Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Does anybody have any pics of a whirlwind/spector, I have searched and searched and can't find anything other than discussions from 2006 about whether or not it is allelic to the yellow belly or not, which I take it isn't. Also I kind of figure that it is a subtle morph, so I was wondering if anybody knew of any indicators that would identify one if I were to buy one so I could be sure (or as sure as possible) of what I was getting.
thanks.

PM anthony james mc he was the second person to produce the superstripe. not sure if he is releasing any though.

Pitoon

I thought the super stripe was a super pastel genetic stripe????? What makes a super stripe???

I'm pretty sure it is a yellow belly x whirlwind/spector

I was under the impression that whirlwind/specter was allelic to the yb. Not sure if anyone can confirm that, but given the way the two alleles react with each other, I'd guess that they are found on the same locus.

yb and specter are allelic and they combine to make superstripe. I picked up a nice ss girl this year, but haven't seen any proven specters available anywhere. From what I've seen, they are very subtle and no two seem to be alike from the ones that I have seen.

I read on a thread somewhere that there is something with there head markings but they didn't get to specific about what it was, do you know anything about that or is that just a myth that someone had posted on that thread.

cant you breed a mystic to a yellowbelly to get superstripes?

Actually the Mystic is a type of Phantom so it has nothing to do with the Super Stripe project .

Whirlwind/Specter refers to the "Mystery" gene that does appear to be an Allele of the Yb gene, this gene lines up with the Yb gene to make the Super Stripe when both genes are present at the same time.

The Genetic Stripe has nothing to do with the Super Stripe , the Super Stripe is a double codom and the Genetic Stripe is a recessive morph.

The Whirlwind/Specter gene really is sort of a Mystery gene in that they do seem to vary alot in looks and until more breeding is done we don't really know why they vary as much as they do! Basically the morph looks like a Fire/Vanilla in that it is a codom hypo , it's just what it does when it reacts with the Yb gene that really makes them so important as on it's own the gene is pretty subtle.

Anthony McCain

Cool. Thanks for the info. I have a lot of questions about them but I won't use up all of the forum space asking them, lol. It really amazes me that to pretty subtle morphs can produce such a cool looking snake. Gotta love genetics.

Do you know if anyone is producing super Whirlwind/Specters yet? Anyone trying at least?

Regards,
Bristen.

>>Actually the Mystic is a type of Phantom so it has nothing to do with the Super Stripe project .
>>
>>Whirlwind/Specter refers to the "Mystery" gene that does appear to be an Allele of the Yb gene, this gene lines up with the Yb gene to make the Super Stripe when both genes are present at the same time.
>>
>>The Genetic Stripe has nothing to do with the Super Stripe , the Super Stripe is a double codom and the Genetic Stripe is a recessive morph.
>>
>>The Whirlwind/Specter gene really is sort of a Mystery gene in that they do seem to vary alot in looks and until more breeding is done we don't really know why they vary as much as they do! Basically the morph looks like a Fire/Vanilla in that it is a codom hypo , it's just what it does when it reacts with the Yb gene that really makes them so important as on it's own the gene is pretty subtle.
>>
>>
>>Anthony McCain
>>
>>
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www.RoyalGemReptiles.com

I'm sure it will be made. When then becomes the question and more importantly will anyone admit they made the Super form when it happens!

Anthony McCain

heres a picture of a spector

That is not all that subtle. Great looking snake. These are in the shadows for sure.

Kinda proved my point about the variability for me with that pic.

Here's the founding mother of my Super Stripe project. Do you think they look alot alike?

Yours looks like an extreme Yb , my original female and some of the offspring from my line look more like odd Fires.

Anthony McCain

yeah there is a huge difference in those two snakes. So I guess if I were going to try to buy one it would be best to find one that was proven to be what it is or that was bred from a super stripe breeding. Has anyone got the homozygous form yet.

I have noticed a huge difference as well between the lines I've looked at there are some with headmarkings that run in the line and others without some with aberrant patterns and others that don't. I am wondering if it has to do with the parents phenotype more than the gene? Anthony you have bred a few of them have you noticed a difference in offspring based on the phenotype of the parents?
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Tosha
JET Pythons
Toshas Blog

Herp Medicine does not equal a bottle of Baytril - Dr. Scott Stahl

As with all subtle codoms I think the 'strength' of the looks of the parents does make it either easier or harder to tell . In other words the more "classic" examples of the morph will and do make it easier to pick out the gene in the offspring it produces. I have a few that are very nice examples and I would expect babies from them to be pretty easy to pick out . On the other hand the less obvious ones may very well make it harder to know for sure what your actually picking out in the offspring. This situation applies to more than just the Super Stripe project , the YB , Mystic, Phantoms, and some of the other subtle morphs will all have some degree of this sort of wide range of variability that will at times make it hard to tell if it's the gene or if it's not. I think the reason may be that the penetrence or strength of the NORMAL gene at times affects the subtle gene more than one may want to admit, even on the codom level. Since some of these genes are subtle it doesn't take much to shift the looks of the morph and unfortunately at times the normal gene present along side the morph gene actually is masking the morph gene somewhat and it pushes the results more toward the NORMAL side and makes it alot harder to know for sure if the subtle gene is there or not, meaning it is the morph gene you want genetically but it doesn't quite look right because of the effects coming from the non morph /Normal side of it's makeup. On paper this may not make much sence to some people but if you hatch out some of this stuff like I have then your eyes can easily see what I'm talking about , there is a spectrum here , you just have to know where the range of the morph is , sometimes you have to raise them up for a year or so , then it's easier to know what you have.

Another problem with the Super Stripe is that you can breed a Super Stripe and produce babies that look like BOTH a YB and a Whirlwind, in otherwords from say the top side it would look like a Whirlwind/Specter/Mystery gene or whatever you want to call this "other" gene BUT from the belly side it looks all wrong for a Mystery carrier and looks more like a YB instead. The problem with that is that the only way you could have both genes in the same snake (if in fact the 2 morphs truely are Alleles) would be if you were looking at an actual Super Stripe. Then the problem then becomes do you have a Yb or do you have the Mystery carrier. In other words a Super Stripe may not be the best way to produce the Mystery snakes , an actual Mystery snake itself that is very obvious may in fact be better to use if your trying to know for sure your not mixing the very similiar YB gene in there as it makes it harder to know what you really made.

I have a couple Pastels here that are sired by the first male Super Stripe to ever reproduce , he's the one I made in 06 and he sired some clutches for me in 07. Those 2 male Pastels may either be really nice Pastel Yb's or they may be Pastel Whirlwinds, BUT until I make an actual Super Stripe or Pastel Super Stripe or at least get very classic Whirlwinds from the clutches I can't say for sure which they are.

As we get deeper into this stuff these are the kinds of problems that will happen even to the best breeders with the best eye for knowing what they are looking at! Keeps it fun I think!

Anthony McCain

Thank you very much Anthony,

your last post has been very explanatory!
We are waiting for your results to know better on this magnificent morph.

Luca