Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Are you doing your part to protect the right to keep herps?

This past year has been hard on our industry. From one battle to the next we're inundated with requests to speak out against proposed legislation. HR 669 wore us out, but the fight goes on – this week, we need to start another wave of grassroots action against a proposed ban.

On November 5 there will be a hearing before the House Judiciary Committee, Sub Committee for Crime, Terrorism and Homeland Security on HR 2811. This bill amends the federal criminal code to add the constrictor snake of the species Python genera (later amended to limit only Burmese and African rock pythons) to the list of injurious species that are prohibited from being shipped or imported into the United States.

It doesn’t matter if you keep one corn snake or several hundred ball pythons. Legislation like this will have a major impact on our industry. Opening the door to banning one or two species of snakes completely can make it much easier to add more. We are a major part of the multi-billion pet industry and the loss of even a portion of the reptile community could damage the pet industry as a whole.

USARK's science experts have done a cursory analysis of the USGS report and characterize it as "loose with numerous mistakes and inaccuracies. It is an oversimplification of a very complicated topic." The bottom line is it is not the solid piece of science our opponents wanted to use as a tool to break the back of our community. However, that has not stopped it from being mischaracterized as just that.

What can you do?

***November 2,3 & 4

Call and fax the Subcommittee and voice your opposition to HR2811. Be polite and professional!

Script:

My name is____. I oppose HR2811. It is overly simplistic and politically driven. It is poorly thought out and sacrifices good science for political expediency. The negative economic impact for my family and business would be significant. Please oppose HR2811. Thank you for your consideration.

Also please feel free to share your experiences making these calls in our Herp Law and Cities forum at http://forums.kingsnake.com/forum.php?catid=13#1755768.

Names and numbers to call below...
Call List:
Sponsor:

Congressman Kendrick Meek (D-FL), Sponsor
Washington DC: phone 202-225-4506; fax 202-226-0777
Miami: phone 305-690-5905; fax 305-690-5951

Cosponsors:

Congressman Alcee Hastings (D-FL)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-1313; fax 202-225-8398
Ft. Lauderdale: phone 954-733-2800

Congressman John Lewis (D-GA)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-3801; fax 202-225-0351
Atlanta: phone 404-659-0116

Congressman Robert Wexler (D-FL)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-3001; fax 202-225-5974
Boca Raton: phone 561-988-6302; fax 561-988-6423

Congresswoman Mazie Hirono (HI-2)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-4906; fax 202-225-4987
Honolulu: phone 808-541-1986

Congressman Tom Rooney (R-FL)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-5792; fax 202-225-3132
Punta Gorda: phone 941-575-9101; fax 941-575-9103

Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism & Homeland Security:

Congressman Bobby Scott (D-VA)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-8351; fax 202-225-8354
Richmond: phone 804-644-4845

Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren (D-CA)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-3072; fax 202-225-3336
San Jose: phone 408-271-8700

Congresswoman Shelia Jackson Lee (D-TX)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-3816; fax 202-225-3317
Houston: phone 713-691-4882

Congresswoman Maxine Waters (D-CA)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-2201; fax 202-225-7854
Los Angeles: phone 323-757-8900

Congressman Steve Cohen (D-TN)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-3265; fax 202-225-5663
Memphis: phone 901-544-4131

Congressman Pedro Pierluisi (D-PR)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-2615; fax 202-225-2154
San Juan: phone 787-723-6333

Congressman Bob Goodlatte (R-VA)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-5431; fax 202-225-9681
Roanoke: phone 540-857-2672

Congressman Dan Lungren (R-CA)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-5716; fax 202-226-1298
Gold River: phone 916-859-9906

Congressman Louie Gohmert (R-TX)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-3035; fax 202-226-1230
Tyler: phone 903-561-6349

Congressman Ted Poe (R-TX)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-6565; fax 202-225-5547
Beaumont: phone 409-212-1997

Congressman Randy Forbes (R-VA)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-6365; fax 202-226-1170
Chesapeake: 757-382-0080; fax 757-382-0780

