Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I watched a documentary narrated by Oprah called "Life". The segment was on reptiles and amphibians. There was a portion covering the Komodo Dragon. I have a question for Bryan Grieg Fry and Robert Sprackland, one being an authority on venom and the other, an authority on Varanids. The show talked of a venom in the dragon's saliva. All these years, I thought it was a heavy bacterial load. In fact, when working in a pet store, I was bitten twice by Varanids and both times needed medical treatment with broad spectrum anti-biotics. Have things changed? Is there more recent info?
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Terry Norris, Keeper of the household Zoo

I read something a while back that said that yes, they do indeed have venom. I have no idea where I saw it, sorry. In the article it was touted as a new discovery but I just sort of skimmed it, I can't help beyond that.

Here's a link to Dr. Fry's website, specifically the section covering Komodos.

http://www.kingsnake.com/toxinology/venomdoc/Komodo_Dragon.html

Check out some of the other papers too, some pretty wild stuff.

Here is a link to some conversations regarding monitor venom on this forum just a month or two ago.

http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=1778053,1778053

Cheers,
Mike.

If you can check out Dr. Spraklands' book "Giant Lizards" 2nd Edition. He discusses venom in Varanids in general. Not to mention a really fascinating read.

Thanks, I just got the book but haven't read it yet.
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Terry Norris, Keeper of the household Zoo

I would not put much stock in to the information in that book...

>>I would not put much stock in to the information in that book...

Care to elaborate with specific criticisms as to the veracity of particular points?
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Dr. Bryan Grieg Fry
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Venomics Research Laboratory,
Department of Biochemistry,
Bio21 Institute,
University of Melbourne
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://www.venomdoc.com

I still haven't read the 2nd edition by Dr. Sprackland. But my initial question at the beginning of this thread was posed on Facebook. I'm listed as a friend of Robert Sprackland as well as BGF. And was hoping for an answer, but the query disssapeared from facebook befor I got an answer. I posted here and am getting more answers.
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Terry Norris, Keeper of the household Zoo

[reads back to see what the original question was ] as someone pointed out, I have put up information about our research on my webpage www.venomdoc.com I would of course be happy to answer any questions you may have after giving the webpage a good read.

We have a paper in-press that will be out soon that has in it the results for a dozen more varanid species. Basically all the differernt kinds of Aussie ones we could get our hands on plus a smattering of overseas animals. It also has more info for the two Heloderma species in addition to three genera within the anguiids, plus Shinisaurus and ( :: drum roll :: ) Lanthanotus We had a lot of fun with the paper. It looks at the venom evolution across the entire Anguimorpha lizard radiation. Amongst the mix are five brand new toxin classes we pulled from various species or clades.

Cheers
B
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Dr. Bryan Grieg Fry
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Venomics Research Laboratory,
Department of Biochemistry,
Bio21 Institute,
University of Melbourne
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://www.venomdoc.com

I rememeber when this article came out, Aussie species seem to have much higher levels than those from other locations, I seem to remember some very small species having the highest levels.
Its not as if the venom (or mixture of components found in snake venom also found in their saliva) is enough for us humans to even consider worrying about, it wont harm you in any way. These components cause increased pain, throbbing, etc.
To the lizards intended prey animals (small furry mammals, etc the venom does its job, and more so to small cold blooded prey).

Keep in mind when bitten by a monitor the actual injury is 1000 times far worse to you than what toxic components contained in the saliva are.
Also that certain other lizards mentioned in the article such as Bearded dragons have the same components found in their saliva, or in glands in the lower jaw.
With whats going on in Florida from irresponsible keepers, monitor lizards having some venomous components in their mouth is not something that will help our hobby, keep that in mind when in public.

Ironically enough if some lawmakers on the state level in Fl. have their way it will be easier to obtain a venomous permit and keep whatever hots you want no matter how hot than it will be to legally keep a nile monitor. Since keeping them will be outlawed unless you are grandfathered in (we hope). It will be easier to keep caimans legally as well. I think some of the republicans here in fl. have this idea that since so many people are upset about the health care thing right now and are not happy with the democrats that their jobs are safe in Nov. As a reformed republican (current libertarian) and long time fl. resident I can tell you nothing could be further from the truth. spring house cleaning is waiting till Nov. this year.

Polliticians seem to vote, not on common sense, but on what will get them votes. Regardless of political affiliations, I say clean house and vote themm ALL out.
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Terry Norris, Keeper of the household Zoo

That's exactly what I am saying. These politicians have played this divide and conquer game long enough. The 2 controlling parties are two sides of the same counterfeit coin. It's for a new coin.