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Just took her to the vet today for a necropsy. Turns out she had some sulfur buildup in her liver. I told the vet that I just moved about 6 months ago and now I have well water. He said some well water has sulfur in it and I should start buying distilled water or boil my own.

Needless to say, I emptied EVERY water dish and there is water boiling on the stove now. I'm glad I know what it was now and can prevent that from happening to any of my others. Does anyone else have to boil their water?
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Rachel Squier
"The more we live by our intellect, the less we understand the meaning of life." -Leo Tolstoy

Well that sux but atleast you know now. I give all my Boas bottled water. You can go to a water store and get filtered drinking water for like 20-25 cents a gallon and depending on how many you have that should last a while. Glad you figured that out before anything else bad happend.

Sorry to hear about the loss of your girl.
Our local tap water isn't the best.
We have reverse osmosis for drinking/cooking water. We also give it to all of our pets (mammals/reptiles).

I glad that you found out what it was, but I don't think that boiling your water is going to remove the sulfur from it. I am no water quality expert, but boiling water is usually done when there are concerns about bacteria in the water. Sulfur is an element, seems to me that if you boil your water, your just gonna have hot sulfur water.
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Alex Tower
Serpentine Selections

I just looked it up to be safe. You're right and the vet was wrong. Boiling it will not remove the sulfur. Thank you for pointing that out. Now to empty the water dishes again and run to the store, lol...
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Rachel Squier
"The more we live by our intellect, the less we understand the meaning of life." -Leo Tolstoy

Umm...how did your vet not know that? You may consider looking for another herp vet. Seems like pretty basic stuff that a veterinarian should know. Just my opinion. It'd definitely make me a bit wary...

agreed. That's not even vet specific, that's basic science stuff. If anything boiling water tends to increase the density of elements in it (unless they have a really low boiling point) since you boil off mostly the water, leaving everything else. That'd make me leery of the vet.

Alex is right, sulfur is not removable by boiling the water!

In some area, tap water has fairly high level of contraceptives, too. It comes from human sources (females' urine) and there is no mechanism used that would filter out these chemicals. In some places, if a woman would drink 1 litter tap water a day, there would be no need for extra contraceptive pills anymore, because water contains enough of it. I don't know if these human contraceptives have any effects on reproduction of boas (they could have, as they are hormones), but I definetly prefer to use bottled water for my boas, especially for females during the breeding season.

All the best,
Adam
Boaconstrictor.hu

I started my boas on filtered water that I purchased from Wmart. Then I went to tap water (we have our own well) and they all started running off. Since then I have always used filtered water from the Wmart. My tap water is hard and has a lot of minerals in it, so I was just too worried about it. This is interesting and I'm glad you posted although I'm very, very sorry to hear about your loss. I was thinking of going back to well/tap water.

I'm curious how any Veterinarian can determine a toxic level of sulfur on visual necropsy of a snake that died days ago. Aren't toxicology tests performed for that sort of diagnosis? We still haven't seen Michael's results....how did your Vet perform that so quickly I'm wondering? IMO, that is a blanket statement to say results are inconclusive. Can anyone explain that to me?

Depending on the veterinarian a person can expect a some differences in the timing of the results as well as the how many "extra" procedures are included in a fairly open, blanket procedure such as a necropsy.

The office's distance from and relation to the testing site that is employed can influence the amount of time it takes to receive results from any ordered tests.

Also, not every veterinarian's office is equipped with the same type of equipment (the relative age of the equipment and, thus, the types of tests and diagnosis that can be done in house, also varies). Some vets may include certain "non-standard" tests as part of necropsy for various reasons. The fact that April's vet seemed to zero in on a liver problem related to the consumption of well water may not be a "blanket diagnosis" or any other type of coincidence, the chances are that this vet knows the types of problems that have been reported, discovered and previously diagnosed in the area and has decided that to save his clients (as well as his office) some time and money he has taken on the task of including some of these tests as part of the routine set of procedures to include in the necropsy.

Call a vet in six different parts of the country and you will receive six different answers about what is all included in the price of some fairly standard procedures - not to mention six widely ranging prices.
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Stay United!

"...I say 'apparently' because despite all our progress she is not at all a tame or handle-able snake and gettting her from that cage would re-start a war.. and we've had a good armistice for several months now."-Gus Rentfro - I love this quote!

Lots for me to ponder.

I watched him do the necropsy and you could actually see the sulfur in her liver. It looked like little hairlike fibers of sulfur all over her liver...
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Rachel Squier
"The more we live by our intellect, the less we understand the meaning of life." -Leo Tolstoy

...I think I called you April in my post. I had just finished reading one of April's posts right before I responded to this... I always mess up names... which is bad because it's one of my pet peeves!

Again, sorry about the mix up and even more sorry for your loss. I am glad to hear that you brought her to the vet to find out what went wrong. People complain about there not being many "good" herp vets, but they forget about the laws of "Supply and Demand". If more herp keepers brought their animals in to the vet for regular check ups they would create the demand that would not allow for a more public acceptance of their animals but would also force more vets to seek out additional training to be able to treat these animals.

