Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I've always been interested in pits and I was wondering which pits have the best temperments for firts time pit owners and which species/subspecies get the largest/smallest? Thanks for the info!

First rule in keeping Pits: There is an exception to every rule. So in general terms, a Pit in a cage that is too warm is a cranky, temperamental Pit. Cage too cool = lethargy, poor feeding, etc.

Second rule in keeping Pits: Opinions vary widely on the various types (bull, gopher, pine)and morphs (normal or typical vs. albino, "designer", etc.) and are subject to equal variation in personal preference, bias, etc.

Within optimal temperature ranges (low to mid 80s day, mid to upper 70s night), bulls are regarded as having the most "personality" (attitude, temperament, etc.)and attaining the largest size. The Pacific Slope gophers are regarded (generally) as having lesser degrees of temperament than bulls. Within the Pacific Slope group (Cape, Mid-Baja, San Diego and Pacific), the San Diego's are known for being very attractive, relatively easy keepers. They are also among the smallest (generally). Capes are arguably the most colorful but are not the ideal beginner's Pit (juveniles known for more nervous temperament, generally).

The other two interior gophersnakes (Sonoran and Great Basin) are also fairly easy keepers of good to moderate temperament but they can trend to larger sizes.

Then there are the pines (I reveal my personal preference towards gophersnakes). Pines are wonderful, visually striking (appealing) easy keepers (generally) in many ways but they are known for larger size. Temperament also varies but can be moderated with temperature and some handling.

It all comes down to what appeals to you most, how much space you have, budget, etc., etc.

Thanks for the great info, I was looking for something with a decent temperment because I understand how pits can be a "little" cranky. Also I was looking for something with larger six=ze because i work ainly with corns and balls and other similar small snakes so I'd like something a bit bigger. So I'm guessing my best bet would be the two interior gophersnakes (Sonoran and Great Basin)and maybe the Pines. If you don't mind me asking what is the adverage lengths for Sonoran and Great Basin Gophers?

Sonoran's are capable of reaching sizes up to about seven feet but five to six feet is more average. Depends somewhat on genetic background but also on how well you feed them.

I suspect that the same is true for Great Basin's. With proper feed, bulls can routinely reach seven feet but temperament may be a little on the testy side. Proper temps and some handling may prevent some of the latter.

i am a new pit keeper,i have a bull,and a northern pine,bull is a little feisty,but he never bites.pine is just the coolest snake ever,i have never seen such inquisitive behavior from a snake,and just as docile as the come....

Great questions, and kudos for doing research before you jump inot a committment. I've never yet had the pleasure of keeping Pines or Bulls. My 3 Pits (2 SD Gophers & 1 Great Basin) are all WC. You can't go wrong w/ Great Basins.
Every Sonoran I've encountered. I've got several friends that keep them, and say that they are great snakes, butdefinitely have an attitude.

reako45

My L.A. Co. great Basin

Remembered seeing this discussion over on FHF regarding size of Pacific Slope and Great Basin Gophers. The genetics for large size are obviously within many wild populations. Sadly, many adults never live long enough to achieve super size status. Any population anywhere near a road or any developed area...

http://www.fieldherpforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=23142&hilit=large great basin gophersnakes

Really nice deserticola there Darren! Looks pretty big also??? Any more pics?

I need to take some more pics of these guys. My 2 SD's are both spastic when handled, but my GB is the closest thing to "tame" a snake can get.

reako45

Do your SDGs feed well compared to your GBG or vice versa? Any issues otherwise? I ask this as I am about three weeks away from getting two SDGs myself. Thanks.

Mine are both WC. They eat like hogs.

rako45

Thanks!

Looks like I'll be the first to cast a vote for Northern Pines as an excellent pit for a first time pit keeper. They are laid back and handle very well in that they like to move slowly and deliberately. While they may hiss when prodded or provoked, they rarely strike or bite. They do very well in your average air-conditioned room. Feed them and they will grow. The pic is of my 8.5 foot puppy dog tame male.

Looks like I'll be the first to cast a vote for Northern Pines as an excellent pit for a first time pit keeper.

I'll be the second. Northerns are awesome for all the reasons that Steve lists above...I only have two but they definitely are both deliberate/predictable in their movement. I can't say the same for the bulls and gophers in my collection.
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/scott

You pine looks amazing, I love the contrast of the northerns. When you say they can live in your adverage air conditioned room do you mean thy don't need a heat source, that just confused me a bit? Also I personally like how big and bulky they are for a colubrid. Thanks I'll take all this into consoderation and thanks for the info!

I knew this was coming! lol! I have a KY northern from our breeding project that will flat out tear your face off if given the chance. She is a three year old CB animal.I have handled roughly 5,000 snakes in the past decade in the wild here in KY and handled countless CB animals of various species during this time and countless of each before this when I was foolish enough to not take notes. I have yet to see any snake anywhere that brings it like she does each and every time. By contrast, I have a KY northern that we collected that is completely calm by comparison. Go figure!

For what its worth all of the Jersey pines that I kept in the past were very laid back. Of course someone else's experience may be different.

