Reptile & Amphibian Forums

Background: I purchased a trio of hatchling fox snakes this past fall/winter. When they arrived, one of the females was very emaciated and twisted, with her jaw askew. She died very shortly after I took her out of the bag. One other wasn't much better, but he pulled through. The 3rd and largest appeared perfectly healthy.

My smaller one is very healthy now, but the largest appears to have a swollen upper jaw. I noticed a month or so ago that her head looked... odd. I couldn't put my finger on exactly how, but she looked different, and her mouth was ever so slightly open. The smaller one had shedding problems not long before (VERY dry winter), so I chalked it up to possible noserub from shedding difficulties. I had them both on aspen, so I switched them to an aspen/coconut coir mix and gave them larger water bowls to raise the humidity, and gave them humid hide boxes. I watched carefully to make sure she didn't get any substrate in her mouth, and she had no difficulties.

When I looked in at her today, it was obvious that her upper jaw/gums are puffed out sideways. From what I can see they are a healthy color with no discharge. One side is even puffy enough that a little of the lower part of her eye is obscured. She always eats with no problems.

What could this be? mouthrot? injury? calcium deficiency? I don't supplement the pinkies, but I've never had an issue with other small snakes.

I can rinse her mouth out with chlorhexedine if I need to, but she's still so small and fragile I don't want to force her mouth open and make things worse...

I love foxes, and they're so hard to come by... I was hoping to raise a group up and breed them, but I seem to be cursed!

Any ideas??
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1.1 Brazilian Rainbow Boas Nico, Tally
1.1 Womas, Darwin and Emma
0.1 Pastel BCI, Hyacinth
1.0 Anery Kenyan Sand Boa, Jasper
1.0 Carpet X Diamond Python, Steve
1.0 Ball python, Stan (Rescue)
1.0 Blood python, Porthos
0.1 Granite Spotted python (unnamed thus far)
1.0 Hognose, Fang
1.1 Western Fox snakes, Thing 1 and Thing 2
1.0 Northern Blue Tongue, Jabbi
0.0.1 Red Tegu, Sushi
1.1 Mali Uromastyx, Ajani (rescue), Goober
0.0.1 Egyptian Uromastyx, Ahktep
1.0 Leopard gecko, Frank (rescue)
0.0.1 Leopard tortoise, Oogway
1.0 Red eared slider, Spunky (rescue)
1.0 African mud turtle, Francois the Tortois (rescue)
1.0 African bullfrog, Grendel
1.0 Husband (WC) who approves of my addiction

It sounds like an infection of sorts. No expert on these matters but I would stay away from the chlorohex or any other meds for humans. The wrong dosage could kill a small snake. Maybe some listerine at a VERY weak solution? The best bet is to take to a vet. You can also try tetracyline that you can get at most pet stores that sell fish. However, I am not sure of the dosage. The dosage is milligrams per kilograms, so you need to know the approximate weight of your snake in kilograms. Sorry I cannot be of more help. Another alternative is to swap out the mouth with hydrogen peroxide and see if that helps. I am pretty sure the hydrogen peroxide is fairly safe in the mixtures sold over the counter for human use. Swab the gums with a Qtip, but use care not to damage any teeth.

Sounds like a bacterial infection and the early stages of infectious stomatitis. Probably should get help from a herp vet if there's one nearby. It’s extra tough with the little ones.
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Kevin's suggestion of Hydrogen Peroxide is sound.
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To that I would add an old remedy, but still pretty effective, is a vinegar rinse; many bugs like pseudomonas prefer to be in an alkaline environment and vinegar changes that.
Normally I beat folks up to keep Foxes cool, but these little ones may need to be kept a little warmer (80 - 82 F) till they are cured.
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The four or five bacterial culprits are common in many snake mouths, but it usually takes some environmental change or trauma to sway the balance in a negative direction.
It’s been my experience that both eastern and western Foxes do less well in very low humidity (less than 35%) and it's amazing how low it can go in your enclosure with winter heating. An unusually dry mouth can cause saliva (with bacteria cultures) to solidify and force open the mouth. Further drying can cause micro lesions for the bacteria to party. A damp cage can be worse, however.
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(As an aside, if or when you and your WC husband choose to keep CB children, if you live where there are long winters, a humidifier in the central heat system came dramatically reduce winter strep throats for many of the same reasons!)
Good Luck…
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Regards, Bill McGighan

You might want to try posting this on the "Herp Health & Breeding" Forum.
Many of us on here, who have had large collections for a very long time, are prone to "quacking" on our own animals.
The other forum is frequented by some real Vets and vet students.
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Regards, Bill McGighan

As the other's mentioned, it sounds like definite signs of infectious stomatitis(mouth rot).
i would also recommend you see a qualified reptile vet for this, but over the course of many years I have tended to several snakes owned by others that have had this problem. As mentioned, Hydrogen Peroxide is excellent for rinsing/swabbing the mouth out. Make sure you gently pry the snake's mouth open with a small blunt object that you can keep in there temporarily so you can rinse the mouth out well. Look real good for any "cheesy" looking tissue and gently remove it while you have it's mouth open, and while rinsing, make SURE TO KEEP the snake's mouth pointed down slightly to help ensure it flushes well and doesn't go down it's glottis tube(air pipe) on the floor of the mouth.

I did this at least twice a day for about a week and a half on a SEVERELY infected Boa Constrictor about 15 years ago, and it started to look much better within the week and went on to heal just fine in about two weeks. Yours should show signs of getting better within several days I'm thinking, but keep doing this for a good week or so until the swelling goes down and the mouth closes back to it's original position. A few extra days after that for good measure and it should be just fine.

I am actually surprised it is still eating to be honest. Most snakes that start getting those signs stop eating altogether. And of course, if left unattended, it can easily grow into secondary infections and infolve the lungs until they die. It is VERY important that you take care of this while you still can. It isn't hard, you just have to do this on a consistent schedule at least twice a day for a while.

Good luck getting the snake back to health!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com