I went off on a little rant their, but as a vet student (and eventually, hopefully, one of those mythical "Good Herp Vets" I have to defend the profession when the chance arises.
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Stay United!

"...I say 'apparently' because despite all our progress she is not at all a tame or handle-able snake and gettting her from that cage would re-start a war.. and we've had a good armistice for several months now."-Gus Rentfro - I love this quote!

i have been in emergency/critical care veterinary medicine for over 12 years now, and i have never heard of a diagnosis of hepatic sulfur toxicity in any animal, done only through a non-pathologist vet. to the best of my understanding, sulfur is basically identified by a certain power (cant think of what it is at the moment) and then dipped in water, and you see what almost looks like very little mini pieces of lava looking particles, and thats the sulfur. now, that being said, we dont deal much with well water here in my neck of the woods, so i have no knowledge that well water contains sulfur matter.
seems like a very tough diagnosis for a (what we call in the veterinary world) regular daytime veterinarian, to make. seems like something a board certified pathologist would be needed for.
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>>seems like a very tough diagnosis for a (what we call in the veterinary world) regular daytime veterinarian, to make. seems like something a board certified pathologist would be needed for.
>>

Just what I was thinking. A CSI Miami-like diagnosis (unless the subject of sulpher content in water is well-known in those areas that use well water.)
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Mark

Rachel.
I wish I had started the previous reply with I am sorry for your loss. I certainly didn't mean to come across uncaring in any way. I am sorry for your loss. Mostly, I am curious about your situation and use well water for the drinking sources of many mammals I take care of and do understand that different locations would have vast differences in water quality. It just seems that if a source of drinking water has a high content of a chemical that could be a potential hazard to health all sorts of warnings would be in effect by the health departments of that specific region and measures would be taken to alleviate the potential risks on state, county, and city levels. Some species would be more likely to be affected than others....my guess is that amphibians and birds would be high on the list. I question the diagnosis due to the speed in which it was arrived at and the lack of previous symptoms that might indicate an underlying condition to accelerate the situation that ultimately caused the sudden death. Never have I heard of such a thing....which in no way indicates that it isn't possible.

Linda

It is possible, but highly unlikely, that sulfur toxicity caused the death of this boa. Sulfur in the diets of small animals is not considered a problem when it comes from the drinking water. Well water is many times associated with higher levels of sulfur, but it is in the form of sulfates and not elemental sulfur. The one major symptom of excess sulfur in the diet is diarrhea. If this snake was ingesting toxic levels of sulfates, it would have been experiencing serious diarrhea. Sulfate toxicity is almost unheard of from well water because the levels in solution never get high enough to be a serious problem, additionally, if sulfur compounds were in high concentrations, it would have given the water a definite sulfur odor. The U.S. drinking water standard limit for sulfates is 250 mg/l, and some third world country residents have used well water at 3,000 mg/l for drinking with no problems. With the unusual appearance of the liver, was this boa ever exposed to any toxic chemicals or pesticides over the last year or so?

Kelly

Thanks to everyone for your concerns and comments. I did watch the vet perform the necropsy and when he got to the liver, you could see golden hairlike fibers all over her liver. He said that was sulfur and since I don't know anything about it, I believed him. Now, I wish I would have taken the body back home for pictures but at the time I believed the vet and didn't even think about it.

As far as I know, she was not exposed to any pesticides or chemicals. Like I said, I have moved within the past 6 months and now have well water. There is an industrial park nearby and some people think it may affect the water, but I myself usually drink 1/2 gallon of it every day. I assumed that if I could drink that much with no problems, it would be fine for them too.

The only other change I can think of is I bought new cages recently. I got them from a couple of different places, but she was staying in a new boaphile. I really doubt it came from the cages, I'm just trying to think of anything that has changed recently.
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Rachel Squier
"The more we live by our intellect, the less we understand the meaning of life." -Leo Tolstoy

I'm not qualified but understand some simple areas of medicine.
You describe "Golden Strands"
To me this sounds more like a fatty Liver (steatorrhoeic hepatosis ) problem possibly.
Fatty liver is usuually more internal to the organ I think so IDK ...
I find it hard to believe a diagnosis was made upon visual inspection.
A Hepatic pathology would certainly be required as
well as further tissue Pathology.

If a build up of sulfur affects an animal to this degree (Death)
These high levels of sulfur must have a detrimental
affect on your health as well

I remember my uncle in N.IL. had very high levels
of sulfur in the well water.
You could poor a glass of tap water and it would be entirely cloudy with bubbles.
The bubbles of sulfur would raise to the surface and dissipate into the atmosphere.
You could smell the sulfur I don't believe any other gas was present in large quantity PPM.
If you put a card or something over the top of the glass .
The Sulfur gas would collect there.
You could then light a match and remove the card and
ignite the gas big flash

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz
Boas By Klevitz