Congressman Jerrold Nadler (D-NY)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-5635
New York: phone 212-367-7350

Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz (D-FL)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-7931; fax 202-226-2052
Pembroke Pines: phone 954-437-3936; fax 954-437-4776

Congressman Anthony Weiner (D-NY)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-6616
Brooklyn: phone 718-743-0441

Congressman Mike Quigley (D-IL)
Washington DC: phone 202-225-4061; fax 202-225-5603
Chicago: phone 773-267-5926; fax 773-267-6583
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Cindy Steinle
PHFaust
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What on earth do large constrictors have to do with Crime Terrorism or Homeland security? I hear the call and am with you but these senators and reps really need to do their homework.
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Todd Hughes

>>What on earth do large constrictors have to do with Crime Terrorism or Homeland security? I hear the call and am with you but these senators and reps really need to do their homework.
>>-----
>>Todd Hughes

Honestly Todd, that is a damned fine question and one I have asked myself. I am assuming it is piggy backed on something else. None the less we need EVERYONE'S support on this!
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Cindy Steinle
PHFaust
hfaust@pethobbyist.com" target="_blank">Email Cindy
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yep, the piggyback is a way that needs to be looked into for all bills, a bill should stand on its' own merit, not hidden amongst "more important" legislation. This way of doing "business" in the Congress and Senate needs to stop. Everyone take the few minutes to get your voice heard.
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Todd Hughes

OR CALL!

Today is the last chance and not a time to procrastinate. It only takes a minute out of your day!

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www.Bluerosy.com

"They that can give up essential liberty, to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty or safety." -Benjamin Franklin

Hey guys thanks for the support. I thought since you all were discussing this I would share my morning call results with you as well as on the law forum.

Update of my calls today. This is my third round of calls. Three days three sets of calls. Started at 10:40 central time. Ended at 11:37. Between each call I worked on this post, which I didn't start until I started making calls. Please share your call reactions as well. Anything major stand out or was shared? The more we know the better we can move ahead.

Congressman Kendrick Meek (D-FL)
DC# said thank you for calling and recording
FL # informed me congressman Meek's constituents wanted this bill passed and that is how he is planning on voting. He also admonished me for "wasting my time calling from WI since this is a local issue."

Congressman Alcee Hastings (D-FL)
DC# Actually recorded my name spelling and zip code.
FL# - Once again recorded my info and said thank you.

Congressman John Lewis (D-GA)
DC# - Stated they have gotten a lot of calls this morning about it! Good job folks!!!
GA # - Asked if I was resident of GA but also logged call and was very pleasant.

Congressman Robert Wexler (D-FL)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congresswoman Mazie Hirono (HI-2)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congressman Tom Rooney (R-FL)
DC# - A thank you and the girl asked if I called yesterday.
FL# - I went into a voice mail because all lines were busy. I do hope it was herpers calling in!!!!

Congressman Bobby Scott (D-VA)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congresswoman Zoe Lofgren (D-CA)
DC# - logged and recorded
CA# - logged recorded and supplied me with my congressman's # as well and urged me to call them.

Congresswoman Shelia Jackson Lee (D-TX)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congresswoman Maxine Waters (D-CA)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congressman Steve Cohen (D-TN)
DC requested address info and urged me to call local reps as well.
TN placed on hold. Hopefully that means the call volume is high! This one also took full information.

Congressman Pedro Pierluisi (D-PR)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congressman Bob Goodlatte (R-VA)
DC - Logged my call
VA - was very hostile in regards to people needing to call their actual congressman. She gave me a lecture regarding the fact that what happens in WI does not impact VA. Please tell me this is frustration from too many out of state calls.

Congressman Dan Lungren (R-CA)
DC - Girl was WONDERFUL! Knew the bill, knew the big reasons, told me calls have been busy the last two days, but that today has been CRAZY. She was extremely pleasant and chatted a moment. She will be passing along a "stack" of names to the congressman. While he has no stance on the issue at this point the overwhelming national volume of calls will give him something to definately consider.
CA - This office once again knew what HR2811 was when I got it out of my mouth. Very pleasant person as well. Also reminded me to call my rep.

