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Arm yourself when in the field

Brad Alexander Jun 30, 2009 10:12 AM

The need for digital recorders is more apparent then ever before. Please make a full court press with all your herping buddies to shell out some cash for one. I've had one on me for the last 3 or 4 years while in the field but have only used it 2 or 3 times for LE stops. I tell you, it makes a huge difference in their immediate demeanor. In one situation, I didn't start the recorder until he, Border Patrol, was already being a jerk. After starting it up and informing him I was recording and that I would need his full name, his attitude made a 180 degree change. The other stop I recall was with a Game Warden in Texas. This guy was cool anyway, so it didn't much matter. Nevertheless, I told him right up front that I was going to be recording to protect us both. He was fine with the recorder (not much they can do about it anyway) and the 'stop' continued and ended just as it should have.

I typically fail to ask for a name and even when I do get it, I typically forget writing it down once I have it. However, my future encounters will be given more attention and I'll be sure to get names and exactly who they are working for.

I've had a suggestion to actually spring somewhat of a trap on these guys by not even informing them that I'm recording. This would allow them to be themselves and maybe catching some of their attitude on the recorder. One of my buddies had some serious harassment recently. He was given a heck of rash for being from CA and was even told he was going to jail. Personally, I don't have much of an interest for springing such a trap and would just as soon disarm the LE attitude (if there was to be any) by informing them I have the recorder. That way, you move through the steps of the stop quickly and without incident. Some people enjoy confrontation, but I don't, so I doubt I'll be trying any recorder traps. HOWEVER, if someone decides to do something like that, and you do catch someone being a jerk, then sending out copies to their local newspapers as well as to their captains might be interesting.

When being stopped, be sure to get their reason for stopping you. If they give you a line about your license plate lights were too dim (common excuse), ask to get out of the car, then check them out yourself. Once you check them out make note, in front of LE, regarding your license plate lights working properly.

Be respectful! I don't advocate taking any junk off these guys, but that doesn't mean you need to throw some jabs either. Regardless of what you think of them, they still have a job to do. Sure, some (very few) may have a half cocked attitude and hate you regardless, but they still have a tough job as LE and we need to give them at least some latitude. The whole problem with LE and herpers is that we are automatically viewed as being poachers, when I would bet the vast majority of us are not. They already think we are bad guys, so being respectful and knowing your rights will help to change this attitude in the long run.

DO NOT allow them to search your vehicle. Under most situations, they have no right to search. In a worse case scenario where they think they have the right and will do it anyway, tell them you are not giving them permission but you can't stop them either and make sure you have that recorded. They are not your buddies and the only reason they want to search your vehicle is so they can find something to screw you with. My suggestion is not to give them any ammo at all. You never know these days what very basic thing that you thought was no big deal can get you in trouble. There is no reason to put yourself in harms way.

I did not use my recorder on several of my stops now, including the last two in Texas. Out of all my stops, which are piling up in numbers now, I've only had 2 that I felt were negative. The last two in Texas were fairly benign. The first one was with DPS and this guy was very nice and just doing his job. The second one for the trip was from the Constable, Charles Jenkins. It was brief, but filled with an attitude of disgust for herpers. Still, no harm was done. Regardless of outcome, I should have had the recorder ready to rock and roll for both stops, shame on me. I felt no pressure so I didn't get it out.

So please, arm yourselves with a recorder. These guys have a job to do and should be allowed to do it. But there is no reason for us to be harassed and using a recorder will go a LONG way to correcting any possible problems.

Good luck and be safe.
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Brad Alexander

fullsp.com

Replies (9)

havasubassmaster Jun 30, 2009 04:53 PM

I dont get it? stopped for road cruising?.and if not doing anything wrong why get stoped so much?..

Brad Alexander Jun 30, 2009 05:19 PM

Getting stopped while road cruising for herps is common in some areas. Also, it should probably be expected. However, the line is crossed once in a while and the desire to nail someone outways our constitional rights. This is when things get ugly and fortunately, it doesn't happen very often. However, I do know of several people, including myself, that have been harassed or detained for much longer then they should have. These guys have a job to do and we need to respect that. But they also need to know that in the vast majority of cases, we are good guys spending our vacation time and money to enjoy our hobby. In that, they should also understand and respect the fact that they are slowing us down from enjoying our vacation, and thus, should simply do their jobs and move on. All that I am advocating is that we be prepared by having a digital voice recorder on hand to document the stop.
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Brad Alexander

fullsp.com

havasubassmaster Jun 30, 2009 06:58 PM

oh damn....wasnt aware of that...I have yet to be stoped but that sucks that its an issue for some

markg Jul 01, 2009 12:03 PM

Where you are is likely not a "sensitive" area or especially well-known popular herping spot.

But if and when you do get stopped, remember Brad's post. You won't believe what a few of these officers will say to you (although, nothing bad ever happened to me, the prevailing attitiude is often that herpers are out to remove every reptile from the wild.)
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Mark

emysbreeder Jul 09, 2009 04:45 AM

In Florida something I found helpfull when leaving your car on the side of the road to collect is to leave a note on the windshield "snake collecting"no firearms.I guess now days you could leave your cell phone #.Dont call it snake "hunting" people will think "guns".Back in the 70's outside of Gainsville near UF the land owners always thought we were hippies looking for "roons" because they carried bags too.But whipping out a pissed Black racer or a ratteling bag would convince them,and they would say "take all you want".Durring the late 80's someone was starting fires in the pine forest durring a bad drout.Once out of nowhere a State Trooper appeared.Lucky for me I had all ready caught something and he let me go.I had to empty my pockets,again lucky for me I had no lighter or matches.He saw my truck from the expressway and walked quite some distance to find me.Then there was that day I found the Pot plants,but thats a story for another forum!I just find snakes on my own land now. Vic

antelope Jun 30, 2009 07:45 PM

I totally agree Brad, with protecting yourself and not adding fuel to a potential fire.
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Todd Hughes

wolfpackh Jul 01, 2009 12:29 PM

In southern Texas getting stopped can be expected. With illegal alien trafficking, narcotics trafficking, and all that jazz, cruising slow and stopping often draws attention. I have been stopped a couple times down there and the BP and local police were never rude to me. They had bigger fish to fry I suppose. It is illegal to herp highways in TX, correct? Side roads are fair game though so far as I know. I'd rather run into crabby cops than some of the backward hicks I have had to deal with.
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2 tham radix
1 Chicago Tham s. semifasciatus
2 elaphe vulpina
1 gray tiger salamander
4 Aphonopelma hentzi
1 G rosea
1 Haplo minax
1 Brachy angustum
1 Brachy sabulosum
1 Brachy vagans
1 Cent. hentzi scorp

jpenney Jul 01, 2009 05:49 PM

>> It is illegal to herp highways in TX, correct? Side roads are fair game though so far as I know. I'd rather run into crabby cops than some of the backward hicks I have had to deal with.
>>-----
Correct. Actually ALL public roads are currently off limits including the most secluded dirt road you can find as long as public funds are used to maintain it (city, county, state or federal).
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HCU
Snakes of Hudspeth County, Texas

Brad Alexander Jul 02, 2009 09:20 PM

Nobody is arguing your points. I still say it is best to be prepared in case you get that bad apple out of the group that will find some sort of offense regardless.
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Brad Alexander

fullsp.com

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