Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I have a question about het breeding different lines. To keep it simple, a good example will be using the 'coral' line albino bred to the 'lipstick' line albino. I hope I explain this one right.
Frist off, if you breed a het lipstick to a het lipstick you will get lipstick albinos.. Kinda like breeding a het coral to a het coral you will get coral albinos.. And I already know both of the 'lines' are still albino at the end of the day..

But, If you breed a Coral Albino to a het lipstick albino, would it be true that all the albinos in the litter would be Coral and Lipstick, and all the hets would just be het coral albino because they are het because the coral albino was the recessive trait.
Now same question but breeding a het lipstick to a het coral. Wouldnt that make all the visable albinos lipstick and coral. But with the hets(yea I know they will be 66% but kinda not the point) will be either het lipstick OR het coral.. I mean, they are only getting the het from one parent, because if they got the albino influence from both parents, then they would be albino coral lipstick..
Am I correct here..
I mean if you bred 2 different co-dom morphs you get the same outcome.. For example if you bred a hypo to a jungle. Both are the het form of the super. So the so called 'hets' would be in the visable form. Lets just say the hypos represent the het lipsticks from first example, the jungles represent the het corals, and the hypo jungles would represent the lipstick X coral albinos.
What are your opinions. Does this sound about right?

I need say many people make a big mistake with Albino Boas
and Hets that come from Coral Albino Breeding's.

They make the mistake of labeling these Boas as Coral Albino's
and het Coral Albino's even though they do not
exhibit the Coral trait.

This leads to a bunch of Albino Boas named Coral that never
show the Coral color trait.

In the case of a Coral Albino Boas, they are not automatically
coral ,they must Coral up and show that
they are Coral Albino Boas.

When speaking about lipstick Line, they are just that Lipstick
Line Boas.You breed Lipstick line Boa to something else ,
you can label the babies as Lipstick Line.

Although in my opinion the breeding pair should be stated
and then the babies are a product of that pairing
so they should be labeled as such.

" Baby Albino is a product of a Lipstick Albino X Coral Albino Breeding."

Once again to be a Coral Albino it must show the Coral trait !

High contrast Albino Boas from a Coral breeding are not
automatically Coral Albino's.

Many people are making this mistake and just
continues on down over and over.

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz

I Support USark.org

good question, see a lot of albinos labeled coral and they're as yellow as a banana with a pink scale here and there. i was wandering or had a quesion about the "lipstick" line. what significant differences are exhibited by snakes with this label? does it work more like the pastel trait or more like a recessive or dominant gene would? who was responsible for its lineage, and so forth? any help would be great.

Correct me if I'm wrong Lar, I agree with how you put it but with some of my extra thoughts, lipstick and coral are not morphs they are line bred animals. so if you even breed coral x coral, that doesn't mean all the babies are going to be coral albinos, some may take on the line trait and some may not. I believe all babies untill they are physicly without a doubt showing the coral look should all be labled possible corals.

Zack
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Zack Greens Reptiles

I agree Zack Coral Albino can only be possible Coral until it
actually shows Coral coloring.

As far as Lipstick or Coral goes I agree they are lines with
certain or specific selectively bred traits.

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz

I Support USark.org

Sounds good to me. Does anyone know if there is a better Coral outcome with Coral X Arabesque? I see some mighty nice ones on here.
Thanks,
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

U can only produce Lipsticks by using lipstick line animals that came from Tom Burke. Lipstick line means at some point they had that bloodline in them but they may not be able to produce Lipsticks. Tom is/was only able to produce Lipsticks from a particular group of 1.2 boa's. He breed that male to other females and had no luck producing Lipsticks. He had the same results breeding those 2 females to other males. Now if you breed a true Lipstick to a truer Lipstick you will produce Lipsticks like the ones MikeP just produced.

Joe

Joe, you are 100% correct.

Again, I was using the lipstick and coral as an example of 'line' breeding.. But back to the example, can you get a lipstick coral by crossing these lines?