Congressman Louie Gohmert (R-TX)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congressman Ted Poe (R-TX)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congressman Randy Forbes (R-VA)
DC - Logged, asked location and passed along that the congressman opposed the bill in its original form, and while he is going in with an open mind he is leaning towards opposition again.
VA - could hear phones ringing in the background.

Congressman Jerrold Nadler (D-NY)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz (D-FL)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congressman Anthony Weiner (D-NY)
Both #'s - a mere thank you and noted my call was logged.

Congressman Mike Quigley (D-IL)
DC - Knew it was the python bill with out me telling them but didn't state a position.
IL - Strongly suggested a call to my local congressional office.

A call to my local Congresswoman Gwen Moore (D-WI)
DC- I kid you not. "So you want wild pythons shipped into the US?" Did a bit of explaining the bill, why I was opposed, what the economical impact would be. I live in a fairly depressed area with a very low economic base and excessively high unemployment. So I stressed the loss of revenue heavily here.
WI - Logged and that was it.
-----
Cindy Steinle
PHFaust
hfaust@pethobbyist.com" target="_blank">Email Cindy
Visit kingsnake on Facebook!
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done some calling. when will we know anything?

>>done some calling. when will we know anything?

Tomorrow at 10 am is the hearing. It was postponed from noon today. We will have a splash on the top of each screen on how to get there.
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Cindy Steinle
PHFaust
Email Cindy
Visit kingsnake on Facebook!
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the wait is killing me. I'm putting together some SD retics and I'm really hoping I can still buy/sell them after this is done. I watched a video of the hearing...god talk about disgusting. Makes me want to hit someone (or several someones). Yeah, my snakes will move into suburbs and eat small children after they're done raping the everglades. GRRR

What got us into this mess in the first place was very greedy irresponsible dealers who didn't care about the animals they were selling, or still don't care, thus these snakes still get dumped. Why cant we work to help regulate these types of dealers at the same time to help regulate the industry we depend on besides fighting the government to do it? Someone has to regulate it, why cant we help out and start working together?
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1.0 Boa- Hogg Island
0.1 Bull- Northern
1.0 Bull- TX Red
0.1 Bull- KS Yellow
1.1 Bulls- Red X Yellow
1.0 Bull- Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada
1.1 Corn Snakes- Okeetee Area, SC
1.1 Fox Snakes- Western
1.1 Gopher Snakes- Sonoran- Cochise Co. AZ
1.1 Kings- Black Easterns (L.g.nigra) Todd Co. KY
1.2 Kings- Coastal CA
1.1 Kings- NC Eastern Chains (M from Union Co. & F from Mecklenburg Co.)
1.1 Kings- Gray Banded 'Blair's'
1.1 Kings- Speckled, Harris Co. TX
1.1 Pines- Carolina Northerns (M from NC, F from SC)
1.1 Pines- Louisiana (pure descendants of Terry Vandeventer stock)
1.1 Pythons- Ball
1.1 Ratsnakes- Black, Henderson Co. NC

>> "What got us into this mess in the first place was very greedy irresponsible dealers who didn't care about the animals they were selling, or still don't care, thus these snakes still get dumped. Why cant we work to help regulate these types of dealers at the same time to help regulate the industry we depend on besides fighting the government to do it? Someone has to regulate it, why cant we help out and start working together?"

** Actually, what more realistically got us into this mess in the first place was all the IDIOTS that have acquired the big snakes from some of the greedy, irresponsible dealers, or whatever other means, and have let them go when they get too big to manage, or irresponsibly let them get away from flimsy substandard enclosures they have jury-rigged for their housing, or don't think to make absolutely CERTAIN the huge snake can't get out and kill the kids, etc..,etc...etc... And it has festered to the point now were it is totally out of control with no real single answer for a "real" cure whatsoever.

Unfortunately, it has now come to the point that the general public idiots want to blame the source(the breeders/dealers)since this is much easier, just as gun control people want to blame the gun manufacturer/dealer instead of the idiot criminals that abuses the gun, or in this case, the huge python.

