Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Well, a while back, there was a guy that emailed me after seeing the snake posted here, and showed me photos of a king that he captured personally some time ago less than a half a mile from the Mexican border in Nogales. This is exactly where mine was alleged to have originated too. His kingsnake looked virtually IDENTICAL to mine, only his was just a tad darker in it's white net-like pattern. It also had the exact same ventrolateral black triangles mine has on his sides, as well as the exact same throat, chin, and venter pattern.

This makes me extremely convinced that my friend did indeed give me the straight scoop on it's origin. When I emailed this guy who contacted me with photos of my snake, he was just as surprised as I was to see their absolutely striking similarities. I have looked at TONS of splendida, and splendida intergrade pics of different combinations from many sources, and some of the ones found in this Nogales area seem to be the only ones that display the phenotype mine does. So I am a very happy camper, and will bide my time and acquire this unique snake a well-matched mate from this area if I cannot locate any of the same relatives of the one I have. This could take quite a while, but until then, I will simply enjoy owning him.

I have to say, I feel rather good about what I have found out thus far regarding this, and I am real glad I stumbled on this unique little gem of a kingsnake.

BTW, he just shed and ate earlier today, so he is as freshly "detailed" as it gets

~Doug

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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

That is one cool a-- snake Doug. Good news on your recent info discovery also.

Cool news about your splendida Doug. See what I can find when I head down there. It's an easy and fun trip!

Scott
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

Thanks bro!,..that would be INSANE if you found one exactly like it while you were there..LOL!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

>>Thanks bro!,..that would be INSANE if you found one exactly like it while you were there..LOL!
>>
No problem bro! I go down there every season, so hope I can find you a mate for your male. I've been looking into seeing what it takes to hunt in Mexico and bring back stuff into the states. Lots of red tape!

Scott
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

Lots of red tape!"

Which is EXACTLY why we don't see many more things from Mexico here in the hobby. I can think of several milks that are NEVER seen here in the states that would have showed up by now had it not been for the difficulty of importation from Mexico. It seems the only thing that is easy to get from there is textiles, beer drugs, and cheap labor,.....but SNAKES!,.......forget about it, unless they are brought over like the drugs

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Exactly bro! I'm only 30 miles from the Mexico, those things are brought over here all the time, legal or not. I don't why it's so hard to bring herps back?

Scott

>>Lots of red tape!"
>>
>> Which is EXACTLY why we don't see many more things from Mexico here in the hobby. I can think of several milks that are NEVER seen here in the states that would have showed up by now had it not been for the difficulty of importation from Mexico. It seems the only thing that is easy to get from there is textiles, beer drugs, and cheap labor,.....but SNAKES!,.......forget about it, unless they are brought over like the drugs
>>
>>
>> ~Doug
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>>"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"
>>
>>my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

Scott,

Let me know what you find out. I'll make the trip with you. I am a teacher and have summers to travel, and Ive always wanted to herp in Mexico.

Craig
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God Bless Evolution.

I think technically, he means just this side of Mexico in extreme southern Arizona.

But of course, I could be wrong too

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

>>I think technically, he means just this side of Mexico in extreme southern Arizona.

That's what I was thinking in and around Nogales, but always wanted to herp in Mexico. Just the damn politics of doing it.

Scott
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

That I will Craig. If I can just get through the politics of it all?

Scott

>>Scott,
>>
>>Let me know what you find out. I'll make the trip with you. I am a teacher and have summers to travel, and Ive always wanted to herp in Mexico.
>>
>>Craig
>>-----
>>God Bless Evolution.
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

>>>>Thanks bro!,..that would be INSANE if you found one exactly like it while you were there..LOL!
>>>>
>>No problem bro! I go down there every season, so hope I can find you a mate for your male. I've been looking into seeing what it takes to hunt in Mexico and bring back stuff into the states. Lots of red tape!

You can't and won't....IT IS WAY MORE THAN JUST RED TAPE.....Too bad....we in the mexicana world have been trying to figure it out for decades...
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John Lassiter
Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part...
www.coastalbendcaptivebreeding.com

>>You can't and won't....IT IS WAY MORE THAN JUST RED TAPE.....Too bad....we in the mexicana world have been trying to figure it out for decades...

I know, but I'm not one to give up. There has to be ways!

Scott

>>John Lassiter
>>Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part...
>>www.coastalbendcaptivebreeding.com
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

>>>>You can't and won't....IT IS WAY MORE THAN JUST RED TAPE.....Too bad....we in the mexicana world have been trying to figure it out for decades...
>>
>>I know, but I'm not one to give up. There has to be ways!

