Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Not sure if you've gotten my email yet so I thought I'd post it here..could be of benefit to more people this way. I was successful in buying Cipro in Mexico this week. A "solution" form which is a bottle of Cipro in granulated form showing a concentration of 250mg/ml (came w/another bottle of solution to mix it with for human usage) and 500mg pills. I've had a bit of regurge rear its ugly head w/2 of my Emeralds (after 5 mos. of solid feeding) so I want to put them on a Cipro regimen. How do I dose them w/these forms? I'd prefer to start w/the granulated form diluted w/sterile water. Knowing how to use the pills later if needed would be a big help!

Thanks,

Bill

n/p

Why don't you just ask the Mexicans? Flame away for this response; I don't know you or your background, but since it's brought to the forum so everyone can learn, I figured I might as well show my disdain at someone going around his federal prescription laws to play vet for himself.

Ian

Hmm, there are so many ways I can respond to this. Basically, you're right, you don't know me and I found your response to be very arrogant and condescending. I have read a mulitude of your responses and see that the gist of most of your advice is to "call a vet". After coming on 30 years in this "hobby" I'd like to think I've learned, through trial and error as well as successes and failures, just a few things about many aspects of caring for my animals.

This "hobby" was around loong before internet care-sheets made herpetocultural "experts" overnight.

Just because I don't feel compelled to chime in on each and every
posting does not mean I don't know what I'm doing. I can only glean by your comment about circumventing my vet by going to Mexico to save money on the meds I know will alleviate my particular situation I'm somehow doing somethin wrong? Your logic totally escapes me. Guess this is a perfect example of why so many who could really contribute stay down.

Bill

BTW, just to enlighten others, Cipro does not require a prescription in Mexico, it is sold in the std. pharmacies, not the veterinary pharmacias where Baytril is sold. Along w/my "contraband Flagyl" I promptly declared my purchases to the US official at the re-entry point.

So, its ok to pay the mark-up from vendors who regularly sell Albon, Flagyl and liquid Panacure on this site?

Love to type more but I have to go circumcise my Loxocemus.

Bill

Sometimes the best advice is to direct people to those that can help better. I don't see how I can be at fault for that.

I see your 30 years, and expected it. I've got 20 of my own, so I wouldn't exactly be the overnight internet expert that you might be assuming. Further, my years have been full of aggressive pursuit of knowledge; an AHT diploma, herp conferences, and herp vet med continueing education. I"m not the best at what I do, but visiting this forum once or twice a week to see if I can help out isn't a waste of time IMO.

Now don't get me wrong, I respect my elders. No doubt you've kept and bred more species than I. Certainly you've done it for longer. But what gets me is the extent certain people go to save a few dollars. Maybe you're not the best example, because it sounds like the border isn't much of a leap for you; but I"ll take my turn at sarcasm once in a while.

Maybe you can set me straight, but it seems that the longer you've been in this hobby (I'm applying a stereotype to you), the harder it is for you to pursue and accept proffesional help. I mean, the biggest vet haters I know are the oldtimers. Surely you've noticed some positive developements in that area in the last 30years? Have you gained so much expertise in your 30 years that you can diagnose and treat your animals, yet you havn't so much as a reptile formulary in your library to look up a cipro dose?

I too could write more, but await your response in this slightly amusing discussion.

Ian

Ian, I definitely respect your knowledge on the subject and I know you have a fair amount of training and schooling in this area of study. You have given very good advice on this forum and helped numerous people with their questions. I would however take issue with the comment you made that “the biggest vet haters I know are the oldtimers.” I know numerous reptile hobbyists that have been around as long as I have that routinely seek out the advice of vets. I have been keeping snakes, mostly boids, since the early 1970’s and still to this day will consult with vets on occasion. Most of my initial contacts were in the early 1980’s with Frye and Richard Ross. I still believe to this day that Dr. Ross was one of the most knowledgeable people ever on antibiotic treatment in reptiles and with other various aspects of pathogen control and treatment in captive reptiles. I spoke with him numerous times throughout the 1980’s and early 1990’s, and learned considerably from his consultations. I have a strong science background in biology and chemistry, worked in a laboratory for many years, and have followed the practice of antimicrobial therapy in reptiles for about 30 years. However, I am still no expert in the area and continue to read journals and textbooks on the subject, and also still consult with vets when needed as I stated above.

I think one big area of misunderstanding is that surrounding the issue of contacting a vet with reptile experience. They are truly more difficult to find than you might think, especially for an office visit. This is especially true once you get away from the larger cities in this country. I live in a town with a population of 125,000 and there are only two vets here that have any knowledge or experience whatsoever in treating reptiles. Most other places in this State are not even this fortunate. It just becomes really difficult for some people to contact experienced vets for their reptiles. Not that this is an excuse, but it is a factor that needs to be taken into consideration. I think this is a lot of the reason that people come to this forum hoping to gain a little extra advice. I think I have always made it clear that self administration of drugs to reptiles is inherently risky, and it is always best to consult with a vet if possible.

One further comment, and one that did surprise me not too long ago, was related to one of your other comments on the legal acquisition of prescription drugs. Apparently, in the not too distant past, there were some vet drugs that were de-regulated and can now be purchased over the counter without a prescription. The two that really surprised me are fenbendazole (Panacur), and praziquantel (Droncit). Not sure when this took place, but I was really surprised to see them on the shelf.

Thanks again for your posts and agree that this is a very interesting topic of discussion.

Kelly

I will never be too "smart" so as to think I know every thing..hence my initial conversations w/Kelly regarding Albon over a year ago! I do have a mental block when it comes to converting metric volumes/weights, etc.,just ask my kids! This is exactly why I solicited Kelly's help..I identified a person whom I feel is more knowedgeable than I and asked for help. I have visited vets in my area in the past...Baytril seems to be the panacea for all that ails them!

I am not anti-vet, just don't have much confidence in the ones I've been steered to in the past.

Ian, you passed judgement on me in a public forum w/out knowing anything about me, but that is your right and I respect that. I had no idea the innocent solicitation of assistance would spark your ire. I read many posts and generate opinions therefrom, I just keep them to myself. If you glean some amount of amusement on my behalf so be it.

Bill, you are right. I indeed judged you by a single post, of which parts irked me the wrong way. While I knew this was only a superficial image of you, you could not have known what I was thinking by what I was typing.

Kelly, wow, those are some grand vets to have had aquaintances with.

Ian

Thanks Ian! I did forget to mention that I do have 2 separate formularies...I really do struggle w/metric conversions..if only they published them in cc/oz I'd be set!
Bill