Reptile & Amphibian Forums

http://www.wowt.com/news/headlines/96091024.html

...as a side note I am extremely dissappointed with many of you people here...you knew absolutely nothing about this man but many of you felt the need to take every pot shot you could take at him...was he on drugs or drunk? no. Does were he worked have anything to do with this? no. This was simply a tragic accident that couldve (and still could all it takes is one slip)happened to any one of us...you should be ashamed.

Sooner or later every one of us will die some of us will die from something totally ridiculous and people will make off hand comments about it. This is the reality of life.
If I am dumb enough to to willingly put a large snake around my neck and get choked to death because of it I deserve every bit of ridicule thrown at me. Ultimately however if this did happen I would not care as I would be dead. According to my personal religious beliefs I will either be in heaven and could care less what people here think of me or I will be in hell where what people think of me will be the least of my worries, or if my beliefs are wrong my consciousness will just end, Whichever way things play out it will make no difference to me what people left behind have to say.

No one here disputes that it was tragic. No one here has any less remorse for the family.
Questions about the owners possible incapacity occur when it is a 6' snake involved. To the ones who have years of experience with constrictors, it is unfathomable that we would be overpowered by a snake of that size.
Experience. That ultimately is the difference. The deceased had the snake for a year (don't know of his prior experience with snakes). Most here have 10 times that amount.
Bottom line is he was complacent with his animal. And it cost him his life. And it could possibly cost Nebraska herpers their ability to keep large constrictors. It will certainly give AR people ammo in the war.
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1.0 Albino American alligator, "Smoke"
1.1 American alligator,"Al Bite Ya & Molly"
1.1 Purple Albino Reticulated Pythons, "Gumbo & Abita"
0.1 Eastern Gaboon Viper, "Gabbie" Recently passed away at 24 years old
Help me find this snake!

So no longer can we say that Boa constrictors have not "killed people".

Sure, its bad stuff. "Tragic" as it may be, I look at it as walking up and pulling a horses tail. Act carelessly around that animal in that way enough, and you are going to end up dead.

Speculating as to whether or not an individual was impaired at the time an accident occurred is no cause for shame. In fact it would be standard investigative procedure.

It is not the same as saying that the victim MUST have been impaired.

That is an important distinction to make before accusing people of taking pot-shots. So, who's guilty of the false assumptions and accusations in this picture?

No need for me to remain absent here. I was one who had plenty to say and I'm not ashamed or sorry. My questions/concerns should/will be answered in due time. That will settle that.

As for the potential damage done to the hobby, guess that will play out in due time, as well.

That being said, I will admit it is difficult to maintain a generous and charitable demeanor, when being held to much higher standard than others, due to ingrained cultural bias and ignorance, by those that continuously make hay of the fact, in order to pursue and propel their own very judgmental agenda.

jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

I'm not ashamed, either. Was it 6', or was it 9'? The article said 25lbs. A fat 6' boa atill isn't 25lbs, and a 9' boa is rather large, most likely weighing more than 25lbs. Two adults with their faculties intact can certainly remove even a 9' animal by starting at the tail, usually. There's still more to this than meets the eye.

That said, it's just plain stupid to walk around with even a 6' snake wrapped around your neck. I assume this was indoors, as doing it outside in public is foolhardy, and gived the AR idiots something to complain about. Many people ARE deathly afraid of snakes...no reason to scare them. In my opinion, it's like some guy walking around with his zipper undone...on purpose.

>>It was nine feet, according to the most recent articles. This was one of four or five major details that "evolved" as the story grew.
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>>Pretty much every snake owner I know agrees there is more to the story, with theories ranging from alcohol/drugs to a subtle medical condition to "something spicy" people do not want known. The real question will be whether the autopsy looks for anything beyond the snake damage.
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I agree, I hope the police get an unbiased snake expert involved. Sure it's a tragedy, but that's besides the point. The story is suspect, if for no other reason the people explaining what happened weren't even there. Maybe I'm being too critical, but this just doesn't make any sense to me - "The family said that when Cory reached over his shoulder to put the snake in its cage, the boa got scared and reached for something to hold on to. Before he knew it, the snake was wrapped around his neck."

And of course there is the obligatory fear mongering and blaming of pet owners in the article:

"Many said at the time it was harmless. Even though this snake is a bit smaller, only six-feet long, others still realized the potential danger. 'That snake was big enough, it could probably take down a kid for sure,' said Tom Dewitt."

