Reptile & Amphibian Forums

It's goten to the point where King rarely bites me, about once a week now. Yes, that's rare for us. However, I've noticed about 5 minutes after he bites, the area around the bite marks becomes red and itchy, an obvious allergic reaction. Does anyone else have this kind of reaction, or know why it happens?

While it's possible that you're having a mild allergic reaction to the saliva of your snake, I'd bet that's not the case. Nearly all nonvenomous snake bites result in red, itchy spots due to the mechanical damage done by their tiny, yet sharp, teeth. The reaction is something like a cross between a paper cut and irritation caused by nettles.

-Cole

yes, it sort of feels like brushing up against nettles.

Hmmm, Cole-io is the forum mensa but I'm not so sure about this one. I've noticed unusual itching from young triangulum bites and suspect that the salaiva is specialized to subdue lizards. Adults bites are typical scrapes but I've noticed an odd amount of redness and itch from tiny hatchling bites.
Maybe it's me becoming sensitive in my old age......
There was something published several years ago about colubrids having salaiva specialized to subdue specific prey items but don't recall what the study subjects were now.
I know I bleed like hell from garter and ribbon bites but water snakes will stop flowing normally.
Research project Cole!
-Jeff

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Let there be triangulum and lo, the milkhead was born.

I know that I got bit by a garter snake in a pet shop once and the thing latched on and chewed on me pretty good. After I got home there were two small punture marks from the rear of the snakes jaws which were deeper than the rest. My thumb actually swelled a bit and was sore for almost a week. I remeber asking around if Garters were rear fanged but never got a definate answer. They obviously have enlarged rear teeth possibly for holding on to fish and frogs. I also saw a show on Animal planet I think, about snake bites and there was one guy who had gotten bit by a Burmeese Python on his hand. The bite needed stitches, but the weird thing is that the guys face was swolen and they said he was having a reaction from the snakes saliva. I had never seen that before.
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King Snakes! Who can make a better mouse trap?
Jorge Sierra

I still have the marks on me as usual, I did take some benadryll, the itching went away, and the Benadryll knocked me out.

Jorge,....

Yeah, a garter snake is in the "natricine" group. Check out "Sunherp's" post entitled...."Hey!" just below. There is some interesting literature regarding their saliva.

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

I see you already saw his post!...d'oh!!..LOL!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Jeff,

I'll try to call you this weekend to BS. Lots of planning going on around my place.

I read the Colubrid salivary toxin stuff, too. I'll try to track down some of the papers.

Here's a quote from Dr. W. Wuster on another forum:
Basically, the point has been made here already - the vast majority of "colubrids" have a venom gland that secretes many of the major toxin families also found in vipers and elapids. The exception, with greatly reduced or non-existent venom glands are some of the specialised constrictors like rat snakes, gophers, etc. All the natricines certainly have them.

WW

He suggests above that the rat snakes, gopher snakes, and their relatives (tribe Lampropeltini) have reduced Duvernoy's Glands. Of course, I do agree that digestive enzymes (modified proteins) are present in many vertebrate salivas and could be causing a reaction. I've just always attributed king/milk/rat/gopher snake bites' itch to the mechanical damage.

Garter and water snakes (the Natricine tribe) have well developed Duvernoy's Glands, as do several other Colubrid tribes.

I'll dig for some primary literature and see what I can come up with for Lampropeltini.

-Cole

I knew it, ha ha! That little Garter hurt more than when a 5 foot Florida King latched onto my thumb for about 12 to 15 minutes, and only let go when dunked in a bucket of water, lol.
My thumb just felt like it had something else besides a simple bite. But just to let you know I bought the thing anyway, ha ha.
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King Snakes! Who can make a better mouse trap?
Jorge Sierra

Jorge,

Glad you didn't let the little guy get the best of you!

-Cole

LOL! It did surprise me... I had been bit by Garters before and that was the first time I felt that! And everyone I asked about Garters being reaer fanged thought I was nuts. Now you have backed up my suspicions...
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King Snakes! Who can make a better mouse trap?
Jorge Sierra

I get the itch from anything that bites me... ball pythons, boas, etc. So I agree in that it's probably just mechanical damage. Interesting little article there!