Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I got a white throat female over a month ago from a breeder that will remain anonymous . This white throat is around 2 years old little over 2 feet svl and was housed with 5 grown male black throats before I purchased her . I housed her at ebv for rehab about a month and she didn't eat so when I returned her home she basically did the same thing . I am thinking it's vet time or force feeding time because she killed a mouse but refused to eat it and when she was at ebv I was told she would eat sometimes and sometime she wouldn't . I got her to breed with my male but at this point I'm just trying to keep her alive any info or help would be greatly appreciated . A little more info I have already checked temps and offered multiple food items and put electrolytes in her water .

Something to understand, varanids feed. There is rarely a need to force feed them. If she is walking, then she will feed on her own.

Female varanids feed even when gravid, only at this time, they know what size prey they can pass, so at times, they will only consume prey that is very small.

Also, I didn't know there was A breeder of albigs. A breeder is somewhat how continually successfully produces them. Cheers

It took me a long time to find this female I bought about 3 different black throats before finding her . She will kill mice and not eat them and she is horribly skinny so yesterday I offered her boiled eggs and a hisser roach she doesn't have a great feeding response at all but she did take on the hisser and eat some of eggs so I guess I have to be patient as long as she's taking some form of food . I just want to get her weight up because she's way to skinny right now . I appreciate your input thanks

Your story sounds very odd. A 2 ft female housed with 5 adult males? Yeah, a breeder does that.

Super skinny, won't eat? And you haven't given any details of your husbandry?

With the info provided, sounds like your very typical wild caught albig sold as "captive bred" and suffering from horrible husbandry.

And you have run through 3 others? Not a good situation for the monitor.

If you truly want some help, come clean on the "breeder" and post details of your husbandry. That is where your solution will be found.
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robyn@proexotics.com

ShipYourReptiles.com
Pro Exotics Reptiles

As in reply to robyn I did not release the breeders name not to cause a problem as I am rehabbing her and like to think I got her in a better situation with me when she now has her own enclosure . In response to me going through 3 other bt I have been buying bt sold to me as females but when I get them of course they are males so I resale them to friends that are looking for a bt . I currently only have one bt my male and my female wt that are in separate enclosures . As for what I'm housing her in is a 4ft long by 2 1/2 high by 3 feet deep until she gains some weight then I will switch up to my bigger enclosure . I have wood chips non toxic bedding hot side around 95 and the heat holds pretty well in my house so the heat is on a timer switching on to off as in to summer I dont really have to run heat lamps at all . She has a hide box and a water dish she can fit her whole body in if she chooses to . Night temp drops to mid to low 70's she has a 12 hour night/day cycle and when I go to change her water she defends herself so that is a good sign that she still has fight in her . Robyn if you would like to know where I purchased her from pm me .

"hot side around 95 and the heat holds pretty well in my house so the heat is on a timer switching on to off as in to summer I dont really have to run heat lamps at all ."

There's half your problem right there. Monitors need a basking spot and this means basking lights as a source of heat. What you'll need to do is set up a basking area large enough to cover her whole body and head (you may need to line up two or three basking light fixtures in a row to achieve this) with a surface basking temperature of at least 130F. This may not be possible in the small enclosure you've currently got her set up in, because the whole thing will probably overheat.

a 4 foot cage is easy to set up a 130F basking spot. But yes you have multiple problems. Too little heat, very poor substrate, I'm assuming here but I bet you have a screen top cage and probably a habba-hut hide spot.

In reality 95F won't stop a monitor from eating, they just won't eat much or digest it very efficiently. Dehydration on the other hand will stop them from eating. Monitors will keep eating at almost room temperature. Having dealt with the "pet store" mentality of keeping reptiles the single most consistant factor I have seen for loss of appetite is dehydration.

Read the FAQ page on Varanus.net or even Robyn's care sheet's at ProExotics.com It won't give you everything but might give you a start.

Good Luck

I have her in a wooden enclosure that heats up well over 100 on its own in the day time that is why I try to keep the temp down . Glass Screen enclosures are for geckos and chameleons not monitors but this still does not explain her not eating at ebv where I know they had her set up right and I had her in my 6 ft enclosure when I first got her with a 130 uvb basking bulb no go she still would not eat .

I will make necessary changes an continue at it thanks for your input everyone

This is not a knock on EBV. They are a fine company, But..... It is generally not feasible for pet shops to set up a monitor "right". It's not their job to do that. It's their job to set it up "right now" and keep it alive until it sells.

"I have her in a wooden enclosure that heats up well over 100 on its own in the day time".

Yes, you mentioned earlier that the enclosure heats up to the point that it doesn't require any heat in summer for ambient temperature. I'm going to give Nate the benefit of the doubt and assume that he had not have seen that comment of yours, but for what it's worth that's why I said it would be tricky to set up a hot basking area in a 4' tank without overheating the whole enclosure.

UV bulbs tend not to throw off that much heat compared to similar wattage halogens or other floods, so even with a 130W UV bulb there may not have been enough of a basking spot.

As for Nate's other comments, yes, I'm aware that healthy monitors already eating will not stop just because they have no access to a basking spot. I am also aware that lack of humidity is a big problem. However, having no basking spot is not helping matters and is definitely one of the things that needs to be addressed, no matter what. That's why I said "there's half your problem right there". I didn't say it was the entire issue, as I was aware that the monitor was not eating before they received it, but I'm willing to bet that it's accounting for at least half.