Phil

Wow, that is some monster! Got any pics with people for size comparison? I'd love to see that.

I've only been keeping as an adult for about 2 1/2 years so can't speak with the authority of some. That said, I suspect a lot of the temperment issues may have to do with how the snakes are handled, treated etc. Surely some snakes are just gonna be nervous and aggressive but I wonder if in some cases they have not been handled carefully to minimize stress and maximize trust. I always avoid any forceful handling or restraint and never tease my animals. So far, I've been fortunate that all my animals are very relaxed and generally easy to handle.

Curiously, my calmest pit (pic posted below under "Pine Box" started out as cujo. She must have had really rough handling during shipment. When I took her out of the box and put her in her enclosure she kept hissing for half an hour even with a cover over the glass! It took about three or four weeks till she calmed down.

As for Bulls, the only ones I have are 2 yearling Stillwater Hypos...they are calm to the point of seeming kind of dumb and extremely easy to handle. They are serious feeders though and not at all languid. I guess that line-breeding has had some play in their personality.

My two cents worth........I just got a pair of Bulls about 4or 5 months back. One was 2008 and the other was a large 2007. Anyways they were calm and relaxed and have remained that way. I have yet to be struck at or really even hissed. I have also have black pines in the past and out of the 3 I had two that were ok and one was completely insane. Hope this helps

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-Robert

"The difference between 'involvement' and 'commitment' is like an egg-and-ham breakfast: the chicken was 'involved' - the pig was 'committed'."

1.0 Albino Argentina Horned "Pacman" Frog
0.1 Pyxie/African Bull frog
1.1 Albino and Snow Bullsnakes

Here's some good info for all three:

The Pituophis Page

I've got southerns and sonoran gophers, and they can all be testy at times, but that's what makes them such interesting captives!

//Todd

My six pituophis are all youngsters, so how big they will get is an unknown at this time, but at the rate they eat, I am expecting some humongous specimens in the future.

Their temperament is calm, although one of the Pacific gopher females and one of the female bulls are a bit shy and will sometimes buzz their tails at me. I handle my snakes every day to teach them I am not a threat. Even the shy ones are easy to pick up, and nobody has ever tried to bite me.

My little wc Gomez; she was trapped under a piece pf plywood with a hungry cat sitting on top. This photo was taken just a few days after I brought her home in April. She is a very calm little Pacific. Needless to say, she will no longer fit in that small cup!

My personal faves in pits are bulls ( normals, morphs ) and northern pines. You can't go wrong!! Pits in general seem to be much more curious about their surroundings, and to me, seem to " think " more than other snakes I own, so to say. In other words, they seem to be more aware about their surroundings.

Regarding temperment, here are my thoughts. Before I started getting pits, I had always heard about how loud they can be. After I started getting them, I found out, thru my experience, that some keepers keep them warmer than other keepers, such as myself. Friends of mine that kept theirs warmer seemed to have ones that would hiss, vs. most of mine. Could be mine were held more, and could have been temp. differences. The ones being kept warmest may be prone to acting up and hissing, etc., IMO.
I keep all of mine anywhere from 77-80, depending on what type of pit, and all of mine are pretty much dog tame. I have an Applegate San Diego gopher that is somewhat jumpy, but is taming down with frequent handling.

I have noticed when the warmer my room gets, even by a few degrees, my pits seem to be cruising their cages more, and do not seem as " chilled out " as they are with the temps I normally keep them in. Could their be a connection? I think so, but it is just my opinion. Steve G.'s post regarding keeping northerns are more of a room temp I highly agree with.

So, in all, their temperment may vary, but overall, I truly believe that they are the ultimate pet snakes to have, and I really think you will richly enjoy owning some!!
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Genesis 1:1

My vote is for the B&W Northern Pine. The northerns I have had have never given me any problems. I would recommend them to anyone looking for a snake that gets a moderate size. They look intimidating but are always tame.
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2.4 Black Pines
.1 Albino Northen Pine
1.1 Northern Pines
1.2 Red Bulls
1. Hypo Bull
1.1 D. Deppei

That is a *stunning* northern...I've never seen one like that before. Wow.

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/scott

Seriously---- what an awesome snake.

n/p

my stillwater hypo bulls are 6ft gentle giants and are as easy to handle as any of my gentlest cornsnakes, oh forgot to mention they also look good too.LOL
greg c
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My own Stillwaters are the most laid-back Pits I've ever owned. Never a hiss or even more than a lazy tongue-flick when picked up!

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Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

The Avalanche has already started-it is too late for the pebbles to vote....

I'm new to pits....and had mine b4 i checked out the site....and never knew they were suppose to be tempermental until i started reading on here....mine is still young i guess....only a little over 3ft....but he is as tame as a puppy...and seems to really enjoy being handled....the only time he rattles his tail or anything is when i feed him and then lift the lid on his feeder tank....so i wait till he has had time to settle down from feeding and he gives me no problems at all....Pits are geat!!!!....(mine is a bull)

i've never been around ny pines or gopher snakes