Reptile & Amphibian Forums

What is the best cobra that doesn't get big and has not "deadly" venom to start with?

I'd sugest a false water cobra ,

Naw, to be honest it really doesnt sound like your ready for any elapid, the only cobra i've heard of that isnt always that deadly is a red spitter...

>>>>>>>>I'd sugest a false water cobra ,

Naw, to be honest it really doesnt sound like your ready for any elapid, the only cobra i've heard of that isnt always that deadly is a red spitter...>>>>>>>>>>

Um, a false water cobra is not a starter cobra because it's not a cobra, or even an elapid for that matter. It's a colubrid.

n/p

.

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Aspidelaps doesn't get big. They're also quite cute.

Bad news- they have almost the same venom as Naja does
Good news- they have less of it
Bad news- there's no antivenom

So that's something I wouldn't want to take my chances with.

And from what people here tell me they won't prepare you for a bigger cobra and therefore are not 'starters'.

As i'm sure everyone here will agree the best way to start is to find someone who has one and learn from them!!! Watch how they move and learn the way the snake moves cobras are absolutey facinating how much they pay attention to you and wait for an oppertunity.

Handling cobras is quite a bit differant than handling vipers.
The problem i've run into with aspidelaps(sp) is they don't prepare you for the larger cobras because they don't get big enough to tail.

In my opinion one of the best starters are anyone of the african spitters, reds (n.pallida(sp)) are most likely the least dangerous of the african naja, however they can still cause blindness and severe nicrosis(sp0. But the plus with spitters is they generally prefer to spit rather than bite, a huge plus anyone out there who keeps bandeds or forests will agree. I live in texas and keep about five differant species,black neck, mozembiqua, specticled, forest and banded egyption, so if your interested i'm more than willing to show a few things.

Make sure if you go for one of the spitters you wear eye protection and stay away from the vents on the cage. Beleave me when they say they are acurate up to 8 feet the are not kidding. My black neck is acurate up to abaout 8 or 10 feet at least and never I mean never let your guard down. Oh and buy acurate I mean hit you in your eyes from the ground. not to discorouge youthey are very rewarding snakes to work with just becareful.

best of luck
dave

While it is correct that any snake in the genus Naja can be potentially fatal, some are worse than others. David is correct in saying that most spitters are more inclined to spit than to strike. However, I personally wouldn't agree with him in saying that the African spitters make the best first Naja. In my experience, keeping black necks, mozambiques, sumatrans, and black and whites, I'd say the Asian spitters as a whole make safer captives than the Africans. N. nigricollis can reach lengths of 8' and have massive venom glands capable of producing copious amounts of very nasty venom. Even N. mossambica gets fairly large at around 5' and can spit forever. N. pallida are generally much smaller and I would probably rate them with the Asian spitters as far as safety of keeping. The Asians though, as a whole, tend to be smaller than the Africans and from what I've seen, much less inclined even to spit. N. siamensis for example doesn't grow huge, only around 4', and if acquired as a juvenile generally mellow out quite a bit by the time they reach adulthood. I currently have 4 juvenile siamensis that are already very docile and extremely easy to mess with. Compare those four snakes to my two juvenile nigricollis and it's like night and day. The nigricollis aren't necessarily aggressive, but they compare to the siamensis like racers compare to kingsnakes. They are very fast, very flighty, and as David said, dead-on accurate. Not to mention that the times I've thrown in a live fuzzy mouse to them they've had a kill time that was next to no other elapid I've ever kept (most likely signaling that when biting they tend to inject much more venom than what is needed for subduing prey).

So basically what I'm getting at is all-in-all, any Naja is incredibly dangerous. I personally feel that acquiring a juvenile kaouthia or naja makes the best first true Naja. They often times calm down to the point of "tameness" (but don't be fooled!!) after being raised in captivity. If it's spitters you like, I'd go for either a juvenile pallida, siamensis, sputatrix, or sumatrana (but good luck finding anything but w.c. when it comes to that species). I'd then probably place mossambica next on the list due to the size, as they are basically a "dwarf" nigricollis. I would most certainly save nigricollis for dead last as far as true Naja spitters.

That leads me to my next point. There is another spitter out there that though isn't a true Naja, can certainly help you prepare for one. Rinkhals, though rarely available and often times expensive, tend to make great captives. W.c. or c.b. juveniles raised in captivity, or even w.c. ltc adults often calm down to the point of "corn snake" tame. All the keepers I've spoken with that have maintained this species swear by their usual gentle demeaner. I recently acquired a c.b. sub-adult, and when I first got it the snake was dang near insane. It would hood and fly all over the place inside the cage, spitting and just literally going crazy striking and such. Now, even though she has a hidebox, she never uses and is completely used to my presense. Any time I have to move her to clean her cage she can be more easily hook and tailed than any of the other elapids I keep. And you know how long I've had her? Maybe about a month and a half now. So I can only imagine how she will be in a year or two from now.

