Reptile & Amphibian Forums

We were given a King Snake a week ago. Excited to have a new fascinating "pet" - We want/need to know more. We have gone to the three pet stores in our area to find out any and all information about our King Snake named Domino. All three gave us different "opinions". The first told us to use sand - so we purchased sand - now today petsmart said NO WAY - NO sand!!! We decided to go to Hastings to purchase books to read tonight - NOT ONE single book to help us. Our snake is probably 1.5 to 2 years old - Domino is about 36 inches long. She (?) has been in a 10 gal terrarium and it is WAY too small.

I need any and all information - I have been told to feed one medium mouse a week - to feeding every other week - to 2 every other week. (she has always been fed frozen/thawed)- We want to do what is right and best. The previous owner has always fed 2 medium mice every THREE weeks - I just could NOT believe that could be right.

We are not stupid we just do not know and desparately want to know best.

We are looking at 55 gal habitat so Domino will have plenty of room - she is EXTREMELY active. We want to know if we should go this big - or should we go smaller? Is longer better or taller so she can go up branches?

Sorry for the book - the lady at Hastings said this is by best source of info.

Joe & Zita

We were given a King Snake a week ago. Excited to have a new fascinating "pet" - We want/need to know more. We have gone to the three pet stores in our area to find out any and all information about our King Snake named Domino. All three gave us different "opinions". The first told us to use sand - so we purchased sand - now today petsmart said NO WAY - NO sand!!! We decided to go to Hastings to purchase books to read tonight - NOT ONE single book to help us. Our snake is probably 1.5 to 2 years old - Domino is about 36 inches long. She (?) has been in a 10 gal terrarium and it is WAY too small.

Sorry for the book - the lady at Hastings said this is by best source of info.

1) don't use sand
2)don't use a feeding schedule . instead feed your snake as much as it will eat. Underfeeding and puttimng a kingsnake on a feeding schedule is the #1 moistake people make with snakes. listen to what the snake wants and not what you have heard or what you think it needs.
3)get an undertank heat source if you havn't already (overhead heating like a light bulb is not advised.
4)snakes are fossorial most of the time. So too large and enloser might make your snake feel insecure even if it has a hide spot.

5) give your snake CHOICES in heat and humidity. Snake are always seeking the perfect temps and humidity. Forcing a snake into a set temp is not advised . For instance if your snake eat it will sit on the wrm side to dgest. After it is finished digesting it will go to the cool side to conserve enerygy until it feeds again. By limiting the snake with to lareg a cage it can make the wrong choises because it feels to open and or does not choose its preferred temperature.

There is a ton more to add but i will let others fill in the gaps for you.

When you get a chance post a pic of your snake!

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www.Bluerosy.com

"They that can give up essential liberty, to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty or safety." -Benjamin Franklin

will post picture as soon as I learn how.... lol

which type of kingsnake is he? Do you have any photos?
There's like 8 or 9 subspecies of Lampropeltis getula (common king) recognized at any given moment.

As for me, I've never liked sand on most animals...cypress mulch, some people use aspen...or newspaper.
Common kingsnake subspecies in the pet trade:

California king
Florida/brooks king
Mexican black king
speckled kings
desert kings

Scroll down a bit to see what people are talking about with feeding...it's been a hot topic on the forum recently. The thread i started titled "talk about a feeding response" has a lot of discussion in it about feeding.

http://exoticpets.about.com/cs/snakes/a/kingmilksnakes_2.htm
surprisingly decent care sheet...not advanced but should get you started.
I'm newish to kings--I used to keep three (Cal king, florida and mexican black), years ago, and just got back into them in the last few months.

try using a 20 long tank, or maybe a 40 breeder. Sounds like it's been underfed so it may grow some, hence the possibility of a larger cage. Basic steps--place about 2-4" of shredded cypress in there as a substrate, slap an undertank heater on 1/2-1/3 of the tank (warm end should get mid 80s for most kings) and place some cork bark flats or tubes in there for it to hide on.
Give it a water bowl (I like basic ceramic bowls). Kings aren't terribly arboreal but of the three I used to have, both the cal king and florida king would climb some given the chance. The mexican black never seemed to. So some climby stuff might be good.