So now it's like trying to put a friggin' small band-aid on a compound fracture in a futile attempt to heal it. Common sense dictates this will never happen, but since most of the general public that doesn't have common sense, views this as a very likely "fix", especially when they know absolutely NOTHING about snakes(nor care to), and wouldn't be bothered in the least about if you could own them or not, it sounds like a great idea.

It all boils down to the fact that most people are complete idiots when it comes to being able to control, or handle things themselves that can possess a possible problem, or threat, or danger to others(or even themselves) until the problem becomes far too large to ignore anymore, and by that point, it is already WAAAY too far out of control..LOL!

See, you can never fix, or heal what has already been damaged.

To me, the only single answer to this would be to never have it be an issue in the first place, and thanks to the idiots that brought this about, there is no single answer on the planet to make it all good again.

So, what would you suggest to "fix" this problem?.

I think it should be more about regulating idiots from having them, or are "going" to get them, rather than the source of them, but since you cannot regulate ignorance and stupidity, what other choice is left for the majority?

In my opinion, it is just a huge "catch-22" now, with no realistic resolution whatsoever. See, the only thing that will "sound" good to the public now is stopping the big snakes at the source. And the real issue should be keeping idiots from getting there hands on them to begin with,......but how do you do that without affecting the non-idiot population?..........hmmm?

You cannot un-invent the gun, or the python, you must have some good sense and control initially right from the start to ensure that things remain running smoothly, so now that this did not happened,.....now what?

So let's just say nothing happened with this thing, I still think people would go WHEW!, that was close!,.......and continue on their merry little way and do EXACTLY as they did before this issue until the NEXT problem hit the fan, that is just the way most people operate, which is extremely unfortunate, because the old saying...."an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" sure hit it on the head, to bad it didn't happen with the snake thing here though.

This is the problem right there, nobody ever does DIDDLY-CRAP about anything until it is to freakin' late!....EVER!!

And what really pisses me off, is that all this crap the other morons created, will probably trickle right down all the way to my very "dangerous" colubrids too.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

How is a breeder supposed to screen purchasers? I mean yeah, some stuff is obvious--selling to an intoxicated person. But even someone who is a good buyer at the time can develop problems down the road. They can lose their jobs and be unable to afford feeding or to upgrade the cage as the snake grows. They can develop a drug addiction. They may move to an area where the snakes are illegal and then they either have to get rid of them or break the law...either way it doesn't look good for us because then it's either "Oh see, people can't really care for them long term" or its "Oh, lawbreaker!" as far as the public is concerned. If you administer a test to buyers...well, they may *know* what needs doing but that's a far cry from being able to do so. So I don't think it's a feasible thing to expect it to work on that end. It sounds nice and all but the practical problems are significant.

Correct, everything you mentioned was my whole point, even though I used different ways to illustrate it.

Yes, I agree, it is quite impossible to do, and very impractical, there is no way to screen, or monitor this over time, yet this IS, and has been the very problem itself for many years!..LOL!

Just like I said before in my other post, there is NO real single answer at all, the cat is already out of the bag. It would have been much better had this never had to happen, but when little "Tommy" can go out and buy a Burm or Retic anytime he chooses, this is inevitably what happens in the long run. The problem we see today is living proof!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

This is Veterans day today and I feel for the poor guys who gave their lives in wars like WWII for this country. Or at least how it turned out. With the exception of some of our troops the true patriots are almost gone and morality is down the tubes. I mean have you watched TV lately? Censorship and taking God out of schools and other places and replacing that with more regulation is the current trend..

and there is no end unless we have a war on our soil to bring back nation to what is really important.

I could go on but the thing is everything i would say would offend somebody. Men , REAL MEN, are afriad to stand up and take back what was theirs.
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www.Bluerosy.com

"They that can give up essential liberty, to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty or safety." -Benjamin Franklin

Yes, todays world is a pretty chaotic place with the moral fabric being constantly torn by many.

And I for one am glad there are still people who will do whatever is necessary to protect this great soil of ours, unfortunately there are much fewer than is needed to acomplish this great endeavor.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"