Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Wow what a ride!And it wasn't fun not by any measure!
Late winter brought a parasite infection that swept through my collection claiming a half dozen of my snakes which were housed separately with the exception of a breeding pair of corns.
Many more were infected rather misteriously with little reason of how it spread.
Treatment included oral antibiotics and doses of panacur. This had some effect but signs of the lung worm and an amobebic infection would return so treatment was stepped up to panacur dosed with antibiotic doses given by injection.
Panacur doses were given to all other but the most fragile spieces of snakes I have regardless of signs of illness. (shotgun dosing as it were) This finally seems to have whipped it as vigor and appetite have returned with stool samples that finally look heathy.

But all the while how was it introduced and how did it spread? I've always been a clean freak with my practices but I scrub the thawing tub after very feeding now instead of just rinsing and drying. The cleaning sponge for the bowls is now suspect even though it was soaped up. It now gets sanitized with a little bleach.
The tanks get scrubed with an mild ammonia solution and the branches or wood they may have get scrubed and heated.
Yes, while the wood is wet the small pieces get heated in the microwave, the larger ones go in the oven to steam off. While this may seem excessive, its worked to prevent reinfection

Ok how did I get it into the collection? It came after a newly purchased asian rat snake was added...but the fisrt to show signs before I understood what was going on was a male corn.
Thinking back, several months back this corn was fed two baby chicks (farm chickens)that weren't frozen thawed. Could the parasites have been in the poultrys gut then taken time to reach a point where it grew in the snakes system. Its kind of frustrating not knowing for sure. Damn sure that anything else aquired will be panacured and quarentined for weeks before being introduced into the reptile room. All feeder mice will be frozen thawed too.
Mike.

That sucks. But at least you caught it and it sounds like you're out of the woods. Yeah, I guess you never will know for sure where it came from. What were the symptoms? Regurgitation? I guess you are lucky it wasn't crypto. Good luck.

think of alot of things....

hands
flies
fruit flies
scuttle flies
mites
friends hands and clothes..
new snake
chicks

any and all can help infections and parasites spread....
sucks....I hate all types of flies.....

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Mike Hi, The symptoms included regurgitation , loose stool, lethargy, loss of appetite, wheezing/respitory infection caused by the lung worms, and the most frustrating one of all sudden death when there was no apparent symptom. My last loss of a beautiful male gray band went that way. Fine one day to find it dead with its mouth agape the next. Its symptoms must have been very subtle. Otherwise everything else went quick after I saw that there was a problem. I mean it only took days!

JYohe, you may have hit on something here that I discounted.
"flies
fruit flies
scuttle flies
....I hate all types of flies....."

Ya, damn, I do have those little flies that seek out the snakes stool. Do you really think they'd carry the parasitic infection?
They could, couldn't they? I just saw them as annoying.
Ok, I've been scooping out the waste when I find it not letting it remain in the tank and I also take a quantity of the bedding around the stool when I do just in case.

So how do I get rid of the flies from the room? Incidentally its screened to keep them out, well that was the intent anyway and as it was recently built and painted its pretty close to sterile yet theres still those little flies.
They look like small fruit flies. What are they?

You've got me a bit fired up thinking that you've discovered the link. So again what do I do hang fly tape? Will that give off chemicals that would harm the snakes? Venis fly trap???
Hey, this one may be it! I'm open to suggestions.
Mike.

wow. that's quite a list of symptoms and for them to go downhill so fast too. Sucks. Sorry to hear about that.

As for the flies, it sounds logical that they could transmit a bacteria or virus. but I doubt they would have anything to do with the lungworms. I'm not sure what the lifecyle of a lungworm is but I would assume the eggs/larvae would have to be ingested by the snake so the most likely candidate there would be food source.

But for bacteria or viruses, I would think that the flies could transmit that from one snake's stool to the water or food of other snakes.

Keep doing what you're doing. Sounds like you are on the right track.