Anyway, I hope you've received enough information to make an informed decision. As you can see, certain questions around here tend to set off a frenzy of "you can't do that!!" type responces. Hopefully these responces don't turn people away to just do what they wish without knowing about the animals. However, just as another small bit of advice, be sure that when you ask questions that you pick the wording a little better. Good luck and be safe.
-Chance
River Valley Snakes

The answer to your question. all Cobras should be "considered" deadly. Safety is in the mindset and keeping deadliness in mind might keep you more aware and cautious. I feel the best starter snake is a black racer (a mean one). While it (of course)is not the same thing as a naja. practicing handling techniques with one of them will at least start you thinking in the right direction. Pretend it's a cobra and see how you do without getting bit. As to a real starter, Personlly I keep a shieldnose...Their small and easier to contain. But Nothing can prepare you for a regular Cobra except experience with a responsible teacher.
Frank

I'm curious as to whether your black neck spitting cobra(s) are captive born or imported? I've heard a lot of stories that imports usually come out spitting and basically never stop. However, with captive born, in my experience, they hardly ever spit.

I've raised mine since 2 weeks of age, and it has spit about three times between then and 6 months of age. Now, it's around 3 years old and hasn't spit since. In fact, it's very calm in captivity and on a hook. The only times it has jumped or striked was when it was spooked (walking by its cage while it's resting, etc). It does have a fairly good feeding response when it smells food, but not nearly as bad as the black pakistan cobras I have, which are basically hel| on earth lol.

One reason I believe he doesn't spit (other than the fact that it's cb and has gotten used to me) is that I feed it prekilled food items and don't tease it to make him think it's alive and chase it down and attack it.

I just had a few questions of my own for Reptilez (excuse me for not addressing you properly but I don't have a name to call you). Anyway, how large is your 3 year old nigricollis? I have 1.1 juveniles that were born last summer, which I acquired last Oct or Nov. They were about 13" or so at that time, and since then have reached about 2.5'. They are still very slender-bodied, which is very unlike my amel monocled which has stayed fairly thick bodied. But I'm guessing that's just their physiology, as I have an adult Mozambique that is around 4' and still very slender-bodied (body thickness of about 1.5-2" in diameter, though the head is about 2.5" across!!). Seeing that snake's head size in comparison to its body always amazes me. I've had the opportunity to see one very large nigricollis in person. I didn't really get to see the body very well, but the one thing I did notice was the head. The snake itself was probably about 7' or so in length, but the head was massize, at least 3.5" across. That just amazed but, but I guess it just goes to show why they never run out of venom. I know with that Moz, he can spit for days and never seems to run out. He's a very calm snake once out of the cage, but very defensive and very spitty inside.

Anyway, getting back to the nigricollis, I noticed that when I first got mine they were very inclined to hood and would spit dead-on accurate even as little babies. Now though I'm lucky to see them lazily spread a hood maybe once a month. Also, they've all but stopped spitting completely. Not that I'm complaining mind you, lol, I'd much rather them become quite docile than stay aggressive. Just curious though, did you acquire yours as a baby? If so, did it show fairly slow growth rate like mine sort of are? Also, just as an interesting little story, most experts agree that spitters only use the spitting capabilities as a purely defensive measure. However, I personally witnessed one of my juveniles, back when they were still relatively new and only wanting live hopper mice, actually nail the mouse right in the eyes and THEN go after it and bite it. It could have been a defensive move just in responce to seeing the mouse move and then realize that the mouse was food, however it looked very much like the snake was spitting at the mouse to try and debilitate it.

Oh well, I could go on forever. I find this species an especially fascinating species of Naja. I keep mine in top-opening cages (for obvious reasons) and have as of late had to start thinking of getting taller enclosures as more than once I've had the snake narrowly reflect off the lid as it was closing while flying up trying to get a meal. Good stuff. Anyway, take care, and I look forward to reading your responce.
River Valley Snakes

I actually bought mine from Mitch at diamond. A friend was buying a pair, and I decided to buy one at the same time, kill 2 birds with one stone ya know.

From what I was told, all of the babies were 2 weeks old and had never been fed at that time. None of the 3 hatchlings wanted to eat. One of my friend's spitters actually died from starvation, and his other one I know hung on for about a year, just being a really picky eater, but its skin was all shrivled up from starving itself. I'm not sure if it ever died or started eating right or what.

I, however, got lucky, and tried other food items. Tuna fish in oil, tree frogs, and anoles are what got him to start eating, and once he did, I just scented pinkies a few times with those things, and he's not refused a meal since.

Anyway, mine is about 5ft right now, although it would probably be 6 foot if it got to eat what/when it wanted to, because he's more like a pig than anything, can easily eat 5 or 6 medium rats at one feeding, but I usually only feed him 1 or 2, along with a couple mice every other week or so and maybe some fish between meals.

About the growth rate of these. I think that growing from 13" to 2.5ft in about a years time isn't that bad. I've always been taught that they have the potential to grow to 3ft in the first year, but I think this particular species also has the potential to become severely obese as well.

If you're worried that they're not feeding enough or something, a good rule of thumb is to watch its behavior. If they sorta pace back and forth and/or try to get out of their cage, prying their head against the cage window or door, more than usual, that's a pretty good sign that they need more food.

When I got this one, I was raising a lot of my own mice at the time, and I do remember him taking 11 pinkies at one feeding. He couldn't have been more than 2 or 3 months old back then.

I've worked with several species of cobras, and this is definately the most easy-going species I have worked with.