My cal king used to be in a really big display tank--it was wonderful and I really regret getting rid of him and the tank. 55 gallon with a chunk of lava rock, some sansiveria and a mid sized jade, it was awesome. Impractical if you have more than one or two snakes to manage--it was pricey and time consuming to set up, but for one snake it might be neat to try something like that after you get the basics down

Thank you all for the information. I have been reading many websites but taking what multiple say. I will get this sand out tomorrow morning as soon as a store open to replace. I have started a spiral notebook and will read previous forums to learn more. Any and all info. will help. Thanks again - Joe & Z

I house all of my kingsnakes in their own 20 gal long cages, and have never found they needed anything larger. For hiding places, don't be doped in to buying a special over priced cave at the shop, a 4-5" azalea clay flower pot from the hardware store with part of it knocked out with a hammer for an opening works great. Here the snake can hide in it and use it to shed its skin on- they are also very easy to clean. To make the door, fill the pot with a large towel, to absorb shocks, and gently tap with the hammer till you get the desired opening, if it breaks, simply glue it back together with crazy glue and let it dry out for half a day to get ride of any harmful fumes, and your good to go. For bedding, I use newspaper for small snakes, and cypress mulch- again from the hardware store for 3$ for a 2 cubic foot bag. for a water bowl, a good stable dog bowl works fine. Below is one of my habitats for one of my Cal kings. In that pic i had a light on top but it is not needed. The bark hiding places were given to me so I used them in that cage. YOU DON'T have to spend a lot of money for a nice looking set up- just as long as you do what others have said on here- give the snake what IT wants- not what you might want it to want, and you'll be fine.

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1.0 Boa- Hogg Island
0.1 Bull- Northern
1.0 Bull- TX Red
0.1 Bull- KS Yellow
1.1 Bulls- Red X Yellow
1.0 Bull- Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
1.0 Corn Snake (Okeetee?)
1.1 Fox Snakes- Western
1.1 Kings- Black Easterns (L.g.nigra) Todd Co. KY
1.2 Kings- Coastal CA
1.1 Kings- NC Eastern Chains (M from Union Co. & F from Mecklenburg Co.)
1.1 Kings- Gray Banded 'Blair's'
1.1 Kings- Speckled, Harris Co. TX
1.1 Pines- Carolina Northerns (M from NC, F from SC)
1.1 Pines- Louisiana (pure descendants of Terry Vandeventer stock)
1.1 Pythons- Ball
1.1 Ratsnakes- Black, Henderson Co. NC

cypress mulch- again from the hardware store for 3$ for a 2 cubic foot bag

Just curious. I have been using pine shavings for decades. Has anyone encountered mites or other bugs in the cypress mulch affecting their snakes?
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www.Bluerosy.com

"They that can give up essential liberty, to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty or safety." -Benjamin Franklin

nope. Once in a while I find a bag that has mold in it, and then I have to chunk most of the bag, but that's it. And once in a great while there's roly-polys.

I can't use aspen up here just cause I can't get any sort of humidity with it; Amarillo is bone dry (average % humidity is in the teens I think) and cypress works better with humidity than aspen does.

Awesome on the mulch - I did read that on one site last night - it said to freeze the mulch for 48 hours before use to kill anything in it. Thanks for the tips too. ( how do I attach a pic?)