First and foremost - sorry for the event...
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2nd - I have the utmost respect for veternary science and research, but I'm afraid I've embraced a shotgun regimen for newly acquired animals, at least with Fenbendazole (panacur).
.
3rd - "So how do I get rid of the flies from the room?"
I haven't seen any studies, but the fact that "lung Worms" (Strongyloides)have used other type flies to migrate to mammals seems suspect.
Here in the southeast, "scuttle flies" seem more common. Two things that have worked well for me are:
1. Using perlite instead of sphagnum moss for egg incubation.
2. Good old fashion fly paper from a farm, feed and seed store. (This seems less risky than insecticides!
Good luck with your battle.. We're all pulling for you.
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Regards, Bill McGighan

Mike, Bill, thank you very much for your input.
There will be a fly tape hanging by the rooms light within the hour. I did pay a visit to a vet with my ailing blue beauty
("pay" being the word because I did plenty of that)
Though she was the clinics "reptile expert" she bounced a lot of reptile related questions off of me and made a lot of thumbing through a reptile vet manual. After the brutality of my checking account was done I did walk away with a dosage of oral antibiotic. A fecal sample taken (which cost $100, way too much)verified lung worms so panacur was given with a rather cautious dose reconmendation. It all worked but proved to be not aggressive enough as milder symptoms persisted.
I ordered a copy of "understanding reptile parasites" writen by Robert Klingenberg from the bean farm. The best money I've spent by far! Seriously, I credit this book with saving my collection!!! I followed what I read and it was more imforative than my local vet. If you don't have this book get it now BEFORE you have a problem!
Bill, I now wholey agree that shotgun dosing with panacur is a must. So thanks again for your advice and I'm off to kill flies!
Mike.

hang tapes

proventamite all new cleaned cages or racks

fruit flies you kill with a deli-cup with one hole in top and vinegar in it(I use apple cider)

clean fecal out alot and quickly

anything you can do to kill them off.....

(and they'll still come back....)....aaaaah

I got all of them, and they are a pain , and I do believe they carry the problems around the room (as will mites)....

....they come through screens...........

scuttle flies..........aaaargh,.........
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Ever see a fly trap called "big stinky"? Its used around farms all season to control flies. I guess thats what I'll have to do with your trap tip(which is a good one thanks)leave it up from now on to keep them in check. I also have a couple of antique glass fly traps that I'll put to use.
I have been removing the waste when I find it but the little flies are always there first.
Today I dug out two fly tapes and hung them up. Printed on the side was "no vapors or poisons". That made me feel better about using them.
I hung one under the lamp and its claiming victoms as I write. Oh, I also think the brand name is appropriate too..."Revenge"!
Mike.

When I went down to the snake room today I was hit with that somethings dead smell. OH COME ON!
Checking all found that they were ok but there were big flies buzzing around the room, another bad sign. (never mind how the heck they got in???)
Turning to the utility area tucked under the stairs gave me my answer...the freezer door had popped open.
The thick frost that had built up over time saved what was in the back but I had to toss what was up front. What was on the door was indiscribable.><
I used my temp gun to verify that what I saved was cold enough. I lost $$$ on feeder mice but its still better than finding a dead snake.
I'm going to install a hasp on the door but if I'd found the chest freezer I really wanted this would have never occured.
Mike.

Wow, Mike,
If it weren't for bad luck, you'd have no luck at all!!!!
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Regards, Bill McGighan

Wow, Mike,
If it weren't for bad luck, you'd have no luck at all!!!!
.
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Regards, Bill McGighan

I'll get past this Bill. Refuse to give in and I've stepped up my care. Everything is responding well. The fly tapes are working very well in collecting the tiny fruit flies. I'm determined to cut the link with anything being transfered from tank to tank. All of the fecal matter passed now is looking good (well as good as Cr*p can ha ha)nothing is runny and for the third feeding cycle too. I'm cautiously feeling postitive.
Mike.