Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I just got some 09 Ltt's in today. Here are some pics.

Female

Female

Female

Male

Male.

Does this last male look like he is having shed or dehydration problems?

Those are NICE!! and yes, that last one looks like it is having both. hard to tell the shimmer could be from the flash, but definately a lil on the dehydrated side.

Thanks, I am siked! Is there anyone who can suggest some remedies for this last snake?

The 3rd female is gorgeous! She almost has a solid collar, similar
to a Coastal Milk. None of them have the typical Y neck pattern of
L.t.t. I would put the last male in a container with a damp paper towel overnight, and then make sure he has access to fresh drinking water until he sheds. I have had snakes that have had horrible sheds, due to lack of proper husbandry, go right into another shed, and recover. Dehydration leads to bad sheds, so in a way, they are one in the same.
-Phil
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Work is the curse of
the drinking class!

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The freshwater is ALWAYS available but i changed out the substrate to damp paper towel. I will monitor the situation closely now.

Keep us posted on her condition. We like to hear success storys. Im sure she will be just fine but its always nice to know.

Interesting thread that I thought that I would comment on since I live in York County, PA. I have caught and raised many Eastern Milks from York County over my forty plus years in the hobby. One thing that I've found to be very interesting about this locality is the comment that Phil referred to regarding the neck pattern. There is a particular locality that I have hunted since I was a kid that produces, what appears to be intergrade Easterns with the neck band that resembles syspila. Chris Jones has some good photos of York County stock on his web site for King of Kings Reptiles.
Also of interest regarding this population is the color. The colors on SOME of the York County triangulum range from blood red to light orange. There are others that I've found that exhibit your typical light brown coloration. In fact, there are two spots that I've seen triangulum at that produce totally different appearing snakes. These spots are about a ten minute drive away from each other.
The population that I refer to that produces the nicely colored triangulum also tend to start on rodents without a problem, particularly the hatchlings. I've heard that other locales of Eastern Milks can be very difficult to get to feed on rodents.
One year back in the late 80's, I hatched out a clutch of Eastern Milks from a wild caught female and took the babies out to release them. I also had a litter of newborn Eastern Garters and had them in the same container. By the time that I arrived at the spot to release the snakes, several of the Eastern Milks had eaten the baby garters. Just an observation of interest. Seems that nature provides baby garters in abundance at the time when the Eastern Milks have hatched out and are ready to feed.
When I was a kid I would catch Eastern Milks every year. They were never really abundant so they were pretty much the "catch of the summer". I didn't appreciate them then like I do now. And I also don't see them as often as I used to either.
Another spot that I saw Easterns was in a wall bordering a road right in front of the house I lived at until my mid 20's. I used to find sheds in the wall in the spring and never really realized what they were until I was older. Then I searched the wall in the spring and was finding them in my back yard. That wall is long gone as the new owners tore down the wall. A shame, as that population produced some really oustanding Easterns.
So, the old adage pretty well applies to the snakes you see around your area. You never really know what you have till it's gone. It seems that that scenario plays itself over and over with the continued encroachment of people into the country.

You are right that all the habitat is being destroyed at an alarming rate. Phil and I are actually putting some boards out today at a location near my home where I have found some outstanding LTT. Just two days ago I notice that dreaded sign in front of the field which stated there was a public meeting to discuss the new construction for that property. Hopefully we can at least get next spring before it is gone and move the boards to another location. Another thing I like about LTT is how varied they can be from one locale to the next. I too really like the ones that have a collar or ring instead of the traditional "y" pattern. Most of the LTT found in my county are very pretty and now becoming very scarce. There just is not a lot of habitat left for them to thrive and it's getting worse every day.

These two were found at the same spot so they can vary even at the same location.Your collar patern Ltt proves that.

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Doug L

I will keep you posted on that male. I also noticed the lack of the y patterns. My cumberland county, NY group seems to have them but not these York, PA's.

The 3rd female is my favorite. I have a male NY i would likt to bred with her. The offspring would not be local specific. Is that a big no no?

Here is the pair.

PA Female

NY Male

Sexy couple ay!

Its in the worst shape, keep it moist but not wet til it sheds then dont offer any water for 2-3 days to get it past the blister shed cycle. Its going to be the best looking of the bunch as a adult. PA milks, like alot of gentilis and some reds, dirty up as adults. Not many clean ones. They are obviously WC though, and I approve of some WCs, just dont keep everything you find or can buy cheap. Too often when you buy something cheap you dont put the time and effort into the same snake you paid alot of $$ for. Please post a pic of that last one when it sheds out, you know how I like being right,lmao!