I've never really frozen it--I don't want to put mulch in my freezer. Ew. I do rinse it off though. Seems to work all right *shrug*

I don't do ANYTHING TO IT AT ALL. Just put it in the tank, taking out the really big pieces and have had NO problems. I like it because when snakes poop, I can just scope the area out like kitty litter, and I'm done. It looks great and you cant beat the prices. Last time I saw some cypress in a T- Rex bag all fancied up for 12$ !!!- at Pet Fart, course it was graded and smaller but damn those companies really sucker in the newbies to buying it! You cant beat two fiddy at the box stores!
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1.0 Boa- Hogg Island
0.1 Bull- Northern
1.0 Bull- TX Red
0.1 Bull- KS Yellow
1.1 Bulls- Red X Yellow
1.0 Bull- Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
1.0 Corn Snake (Okeetee?)
1.1 Fox Snakes- Western
1.1 Kings- Black Easterns (L.g.nigra) Todd Co. KY
1.2 Kings- Coastal CA
1.1 Kings- NC Eastern Chains (M from Union Co. & F from Mecklenburg Co.)
1.1 Kings- Gray Banded 'Blair's'
1.1 Kings- Speckled, Harris Co. TX
1.1 Pines- Carolina Northerns (M from NC, F from SC)
1.1 Pines- Louisiana (pure descendants of Terry Vandeventer stock)
1.1 Pythons- Ball
1.1 Ratsnakes- Black, Henderson Co. NC

Unless it's been heat-treated for pet use and is just the type of mulch that's out in the garden area of stores, or out in a pile somewhere, I've seen all SORTS of bugs crawling around in the stuff, they really love the moisture it contains from sitting around outside.

I'm not sure if there's too many bugs that would affect the actual snakes themselves too much( of course every batch is different), but I wouldn't want all the bugs crawling around in my house or garage either, who the heck knows what type of weird bugs are in some of that stuff..LOL!

I used to use garden mulch years ago for some Mandarin Ratsnakes I had, but I also suspended some pieces "No-pest" strip(diclorvos) above it before hand to kill any bugs/mites that might be in it. After that, it worked real well.

~Doug
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"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open mouth and remove any doubt!"

I always just crack a big flowerpot in two--viola, 2 nice tight hides

Oh I do that also, it works great! For my larger Bulls and Pines however, they need something like an 8" azalea!
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1.0 Boa- Hogg Island
0.1 Bull- Northern
1.0 Bull- TX Red
0.1 Bull- KS Yellow
1.1 Bulls- Red X Yellow
1.0 Bull- Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
1.0 Corn Snake (Okeetee?)
1.1 Fox Snakes- Western
1.1 Kings- Black Easterns (L.g.nigra) Todd Co. KY
1.2 Kings- Coastal CA
1.1 Kings- NC Eastern Chains (M from Union Co. & F from Mecklenburg Co.)
1.1 Kings- Gray Banded 'Blair's'
1.1 Kings- Speckled, Harris Co. TX
1.1 Pines- Carolina Northerns (M from NC, F from SC)
1.1 Pines- Louisiana (pure descendants of Terry Vandeventer stock)
1.1 Pythons- Ball
1.1 Ratsnakes- Black, Henderson Co. NC

Hey Joe & Zita,

congratz on your new pet. Snakes are very beautiful and wonderful pets. I've learned a lot from just reading through this forum - even those threads where there may seem to be some 'arguing' back and forth, just read through and digest what you can.
If would be good to know what kind of kingsnake you have, as some grow larger than others - and that would determine what you may need for future growth. Bluerosy is right on when he says feed it what it wants. I've seen so many posts on here about people saying there snake would bite, or be aggressive. With kingsnakes in captivity that is usually (always an exception) caused by underfeeding. And underfeeding is often associated with folks who put their snakes on a feeding schedule. Forget the schedule. Once you get to know your snake you will know when it is hungry. And please feed it more than one mouse at a time!
I would suggest you keep a record of when it eat, poops, and sheds. This will help you in the long run. Even snakes in a climate controlled environment will go through periods that mimic what they would go through in the wild. For example - my Florida kingsnake feeds like there is no tomorrow for three to four months in the summer, then stops about this time of year. Getting familiar with it's pattern of activity will calm you when the behavior returns the following year.
Again, read through pages of this forum, glean what you can, and enjoy!
Ray.

Ray - I have taken a picture of my snake and for the life of me cannot get the URL to paste at the bottom - (just thought I was computer savy) - so you are telling me to feed more than one. I will keep a record as you stated. I look at the pictures of snakes and mine it all white with black circles - don't laugh but it is the CalKing - but what more can it be? I am laughing at myself now... I will learn to post a pic so ya can help me out on what kind. I am absorbing in info like a sponge and I love it.

