Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Last month I was given a cali king (felmale, 4.5 ftish) by a collector who didn’t want her. She was very very skinny. She also wouldn’t eat. (I named he Mary Kate after the Olsen twin) So I figured she was compacted and soaked her several times a day. She used the bathroom about 5 times in 4 days. After about 2 weeks of this she started to eat. I’ve been feeding her 2 days after she uses the bathroom (so she doesn’t get backed up again), so about once a week for her to gain weight. Ive had her for about a month now. The other night she was making a lot of noise in her cage, and I looked and she was biting herself by her anal plate and constricting herself. She was really trying to eat/kill herself. I tried to pull her off herself but I didn’t want to hurt her (because she was still skinny). So I put some warm water in a tub (about 3 inch deep) and l put her in there and she let go of herself, I then closed the tub top. I went get a mouse for her, because I figured she tried to eat her herself because there was fresh bathroom in the cage and that might have stimulated her to try and attack herself (because she was biting around where she uses the bathroom and the fleshy stuff was exsposed). It’s a complete theory… I know that snakes don’t really go for that, but I wasn’t sure what else to think. It wasn’t even a minute and I opened the top of the tub and the snake was under the water with her mouth wide open and tongue out. I reach into the tub and take her and she was completely stiff and dead. It was so stiff that I could hold it by end of the body and the rest would still hold itself up, like a statue. I was really shocked. I guess she got over stressed and just died. So I put her on my counter to try and figure out what just happened and about 10 mins go by and I see the mouth move a little bit (its still stiff ). I get weird out, but my friend tells me its just the nerves making it move and that snakes will still love a little after they die. It would move its mouth a little bit about every 10 mins- 5mins. I decide im going to put it back into its cage, just in case it wasn’t actually dead. It was in there for about 40mins when I came back to check on it. It was still stiff, but I knocked the cage and it slowly moved its body for a sec. I didn’t think it was a coincidence and an over hour it slowly came back to life. It was really weird. I feed her last night, and she ate.

My friend said that there was a youtube vid of a cali that was kept in a small take that attacked itself, and when they put it in a large take it had not do it since. My cali was in a 10 gallon (I was going to get it a bigger cage once it got better or find it a new home once it was a healthy size) so shes now in larger cage. This MIGHT have been the cause… but im not sure. I consider myself pretty knowledgeable but it was really strage and crazy and the snake was sick to start off with. (by the way its new name is Britney Spears)

Does anyone know what the hell happened?

Is this a wild caught snake?

Good call on the soaking. Hydration is so vital to kingsnakes (all snakes, well, all living things).

I have no info on this condition, but what I would do is get her weight up. If she is attacking herself because she is malnourished, then she needs calories. Not once a week, more often if her digestive system can take it. Heat and food, as often as she will accept it, until her weight is up. I think, small food items all the time for awhile. Try that and see what happens.
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Mark

I agree with the heat and food and would also add that I would make sure that the snake has a proper gradient so it can thermoregulate. A ten gallon tank is not big enough for a 4.5 foot kingsnake and it would be hard to heat one side and cool the other properly with the snake being too big for the enclosure. I have heard of many stories of cal kings biting themselves and in most cases the snake was hungry. It is possible your snake has a parasite infection or some kind of chemical poisoning. That going stiff thing is very strange. Do you have any other history on the animal? Oh, and I would keep that animal away from all of your other snakes until you can find out the cause!!

i dont think it has parasites because it started to eat after the soaking process and useing the bathroom. if it was parasites it would probable still not be eating. I also dont think its poisoning because ive just been feeding it frozen mice.

I had it in the 10 gallon just for the time being (which was like a month) because thats what it came in and it wasnt moving around much anyways, it would just stay in its hide (sick). I was going to get it a bigger cage that week because it was becomeing more active.

my room stays good temp. 76 f during the day. so i didnt have a heating pad for her. she was passing her meals fine and at steady rate.

I dont know any of her history, except shes prob captive bred. I work at a nature center and we have about 40 snakes there. (i take care of the reptiles) so alot of times people try and bring us their retiles they dont want anymore. we try and find them new homes. I took this sick snake home with me to get it healthly before we gave it to a home.

Does it have a hide box? A place to make it feel safe. Also a check from a vet wouldn't hurt, snakes can get both ectoparasites (like mites) and endoparasites (tapeworms, roundworms, etc). Feed it more and kick up the temps.

Scott

Your snake could definitely have parasites and still eat. Probably would not gain much weight though. I was thinking the snake could have been exposed to some chemicals or something when I was talking about poisoning. Maybe the person who gave it to you had the snake in close quarters with chemicals or something. From my experience, when someone gives a pet away that they do not want anymore, the pet in question has not been cared for properly for quite a while because the person "doesn't have time" or "doesn't want to be bothered any longer. I am glad you took the snake in and hope all goes well with the rehab. Good luck and keep us posted.

You could stick a heat pad against the wall of the tank. Then the snake could but up to it if it needs more heat. And offering more food will mean the snake needs some access to temps over 76 deg. At least during the day.

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Mark

You stated that you put the snake in warm water.... could you be in such a hurry that the water was actually hot? I don't see how else the snake could have perished so quickly. If the water was hot the snake would die quickly like that.
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"The band is just fantastic, that is really what I think. Oh by the way, which ones pink?"

She stated that the snake is still alive and ate after it's "stiff routine". I do think some folks forget that we are on average 98.6 degrees and if water feels very warm to the touch it is probably too hot. (well over 100).

That is exactly right bro, which is why a spa is most comfortable to us humans at around 100 degrees or more. I remember telling someone this very thing a long time ago. Don't know for sure at all about this situation, as almost ANYTHING is possible with animals, or humans too. But if it wasn't the overly warm water, it could certainly be a seizure of some sort from a neurological problem,.....who the heck really knows without doing TONS of expensive veterinary testing.

I think the snake could definitely use some good feedings(small for a while) that are given fairly often though, then when it proves to pass all these smaller meals they could be upped to larger ones.

Oh!,.BTW, yes, right you are again Joe, snakes can certainly have internal parasites and continue to feed, up until they are overwhelmed by them and they become too numerous for their auto-immune system to handle any more.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Yeah Doug, I remember recently a couple of posts about how snakes reacted to being "overdosed" with mite treatments and this could be something close to that. But yes, who knows!? I am glad the snake is now in the hands of someone who will try to care for it and is concerned enough to ask questions.

Oh yeah, I certainly agree with you on that!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

no' the water wasnt very hot but the water being warm prob had something to do with it. it prob added stress to her. I think she just freaked out and went into shock.

I feel pretty terrible about it, but i thought it was the best way to make her release herself.

.......the snake is still alive bro........and at this point maybe the one who's pink.......just a shot in the dark, but maybe........LOL........
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Jerry Kruse
www.zonatas.com

And God said, "Let there be zonata subspecies for all to ponder..."

I must have drifted off while reading the post.... I still think it is too coincidental that after a soak in "warm water" the snake became so stiff....
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"The band is just fantastic, that is really what I think. Oh by the way, which ones pink?"

youre prob right. thanks for the input. Thats the last time i do that. Next time (hopefully wont be) ill just hold her under running room temp water.

Lemme' get this striaght............You had a 4.5 foot kingsnake in a 10 gallon tank?

read the other messages. Its not as bad as it sounds. she wasnt active at all. (prob because she was unhealthy) she would just stay in her hide all day. I also would bring her out and let her go in a room. shortly before this happened i was going to get her a large cage that week because she started to become more active.