Okay...When you figure it out let us all know so we can go with ya.......
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John Lassiter
Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part...
www.coastalbendcaptivebreeding.com

John! What is the problems that herpers can't hunt and or bring back snakes from Mexico? Is it the U.S. goverment, Mexican goverment, both? Or?

Scott
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

>>John! What is the problems that herpers can't hunt and or bring back snakes from Mexico? Is it the U.S. goverment, Mexican goverment, both? Or?

It is both governments.....But mainly United States' rules and regulations....Customs....

You can't even legally bring an avocado with a seed in it across the border. Fruits, Plants and Animals from Mexico are not allowed in the United States unless you are part of a Zoo expedition...And the recent expeditions down into Mexico have been for rattlers, not kingsnakes.......

And hunting and finding snakes there is not a problem...unless you don't keep anything.....I know of many that photograph wild mexican reptiles legally....The only "problem" is the violence in Mexico in this day and age........

There are many other "problems and laws" that I will not go into here......
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John Lassiter
Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part...
www.coastalbendcaptivebreeding.com

I know how Customs is, a pain in the rear. I go down to Mexico, once in awhile, and there are signs posted no fruits, veggies, animals, coming back into the states. They treat you more like a criminal than a citizen. I also know of the violence going on, but thought that was more at the borders. Thanks John!

Scott

>>>>John! What is the problems that herpers can't hunt and or bring back snakes from Mexico? Is it the U.S. goverment, Mexican goverment, both? Or?
>>
>>It is both governments.....But mainly United States' rules and regulations....Customs....
>>
>>You can't even legally bring an avocado with a seed in it across the border. Fruits, Plants and Animals from Mexico are not allowed in the United States unless you are part of a Zoo expedition...And the recent expeditions down into Mexico have been for rattlers, not kingsnakes.......
>>
>>And hunting and finding snakes there is not a problem...unless you don't keep anything.....I know of many that photograph wild mexican reptiles legally....The only "problem" is the violence in Mexico in this day and age........
>>
>>There are many other "problems and laws" that I will not go into here......
>>-----
>>John Lassiter
>>Poor planning and procrastination on your part does not constitute an emergency on my part...
>>www.coastalbendcaptivebreeding.com
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

Thanks Joe!,...yes, I was REAL happy to see one basically exactly like mine that was indeed captured right there in Nogales just shy of the border. It definitely reinforces the previous information I have on this one I have.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

That is a king I would want in my collection, I plan to be down there this year as well.
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Todd Hughes

Yeah Todd,...being into the different locality types of kings that you are, I can certainly see why you would.

Good luck with your stuff this year too BTW!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

I have herped near that area for many years. About 20 miles north of Nogales closer to Green Valley. I have seen Desert Kings, Cal Kings and Mexican Black Kings. It seems all 3 subspecies merge in that area. I have seen nice classic Desert Kings, Classic Cal Kings and totally Black Kings but I have alot some that look like intergrades too. But as far as Nogales goes I'm to scared to herp that close to the border.

Pretty cool looking animal you have there Doug

Jason.

Thanks!,.....oh yes!, there is an entire mixing-pot of phenotypes in that area, no doubt about it, and there can be any of several looking forms, depending on any given area within that huge zone just as you mentioned. That is certainly a place that the animals are tough to put your finger on as far as their geneflow is concerned.

And yes, real close to the border there could be a pretty scary area to be at times, I'm sure..LOL!

Thanks for the input man!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

>> And yes, real close to the border there could be a pretty scary area to be at times, I'm sure..LOL!

Just like being in a L.A. hood.....LOL!

Scott
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How many nuns could a nunchuck chuck if a nunchuck could chuck a nun?

Very nice, I've got some similarly colored "Yumas", but without the chain pattern. I did see a black & yellow roadkill with a similar pattern near Glamis about 30 years ago.
Again, very nice & congrats.
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"There's a fine line between genius and insanity. I have erased this line."
Oscar Levant

That's very interesting stuff too Max!. Yes, some very unique phenotypes, isolated "pockets", and combinations thereof in the deep southwest there.

I've seen alot of older field herping photo's with you in them over the many years. Some of Bill Love's stuff comes to mind.

Good luck in more of your future herping endeavors Max!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

That is great news, Doug. Glad to hear about a confirmation. That king is very nice!
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Thanks Ross!,....

Yes, it was really nice to see the two phenotypes correlate well with the given info.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com