Reptile & Amphibian Forums

While we are on the subject of the Lavender Brooks. Does anyone know where they originated from? I've heard different things so I just want to hear what You guys say.
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King Snakes! Who can make a better mouse trap?
J Sierra

I hope this isn't going to turn into a page long debate as it has in the past. There are a few mile long threads on the forums archives if you do a search. I will be at a herp show this weekend so i won't be around to follow up on more questions/answers.

The problem with Lavenders is three-fold. #1 there are fakes. #2 there are real ones that came from wildcaught stock backin the early 90's. #3 some Florida herpers insist that a lavender alboino was never found.

#1
there are many lavenders that came about by breeding the Calif lavender cal king into the florida king. back in the day when the first lavender cal kings appeared. floridian herprs decided to breed them into their "backyard snakes". Then these were bred back into Florida kings oiver several generations to appear more like a florida king. back in th early 90's I would travel down to the tampa show and there so many tables with these crossed lavender cal x Fl kings it was unreal.

#2
Tim Ricks and lloyd lemke lines came from wildcaught stock. I see to be able to tell those apart with fair consistency.

#3
I will just say to the Florida king hunters/collectors who say a lavender florida king was nevr found in the wild.. it is captive breeding that discovers traits like the hypo and others. You need to breed brother to sister to find out of that wildcaught stock you have has anything in it. That is how almost all traits get discovered. Not from finding a visual in the wild.
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www.Bluerosy.com

Ok Thats a good start. Do you know where the first true Lavs came from? was it Lemke?
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King Snakes! Who can make a better mouse trap?
J Sierra

I know of 2 lavenders hatching from different wild-caught females. I know all parties involved in collecting/breeding these animals.

1) An old canefield collector named Bill used to collect a lot of gravid kings every spring. He retained them until they laid eggs, then sold off the adults. One year, when it came hatching time, there was a single "white" kingsnake in a large group of normally colored hatchlings. At the time he said it was the first known true lavender Florida king. No longer having the mother, or able to identify any of the offspring as siblings, Bill kept that snake into its adulthood. It never bred for him, and eventually died at an old age.

2) David Justice collected a pair of kingsnakes near Ruskin in Hillsborough County. This is the same area the sulfur kings originated. The male was a large, aberrant patterned snake, and the female was typical looking for the area. Kevin Enge acquired these snakes from David Justice, and the female subsequently laid a small clutch (like 3 eggs). I'm unclear as to whether the female was already gravid, but it doesn't really matter. One of the hatchlings was a lavender. Kevin sold off all the offspring, and his adult pair never bred again. I don't know what became of the resulting offspring, but do remember one breeder, Kjun, offering lavender FL kings from the "Ruskin Line".

I've heard a few other stories of lavender FL kings being collected, or hatched, but without knowing the individuals involved, I have no way of verifying these stories.

I didn't know Ruskin was a good area for Florida Kings? I have collected some nice Corn Snakes in that area years ago.
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King Snakes! Who can make a better mouse trap?
J Sierra

...and there might still be kings there. I hunted the southern Hillsborough County area pretty hard from about 2005-2007, searching for kings. Most of cover in that area was pretty marginal, and most of the spots had become overgrown. The only kings I ever found in that area were in Brandon. I went back in December 2009, and almost all the cover I knew of down there had been cleaned up.

I live just east of the brandon area adn believe or not with the land clearing for housing developments and then abandoned with scrap piles and half built houses there are some snakes moving in. South Hillsborough has a few about 20 -30 acres in one non developed area that has been extremely good this spring but nothing worth keeping so far.
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Jimmy Tintle