Reptile & Amphibian Forums

For those of you discussing your willingness to participate in a (potential) future Black Market or any other claims that you will blatantly disregard any Federal laws that may be passed, I have this to say:

STOP!

You are on a PUBLIC FORUM. Yes, it is privately OWNED but anyone can read what you write.

I'm not just saying this because I'm concerned that your words are putting you at risk of being caught in the future (which they are) but also because this is the exact type of attitude that reptile keepers are already STEREOTYPED as having by the media and general public.

Your words are making ALL of us look bad and right now we really don't need ANY negative press at all. It does not matter if you believe that "no one is watching". Just because they don't post here does not mean that law-makers, enforcement officers, or watchdogs from some of these special interest groups are not reading these forums. I'm not saying that they are or even that it is likely, but it is a possibility.

Kingsnake.com is one of the largest, most visited reptile sites online. I can guarantee that some of those visitors are members of some of the very same special interest groups we are constantly fighting against. (It only makes sense to keep an eye on the competition.) You have no way of knowing whether your words are being forwarded to some of the Senators that currently hold the keys to this industry's future.

Don't assume anything. This fight isn't over by a long shot and right now we can't afford to lose any of the ground we may have cleared with any of those in power. Saying that you don't care about the laws and that you intend on breaking them just because you don't like them is not only irresponsible and juvenile it is also a quick way to lose the respect of those officials.

Many of us are working hard to (hopefully) ensure that these types of laws are not passed and it would be a shame to see that hard work go to waste because the senators involved were influenced into believing that reptile keepers are "criminals anyway".

On another note, let's say this bill is signed into law (let's say it goes all the way through the entire legislative process) and at some time in the future you are indeed caught for breaking the terms of this law. If that were to happen and if the investigators or prosecutor were to come upon these threads (as a result of a search of your computer - which is almost guaranteed to happen) you would be screwing up any chance of reasonable doubt the law would have normally provided you. You would have shown them not only intent and premeditation but also a blatant disregard for the law. I can guarantee that the judge and/or sentencing officer would NOT take this lightly.

Also, just discussing future plans to break the law is, in fact, a crime. You could be prosecuted for conspiracy.

Watch it, people. We are walking on thin ice the way it is. Please, keep your wits about you and be aware that now, more than ever, your actions and words can and will affect every one else involved in this hobby and industry.
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Stay United!

"...I say 'apparently' because despite all our progress she is not at all a tame or handle-able snake and gettting her from that cage would re-start a war.. and we've had a good armistice for several months now."-Gus Rentfro - I love this quote!

Grow a pair, would ya? You're exactly the type the Gov loves. SO easy to control, you're not even a blip on the radar...which in turn means they aren't thinking about you AT ALL. Bet you were the one reminding the teacher about homework assignments.

Even if you disagree with Brandon about the legality issues, do you think there would be much of a market in a "black market "

Ryan,

I understand your frustration, but listen to what your peers are saying. Now is not the time to say what you are saying, and a public forum is not the place to say it.

To paraphrase Sun Tzu (The Art of War), "Know your enemy and know yourself."

Our enemy in this battle is cold, calculating and well-funded. They are the squeaky wheel. These people have been blinded by what probably started with well-intentioned beliefs and have become fanatics. And they are too smart to NOT be monitoring these forums.

Even if what you are proposing was a viable option, why would you want to shout your plans in the enemy's midst? That's not how battles are won.

You say grow a pair. I say use your head.
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http://www.mikefoux.com
http://snakerack.blogspot.com

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If your charged with a felony the courts will want you to take a plea bargain and give you probation IF it's your first offence. They do this so they don't have to spend money on a trail. If It's a class D felony it will carry 1-5 years probated. If you violate while on probation with another felony charge you will spend some prison time.... not jail time PRISON time. They will run your first felony charge concurrent with your 2nd. IF you go on to catch another felony charge they will hit you with a PFO.... Persistant Felony Offender and that carries BIG prison time.

This is one of the most intelligent post I have seen here in a LONG TIME!
Good work.

And for the record....I do not consider his view to be pansy like.
On the contrary, we should always represent ourselves as the upstanding citizens that we ARE.

Just because you obey a law does not mean you agree with it.
Acting and sounding like a criminal will allow them to treat you like one.

Besides...supporters of Reptile Owners Rights are more useful to the cause when outside of the jailhouse than inside.

Excellent post, Brandon.

Case in point-here in Texas, due to the abuses of a tiny handful of unscrupulous commercial collectors, the Parks and Wildlife department were successful in painting herpers in general as poachers and lawbreakers-this allowed them to push through legislation restricting our rights to road collect. It is taking us literally YEARS to get this ironed out!
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Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

"Some things are flat impossible-until they're done."
Robert A. Heinlein