Not a great picture but I took a quick snapshot just to try to post one.
Joe & Z

Domino looks thin. Feed him/her(?) two to three mice at a time and then feed again after the lump dissapears for a day.
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www.Bluerosy.com

"They that can give up essential liberty, to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty or safety." -Benjamin Franklin

california kingsnake then Tiny little thing for that age. Get some meat on his bones

Certainly feed more than one mouse, and if it will eat more than two, feed more than two! The myth of "one mouse a week" has caused many an underfed snake. If it's eating frozen/thawed, then buy them in bulk and it's much cheaper. Then you can just experiment with two or three and see what it will eat at one feeding. I have a California Kingsnake and it always eats two or three mice. Now, my Florida kingsnake is another thing altogether! He will eat four, five or six small rats! He's a garbage gut!

Keep absorbing!

Nice Desert phase Cal, but please get him out of that sand! It can only get inside him and build up. check out the recommendations already posted to your question on this thread. You got a great subspecies to start out with.
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1.0 Boa- Hogg Island
0.1 Bull- Northern
1.0 Bull- TX Red
0.1 Bull- KS Yellow
1.1 Bulls- Red X Yellow
1.0 Bull- Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
1.0 Corn Snake (Okeetee?)
1.1 Fox Snakes- Western
1.1 Kings- Black Easterns (L.g.nigra) Todd Co. KY
1.2 Kings- Coastal CA
1.1 Kings- NC Eastern Chains (M from Union Co. & F from Mecklenburg Co.)
1.1 Kings- Gray Banded 'Blair's'
1.1 Kings- Speckled, Harris Co. TX
1.1 Pines- Carolina Northerns (M from NC, F from SC)
1.1 Pines- Louisiana (pure descendants of Terry Vandeventer stock)
1.1 Pythons- Ball
1.1 Ratsnakes- Black, Henderson Co. NC

also don't overfeed. Many breeders "push" their snakes with feeding for maximum size in the minimum amount of time to grow up babies quicker to breed. Snakes are like any animal and being obese will shorten its life expectancy. Captive snakes arent hunting are moving about as much as in the wild, so are expending less energy. I agree it should be fed well. You certainly dont want a thin snake which shows any signs of emaciation like a prominent backbone or compressed sides/tail. But you dont want a sumo cal king either!!! If your snake appears underweight, put it on an accelerated schedule to get it up to speed. Then monitor carefully to make sure it doesnt get too fat. I feed my adult corns one to two appropriate sized prey item a week. The breeding females will get fed every four to five days prior to brumation to add weight for breeding season, during breeding season, and after egglaying to put weight back on. Other than that, everything gets fed once a week. However, the various common kings do appear able to eat more without appearing overfed!!

Please post more pictures when you get his terrarium all "fixed". We'd love to see that.

By the way, even if your petstore/bookstore doesn't have any kingsnake books, you could always try amazon or something online; you can usually pick up good pet books on there for just a couple bucks. Try to find ones that have recently been published though, you don't want one from the 90's that says you should use a heat rock, lol! In case nobody has mentioned it, you should probably also have a thermostat to plug your UTH into. They make fairly inexpensive ones to use with the UTH's. I like being able to adjust mine according to what my digital thermometer says.

I personally use aspen in with my snakes; I had a bad time with cypress once and choose not to use it again.

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Holly

1.0 Florida Kingsnake (Eddie Gein)
0.1 Lavender California Kingsnake (Belle Gunness)
1.0 Bearded Dragon (Charley Manson)
1.0 Fire Skink (Peter Dinsdale)
1.0 Vietnamese Golden Gecko (George Chapman)
0.0.1 Blue Day Gecko (Joe Ball)
1.0 Orange Marmalade Cat (Oliver)
1.0 Black Cat (Shadowfax)
1.0 Tennessee Walking Horse (Durango)

2.0 Toddlers (Justice & Trevor)