'Langan suspects the snake was a pet, got too big for its owner to care for, and was released into the wild.'

I did'nt say anything earlier but...
I've had a bunch of 30 lb Columbians most were about 7 1/2 foot females. A 9 foot Columbian would be a huge one.
One of the main points in my show is "not everyone needs a big snake."
Sorry to say this indiviual did not need a "big' snake.
Typically I don't view Columbian Boas as big snakes.
Of course everything is relative.
I feel sorry for his kids but as has been mentioned I am furious that someone "allowed" a Columbian boa to kill them.
I have a 13 foot 120 lb female Rock python that is an absolute beast. I've been saying for a couple of years that that snake will kill me. Not by constriction but a heart attack. Wrestling with that snake exhausts me. Yes, more often than not I'm by myself. Throw in a 13 foot Green and several 15 foot plus Retics.
It is a bad idea to move them by yourself but if yourself is all you got...
I am writing up a statement. That if the worst case scenario were to happen. I'm aware of the suggested protcol and agree with it. No I don't practice it but I do agree with multiple handlers for large snakes. I would also love help moving the crocs but once again...
Sometimes I get my wife but you can just look at her and she gets a whelt, or bruise or a scar.So she is a last resort.
I am not impaired in anyway and fully take all responsibility for my snake handling practices. I often put large snakes around my neck(not the Rock lol) and around the necks of others. I use to put my first retic around my neck when I was 15 and now 38 years later I still do.
As has been stated grab the snake by the tail and any reasonably competent adult should be able to unwind a snake up to 12 feet in length.
After that, technique won't be enough. You will have to have some strength.
People will critisize me for taking risks because in the event an accident does occur it would be a black eye for big snake owners.
I'll say it again though I know I sound like a jerk. not everyone needs a big snake. D.C.

I've seen a couple of real 10' boas, and they were immense. Bulkier than Burms at that length. As for being worried about handling an animal, well....I'm over 200lbs, 6'5"....but I had a 12' Papuan Olive that was the strongest snake I've ever had. Always wanted to climb "up", and I always gave it the utmost respect. 32lbs of solid muscle. Scary strong. But even then, 2 people would have no problem handling it.

I've seen 10 foot boas also but they were true redtails not Columbians.
I also think a 10 foot boa would be scarier than a 10 foot Burm.
But I don't think 10 foot Burms are that scarey.
Pound for pound I had an 8 foot male Yellow Anaconda that was my most powerful snake.
I don't really KNOW if he was the most powerful or if he just had the DESIRE. lol D.C.

Yes. Both of the 10' ones I saw were pure red-tails. One was at the Staten Island zoo, the other was in a personal collection

My female Peruvian is every bit 9' and I do respect her. She is hard to manage just because she is so bulky. The largest Boa I've ever owned.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

It has been my experience pythons are much stronger pound for pound than Boas. Pythons are normally much thinner, but don't let that fool ya.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

"I have a 13 foot 120 lb female Rock python that is an absolute beast. I've been saying for a couple of years that that snake will kill me. Not by constriction but a heart attack. Wrestling with that snake exhausts me. Yes, more often than not I'm by myself. Throw in a 13 foot Green and several 15 foot plus Retics. "

It's amazing how then can produce two coils to replace the one you just removed, isn't it? I once had my cat jump in the way of my 18 foot burm durring feeding time, when I pull the cat away from her, she started coiling around me and swallowed my arm up to the elbow. It was extremely annoying, to have to wait for her to realize that she would not be able to finish the job, but certainly not life threating.

Cliff I totlly agree.
In fact when I do shows that adults are present. Right after not every... I say of course this does'nt mean the Federal Govt. should dictate who has giant snakes. I tell them most cities have dangerous animal ordinances blah blah.
It breaks the flow and bores the kids but I'm trying to get the word out. I end it with when your young with your parents guidance you can pick an appropriate pet. when you get older you just have to use common sense.
The parents like the guidance part. Of course this comes from someone who at 16 had a 4 foot cottonmouth in their bedroom.
My parents were great but looking back they should have put their foot down on retics and venemous. D.C.
Once again that's parents not the govt.

It couldn't happen to me, I could no more be killed by 9 ft boa then I could be killed by a kitty cat. This person obviously had other health issues unrelated to the snake. In the states an autopsy would have been performed to find the real cause of death.