These were sold to me as captive bred. They came with a receipt so i can permit them here in NJ.

I will not give up on him, thats not an option. What about feeding during this process?

Mike

Those snakes are captive bred babies from adults I collected.

Mike, I didn't note that one's issue and I apologize. If it doesn't make it I will make it right. I have a few more and they're all eating now.

Jeff, I know you didn't mean anything by your comment and I also know you know better than anyone what a WC snake looks like so I won't bash too hard

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Chris Jones
King of Kings Reptiles

http://www.kingofkingsreptiles.com/

"All the fancy names in the world will be of no help if you do not know the difference between chocolate pudding and pig poop." -Frank Retes

No problem Chris,

I did not notice either until I took the photos. I will see if he pulls threw. I will do whatever i need to to make that happen.

Should food be offered during this process?

Mike

I wouldn't worry about food yet...the above advice was correct. He's probably a little dehydrated. Delicup w water, wait till he plumps back out and then feed him.
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Chris Jones
King of Kings Reptiles

http://www.kingofkingsreptiles.com/

"All the fancy names in the world will be of no help if you do not know the difference between chocolate pudding and pig poop." -Frank Retes

Gone. Well i just got home from a little hillbilly vacation in upstate NY for a couple days. Shotin' guns and ridin' quads, that kinda stuff. While i was gone the wife had her family over and they always are into the snake collection. Well i went to feed everyone tonight and i found 1 Ltt missing. And it was the dehydrated one. I am not a happy camper. The kids and I did a full out search but nothing. I will keep water out for a couple of days but we have many holes for it to get into the walls or floor. 2 of our rooms are under construction. So any tricks or tips on getting him to show himself would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Mike

Hopefully they weren't housed together.
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Joe

No way!

...get a delicup and cut a small hole in the center of the lid (not too big). Put one small live pink (as well as some of the pine bedding for scent) in the cup and then close the lid. Place the delicup where you suspect the snake got out and say a little prayer.

I hope you get him back, man.

Chris
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Chris Jones
King of Kings Reptiles

http://www.kingofkingsreptiles.com/

"All the fancy names in the world will be of no help if you do not know the difference between chocolate pudding and pig poop." -Frank Retes

That sounds like a good one. I have had a few suggestions and i will try them all.

Mike

Three other things you can try as well. If you don't mind a bunch of powder dust, if you have hard floors in the immediate area, you can sprinkle fine baking flour all around the perimeter along the baseboards to see the small crawling tracks it leaves when on the move.

Another is to get the sticky rodent traps and set a few along the edges of things around walls, etc...These traps are EXTREMELY sticky, and it will stick the snake to it BIG-TIME, but just ooze some vegetable oil, or mineral oil on it and the trap to loosen it, and gently pull and massage the oil where it sticks to the snake. Then just put some fine dust all over any remaining on the snake, and it will shed it off completely when it sheds next.

Another is sort of like another that was suggested. Cut around the top part of a plastic 2 litre coke/pepsi container where it flairs out and becomes wider towards the top, then flip it around and push it back together, and tape it if needed. Now you have something resembling a big funnel for the snake to crawl into if you put a fuzzy inside. This makes it very easy for the snake to get funneled into it because of the wide part becoming much narrower. Then they have a very difficult time getting back out, sort of like a crab or lobster trap.

good luck!, ~Doug
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"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

.they are from PA.......
.......LOL................

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CJ has a great collection of beautiful animals and his cages are immaculate! He's as straight forward and honest as they come and I know and will vouch on the history of these milks.
No offense JS but MAYBE you can't tell cb from wc.......just maybe!

-stretchx

Ah!,...but maybe they were bought from a 40 or 50 mile radius of the original breeder..LOL!

~Doug
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"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

I too quickly noted the dehydration on the last milk, as its a typical sign of blister from a wc snake(which are commonly found this time of year). I have been reassured from Chris exactly what it is and will take a voluntary sebatical from the forum as penance. I meant no ill will, ever have one of those days you throw something at the ground and miss? That's been my week. Sorry.

.now see.....my thoughts are that bad skin would be a clue of captive ...as wild snakes are usually in good form and all....
....but I never see them this time of year...actually I never get out much for anything....but anyways..........

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And the caption should read. "Your gonna do what, like hell you are!" LOL!!!!
-Phil
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Work is the curse of
the drinking class!

yea...like anyone can tell a wild baby from a captive baby....

....if that would be the case......the only clue would be the crappy skin......?

cannot tell the difference...cannot tell the age by size...

....just a fact...not bustin anyone's "pants" here...

(you know the S pants)...

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