I haven't bred these 2 together since I don't own any lipstick albinos, but I would THINK that your offspring would consist of babies showing traits of the lipstick and coral, since these are just line bred animals.

Just my 2 cents
Zack
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Zack Greens Reptiles

If you bred a lipstick to a coral, how would you tell which ones exhibited the coral trait, the lipstick trait, and which would exhibit both? Can you tell visually? What about future breedings of the coral x lipstick babies??

Amie

when babies 95% of the time you cant tell if it's going to coral up or not so there's not much of a way to tell which has coral influences, atleast I cant anyways. So any offspring from the coral line should be labled possible coral, not coral because it might not coral up.

Zack
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Zack Greens Reptiles

Tom Burke coined the line "lipstick" because he said it looked like someone had taken lipstick and drawn on the saddles.

Coral albinos are "coral" because of the color they develop over time in between the saddles and on the laterals.

So, theoretically, yes, you could have a coral lipstick albino or sunglow. The offspring could pick up the "lipstick" trait from one parent and the "coral" trait from the other.

Obviously, the animal would have to be raised for a little while to figure out whether or not it was going to "coral up" but the "lipstick" trait should be evident from day one.

jb
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What's written above is purely my opinion. In fact, MOST of what you read on the internet is someone's opinion. Don't take it too seriously

Jonathan Brady
DeviantConstrictors.com
Deviant Constrictors picturetrail

I have to admit, I'm not very well versed when it comes to coral albinos.

Thanks!
Amie

And please correct me if I'm wrong....

Lipsticks are line bred from Tom Burke and so far Lipsticks are only produced from Lipstick x Lipstick line animals.

Corals express the trait over time so it's not clear which babies will express the Coral trait until you raise them up.

So, Lipstick x Coral would produce babies that may propogate the Lipstick line while not being Lipstick themselves AND, might express the Coral trait when raised up.

If correct, the only way to get a "Lipstick/Coral Albino would be with at least two generations of breeding.
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Thanks,

Dave Colling

www.rainbows-r-us-reptiles.com

0.1 Wife (WC and still very fiesty)
0.2 kids (CBB, a big part of our selective breeding program)

LOL, to many snakes to list, last count (02/01/2010):
42.61 BRB
27.40 BCI
And those are only the breeders

lots.lots.lots feeder mice and rats

I agree with Jonathon Brady. You dont need an F2 to make Coral lipsticks. And I know this because I have a coral lipstick. This is my sunglow motley in which one parent was a coral and the other was a lipstick. When this animal was young it was a lipstick. And now has coraled up very nicely and I believe its a visable Coral lipstick. Here are some old baby pics showing the lipstick trait and some new pics showing the coral trait.

The coral could be from Tom's line too. I have seen some that were straight from Tom that had unreal coraling. I have a bunch of Lipstick animals and the coral is there. The guy that has rubbed most the wrong way, Mr. Matt T, has an awesome sunglow from Tom that coraled up nicely.

Can you post some pics of these coral lipsticks... Thanks

The main purpose of the post was to get opinions about line breeding cause I have 2 males waiting to breed this female Coral lipstick above and im not sure what male to breed. Both males are 100% het albino okay. The first male came straight off Tom burke and is a 100% pure het lipstick. So if I bred him to my female, I should get nice looking lipsticks that should coral up as the age. Im leaning more towards this male for the breeding to keep the lipstick pure, and with the intensity of the coral in the female.
My other option is male #2. He was produced from a Coral X lipstick breeding. One parent was a coral albino while the other parent was het for lipstick that was produced by Tom Burke. Now, since this male #2 was not a visible albino, I can only assume that it got its 'het' from the coral albino, therefore I may be led to believe it has no lipstick influence, because if it did it would be albino. Am i correct? And with that theory in mind, male #1 would be a better choice, IMO... But then again, male #2 could produce all lipsticks and corals and Id have no idea. Opinions...