. The cape banded was less than half the size of the big whitethroat, it everted a full flowered hemipene and ran after the bigger whitethroat, at which time we interceded and stopped the cape banded from attacking the much bigger male albig. This very spirited cape banded was sold a few times and originated from FR many years before.
The big male whitethroat would run from Sobek and hide, but the cape banded which was a fraction of her size at the time would walk right up to her, I have a picture of him walking with her once. For his safety he was kept away from her, she tried to kill a few male albigs in the past. Once we got a picture with 3 male albigs and her in the same room, when she turned to look at them all but one ran for it, the one that didnt was another Faust cross, he layed down and closed his eyes (he was deformed and couldnt run away), so I removed him quickly.
Sometimes sexing albigs can be tricky, but in person Ive gotten good at telling them apart, I hate trying from pics or video, sometimes its difficult to see what you want to see, and compare proportions.

I've had to restrain myself several times and let them sort things out, but there does appear to be some acceptance here.
By no means is it over though. This vid was taken yesterday, but there's still chasing and posturing etc' going on this morning.

If I see any biting, I'd have to remove Dozer, but so far, it's just Brutus chasing and pinning her/him?

What I find fascinating is the almost mechanical head and neck movements of Brutus and the sound it makes. I'd love to know if only males do that, because Dozer hasn't, yet.
ps-why am I whistling?.

sdslancs, it looks to me from this vid that Dozer is a female. I see behavior here that is universal female behavior. The ladys know what I mean.

[I see behavior here that is universal female behavior. The ladys know what I mean.]

Do you mean the 'walking all over the male' bit;?)

Must I elaborate? Let females keep their mystery!

No, I mean the way she allowed him to smell her tail but not her head, then ran off but left her tail draped over him, then ran completely off and took a bath (accident THEN CAME BACK. He was so polite the whole time, keeping his head low and nonthreatening, taking it easy, she with the backward glances!

I think if Dozer was a male he would not have come back, but would hide.

LOL- I knew what you meant (sort of), but mmmm, not sure if I totally agree with how females act?? but it's pretty funny.
The other thing being, I know monitors can be 'unusual' when it comes to interacting and breeding activity, so I'm just observing for now!

Females do that to, its a dominance display. Like a hissing, clunky, robot is how Id decribe it. Sobek did this to other albigs she was introduced to, the little cape banded I had did this to much larger males, etc.

Or video of the tail base on Dozer, the entire area from the base at the body from the sides, top, and bottom if possible. Im still not guessing one sex or the other. In the video the very base looks thick and bulging from those angles.
Males mount and dominate females, females dominate males, females dominate females, etc etc etc. Sex isnt determined by dominance behavior.

It will be tricky to impossible for me to get those kind of shots, but I'll see what she'll let me do. Of the two, Brutus will let me 'handle' him much more than Dozer. Big turn around there for some reason?
Perhaps 'cause he's no longer afraid of me in the least, as he now outweighs me

You should have seen my wife the one night, she said "hey, look who I found", it sounded as if she was carrying a large heavy object up the stairs.
She got Sobek out of her cage for the first time in a few years and brought her up for a visit.

Tarpit! That explains it. I am kicking myself all over now because I almost bought this animal!hahahahaha

Hilarious! Yes, you did miss out, but had he gone to you, he would have a wonderful 'outdoor' life!

Right now, he seems to be happy though

What is the appeal to the black throats do they have a unique personality? Alot of them seem to be on the mean side I've noticed. Espeically if you try to pick them up.

Any monitor can be 'mean', if you pick them up. I don't even try, don't need to.

I don't know what the appeal is for other Albig keepers, but for me, I love their shape/size/color/personality/awesomeness etc,etc

Having said that, they're not great 'house' pets. they're much too big and require a room at least, just like any potential, GIANT monitor does.

I was actually thinking of getting one then I came to this forum and saw some of the pictures and I changed my mind mighty quick. I realised how strong and big they get. Also the youtube videos made me think twice. However as far as looks go they are defineatly one of my favorites.

I can't really say since I have only had BT "Old Hissy" for 2 years and her possible mate for 6 months. But yes, they have more personality than any other I keep and I have 4 other species here. They have strong and stalwart personalitys. No monitor likes being picked up and BTs will tell you so. Mama Quah (Old Hissy) can be picked up if one approaches her politely and confidently. Acknowlege her verbally then reach in under her front leg and craddle her chest, then grasp the base of her tail gently and lift. At first I always carried her to more desireable sites such as out in the sun or to a garbage can lid full of food items. Now I can safely get her out of trees or out of the rafters. Since then I have taught her to come when I call her name, snap my fingers and point at the spot I wish her to be. I taught her this by doing that before I fed her and now she comes running. She follows me for food and rubs her mouth on my legs and smells me all over like a dog. She lets me pick old shed off her. You must do things on their terms and always let them be dominant. Then you can start to develop some kind of relationship.

From the loks of his enclosure it looks like he already has anoutdoor life.