Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have blood in the cage of my male butter stripe after a breeding to my female ultramel. She is an 07 and this is her first year breeding. Is this normal? I checked both snakes after potential copulation and saw no evidence of where the blood may have come from. Clean vents, etc, no wounds on the snakes themselves. I am concerned and have never seen this EVER before. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

Believe it or not it is normal!I've seen it here to a small degree but,I've seen pics that would make you think someone was massacred!lol! Jeff

Thanks Jeff. This is certainly not my first rodeo breeding corns and like I posted before, I have NEVER seen this in my other years producing. I suspected it was simply breeding related, but not sure. I was wondering if it was the fact she was a virgin breeder, but I bred first timers before without the same situation. I was kind of worried he ripped off a hemipene!! However, I saw no tissue or anything in the cage and no additional blood anywhere on the snakes. I appreciated the reply!!

Jeff's right-very common. I've seen it literally dozens of times over the year, with never any long term consequences.
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Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

Breeder of:
Green Tree Pythons
Jungle Carpet Pythons
Pastel, Pinstripe, FIRE, Piebald, Clown, Lavender Albino, Leucistic, and Spider Ball Pythons
Striped Colombian Boa Constrictors
Kenyan, Rufescens, and Conicus Sand Boas
Red Phase Western Hognose Snakes
Spider Western Hognose Snakes
Albino Western Hognose Snakes
Locality Trans-Pecos Mexican Hognose Snakes
Southern Hognose Snakes
Eastern Hognose Snakes
Tricolor Hognose Snakes
Hypo Checkered Garter Snakes
Eastern Blackneck Garter Snakes
Stillwater Hypo Bullsnakes
Patternless Bullsnakes
S. GA Eastern Kingsnakes
Locality Desert Kingsnakes
Albino Desert Kingsnakes
Hypo Desert Kingsnakes
Mexican Black Kingsnakes
Desert Phase, Striped Desert, Newport, and Coastal California Kingsnakes
Locality Mexican Milksnakes
Spotted Mexican Milksnakes
Tangerine Mexican Milksnakes
Locality Alterna
Abbott Okeetee Cornsnakes
Mexican Baird's Ratsnakes
Cape Housesnakes
Tangerine Albino African Fat -Tailed Geckos
Locality Spotted Turtles

Thanks for the reply Brad. As I stated to Jeff, I have never seen this believe it or not. What causes it? Is it rupturing of surface vessels in the females cloacal area from the males hemipene spines??

>>Thanks for the reply Brad. As I stated to Jeff, I have never seen this believe it or not. What causes it? Is it rupturing of surface vessels in the females cloacal area from the males hemipene spines??
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Brad Chambers
WWW.HCU-TX.ORG

Breeder of:
Green Tree Pythons
Jungle Carpet Pythons
Pastel, Pinstripe, FIRE, Piebald, Clown, Lavender Albino, Leucistic, and Spider Ball Pythons
Striped Colombian Boa Constrictors
Kenyan, Rufescens, and Conicus Sand Boas
Red Phase Western Hognose Snakes
Spider Western Hognose Snakes
Albino Western Hognose Snakes
Locality Trans-Pecos Mexican Hognose Snakes
Southern Hognose Snakes
Eastern Hognose Snakes
Tricolor Hognose Snakes
Hypo Checkered Garter Snakes
Eastern Blackneck Garter Snakes
Stillwater Hypo Bullsnakes
Patternless Bullsnakes
S. GA Eastern Kingsnakes
Locality Desert Kingsnakes
Albino Desert Kingsnakes
Hypo Desert Kingsnakes
Mexican Black Kingsnakes
Desert Phase, Striped Desert, Newport, and Coastal California Kingsnakes
Locality Mexican Milksnakes
Spotted Mexican Milksnakes
Tangerine Mexican Milksnakes
Locality Alterna
Abbott Okeetee Cornsnakes
Mexican Baird's Ratsnakes
Cape Housesnakes
Tangerine Albino African Fat -Tailed Geckos
Locality Spotted Turtles

While I'm sure it's likely coincidence, I've seen more blood from breeding corns (more than a couple times) than any other species I've kept.
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Randy Whittington

I am pretty sure the male did his job even though I did not witness intromission. Does this blood generally indicate copulation was a success? I am using this male on another female this year and I dont want to unnecessarily breed him to the ultramel again. Maybe one more time to ensure fertility, but that would be about it.

Thanks

I would say the blood definatly means they locked up. Weather she took (becomes gravid) from that breeding or not it's just a guess. I used to make sure pairs bred a few times over a few week period but now keep introducing pairs for several days at a time, until I'm SURE the female is carring fertile eggs. I'm sure it's not necessary much of the time but greatly increases the odds of getting fertile eggs.
When I've seen a lot of blood from a copulation I tend to give the pair a few days before putting them back together, just to be safe.

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Randy Whittington

Thanks Randy. A good friend of mine who is a successfull breeder advocates the once and done theory of pairing IF intromission was known to have occurred. Theory being the male just depletes sperm each successive breeding and he hasnt shown multiple pairing to increase fertility. However, in this instance I would be more comfortable with at least one more pairing since I did not witness actual copulation. I also planned to give the female a break too due to potential clocacal trauma since I saw the blood. I paired them Friday, so will probably try them again tonight.

Nice Okeetees BTW!!! Thanks to ALL for your responses.

Even if your checking a sample on a microscope after breeding takes place, to check the percent of active little swimmers, I would say the single hook up theory is not highly dependable. Palpating the female first to check for follicles would increase the chance of fertilization with one breeding but I personally wouldn't have much confidence going with that theory.
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Randy Whittington

I certainly understand and have never personally done a "one and run" with breeding attempts LOL. Last year I did two, mainly to make sure I had good hookups and actual breeding. However, this was a bit reduced then what I have done in the past by witnessing three successful pairings. The outcome was great with close to 100% fertility and actual increased egg production by known females.