Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Well, I finally went and placed an order for some DHLs through one of the breeders that has been mentioned on the board. I set up my habitat with all the right gear. Obviously I have all the ants I'll need, and I have been researching this for 6 months now so feel I am more than prepared to care for these HLs. So anyways, I placed my order which arrived yesterday. I have to say I am far from impressed and am reconsidering my thoughts on the HL wild caught market. They arrived with no problem via overnight shipping, but when I pulled them out they ranged from slightly skinny to being nearly starved to death. I have to say I am a bit disgusted with the breeder and/or the folks who did the capturing and handling. If that is how they are going to be handled then I think they should be severely restricted or banned altogether.
I would hate to see those people who have the curiosity and the willingness to properly care for HLs go without the opportunity of ownership, but I can also see that people who are interested in little more than making a buck will seize the opportunity and may not necessarily provide proper care, whether out of ignorance or lack of concern or both.
I am considering how to handle the situation, but long term I have to say that I think it would be best if some kind of license or permit were required. And that only Captive bred HLs could be sold (with proof). I figure if they are captive bred they will be properly cared for because apparently it takes some skill and genuine care to do it, and breeders will have more of a stake in the success of their sales, so will focus more on proper education for customers. Of course the price would go up significantly but that is a good thing all the way around I think. Those who do the breeding would be conpensated for their good efforts, those who want to order them will have to give it a little more consideration than just whim, and perhaps some good restrictions and licensing will help protect wild populations. Hopefully those who would catch and sell illegally will pay a good stiff penalty or jail time. All this said I wouldn't want to see it made nearly impossible to own HLs. Just difficult enough that a person would have to do some research first and apply for a permit. (Which could lead to more $$ for HL protection).

I realize there will always be wild caught, but the harder you make it (illegal) the more folks will consider doing the right thing. An interesting example of how it might work is the Gila Monster. They seem to share roughly the same protected status as the CHL but they are available commercially. But that said, it is no small task to get one. You first have to be willing to cough up about $1400 bucks to the breeder, and then you have to go through the process of getting the necessary permits. I have a serious doubt that many will be buying them at whim or mistreating them when they get possession. Anyways, I have to say this purchase has not been a pleasant experience.

The selling of wild-caught horned lizards should be banned. It is very difficult to get a wild-caught HL acclimated to a capive environment, it takes much effort and special techniques. Even when their is no middle man. The HL is a very modest animal and becomes very stressed when a potential predator is looking down on it daily not to mention the limited space. If anyone has captive bred these animals they know the true personality of these lizards. The fear and stress are gone and the eating and unique behaviors are in full force. I believe stress is what kills most of these captive lizards both past and present.Jeff

Thanks for the insight Jeff. I have them in a large tank inside a room with very little disturbance. I also have an area outside where they went for the day with no disturbance except the trip outdoors. Any other advise is appreciated.

A large enclosure, little disturbance and natural light are all very good in the transition. Are they accepting food? If they aren't it might help to put a few ants in then leave the room, some individuals won't eat in front of people at first. I have also had some individuals not accept ants at first but accept small crickets and mealworms, you might try them as well even though their are difference of opinions on the matter. Do they continuly try to escape or are they fairly relaxed?Jeff

First of all I want to thank everyone for all of the helpful insight gained from these pages. I have a similar experience... A well intentioned friend of mine gave me a petshop purchased Dhl as a gift she thought I would appreciate, as my name is Liz(all my friends call me Lizard). Anyway, I have extensive experience with other herps, but my forte is native South florida species(where we live), not desert species.
I have been doing as much research on how to properly care for this wonderful little lizard, and she is in so much better shape now than when I got her over a month ago, now she is happy and robust. The pet shop owner told my friend, "they're really easy to take care of, just feed them crickets." Little did she know!!! I think that it is an outrage that this can happen! There must be some accountability for these irresponsible practices! I am now feeding her mostly mail order harvester ants, with a few other small soft bodied bugs thrown in for diversity (pillbugs and termites and such). I supplement with reptical a few times a week. If anyone has anything else to recommend, I appreciate whatever info I can get. These forums and archives have been such a great help, and thank you again!

They are eating ants. But there is one, mostly skin and bone that has only eaten a few. I am pretty good about sitting still and far enough away from them as not to be disturbing to them so I have seen them eat. Most of the time they are content to bask but they do claw at the tank from time to time. When outside everytime I peeked in on them they were just basking and getting comfortable in the sand. The enclosure is 8 x 8 with all sand, some grass and stone cover in the center. I am mostly worried about the one. He is so far gone he wont even burry himself in the sand at lights out as the others do. I figure if he'll eat enough he may come back but it may be too late. Which really pisses me off (pardon the language) at the dealer. I don't understand how he could ship such an animal, much less purchase them for resale. Where are the standards?

that makes me really sad man, it is a shame someone is keeping and selling those. I bought mine from a great place. Only thing is that his hips seem skinny along with his tail, but he eats until he is full which is usually 20-40 ants a day. So I dunno, I am going to try and get an out doors enclosure today. Here is a pic of him.

They are all responding well to a drop or two of water on the snout. Does anyone else regularly practice this?