It's threads like these that are the reason I haven't posted on this forum in years. I thought I was simply trying to help someone with their monitor, but no, I have to explain myself to Nate instead. ugh

And this is why I don't like them because of hurt feelings...

If you add high heat right now to a monitor that is already severely dehydrated that is in a cage with too high of an airflow you will KILL the monitor very very quickly. And I stand by my statement that a 4ft cage is a breeze to get a 130F basking spot. I'm sorry my friend but I live in a freaking desert and can get 150F in 30 gal tanks with a cool side in the high 70's. It's operator error not the cage. I do understand that sometimes it can be too hot to heat a cage. But that's not the cage size fault. If your room is in the high 80s or low 90's it wouldn't matter how big the cage is...

I'm not worried about your feelings. I'm worried about his monitor. Hydrate FIRST and then address the other issues.

You're confusing annoyance with hurt feelings.

You can come here and not explain yourself. Your advice was good, So was Nates. Which one actually fit the situation, is still questionable.

Of course, what appears to be missing at the lastest stop for this monitor is a temp choice. 100F ambient sucks the big one. So the base temp here is what needs work.

What occurred at EDV tells me that there is something wrong with the animal in the first place. Something like organ damage.

A history of one whitethroat female(small) in with five Blackthroat males(very large) would stress and and kill any dang heathy monitor. Hopefully that story was a fabrication. No breeder would do that.

So all in all, it may not be the temps, but instead the history of this animal.

Lastly Dave, you can state your position and not worry about others having other angles or views. As long as both are working towards the same goal, to help the monitor.

But if you feel that everyone must agree with you, and not have their own views,then yes, you best stay away. Cheers

That's exactly what I was thinking that something is wrong with the animal because ebv isn't petsmart they have they knowledge and hold
there animals to the right temps and care . I wish I did fabricate the story but it is true as the air we breathe this small monitor was housed in this store(not ebv) with multiple grown Bt . I think I might still take her to the vet and it seems the search will continue for a healthy female albig .

" If your room is in the high 80s or low 90's it wouldn't matter how big the cage is... "

I suggest you try this before you comment. According to you, I shouldn't give any of my monitors basking spots for the entire summer. The room they are in stays in the high 80s for most of the summer. The enclosure sizes vary from the very small to the very large. They all have thermostats which act as 'kill' switches, turning off the basking spots when the ambient temperature in the enclosure gets too high (36C = ~97F). On a normal day, I have no problem getting really hot basking spots in really small enclosures, provided the monitors in that enclosure are small enough to fit under a fairly tight basking spot rather than a whole bank of lights.

On a particularly hot day, however, the kill switches may turn off the basking lights for the small enclosures but rarely do for the larger enclosures. That's because the basking spots in the larger enclosures are far enough away from the cool end of the enclosure, where the thermostat probes are, to not overheat the enclosures. Even though those basking spots are made up of banks of lights.

Now let's relate that to this particular thread. The monitor in this thread is big enough to warrant a small bank of basking lights, at least two, possibly three lights. The room the enclosure is in gets quite hot - this has been mentioned by the O.P. twice already. In my opinion, trying to attain the hot basking spot required in an enclosure that's less than twice the length of the enclosure is going to be tricky.

that should read "that's less than twice the length of the animal"

Lol at dk this is actually my first post even though I have many friends on the forums . I will always take account in what someone else opinion that's why I posted it . I will try over the next couple of days to make adequate changes and yes it very tricky to get that basking spot with limited space . I put pedialite in her water and maybe it will just take time but I appreciate you guys help thanks

The only time it is tricky is when your ambients in the room are too high. If you are 78 or under it truly is easy and should be a requirement everyone should learn before getting a reptile. Small fire sit close. You should not need any bigger than a 45 watt bulb in the summer, Maybe a 65w if ya keep your house like a refrigerator. I have 2 gouldi crosses in a 6ft trough right now in a room with 80 degree ambients. The hotspot is 137 at last check and the cool side is....wait for it....78...crazy huh, the cool spot is cooler than the ambient in the room...Now that's tricky..

Your issues are indeed husbandry related, as in poor husbandry. Husbandry can be fixed, but it needs to happen soon.

FR is right, history is going to play a large part of the overall picture and future, especially with an older animal like this.

A billion dollars says it is a wild caught animal. I wish folks didn't get okey-doked so often.

This is a primary reason why I strongly encourage folks to acquire new monitors as hatchlings, and not as worn and stressed out WC adults.

Blackthroats come in as imported hatchlings each season, and can be of extremely high quality (and also low quality). Whitethroats, hardly ever.

There is a ton of husbandry info at our site, caresheet and FAQ section. Get a copy of the Savannah Monitor book by Bennett as well. Super valuable as a reference.

Best of luck.
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robyn@proexotics.com

ShipYourReptiles.com
Pro Exotics Reptiles

Curious to when the downturn occured, the order of events is hard to piece together. After you say she mated with your male? before? Was she gravid an any point during these events?
What locale is this albig?

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WWW.LIZARDRC.COM

That was someone selling an imported wild caught monitor as captive bred to get a higher price, or to convince you of the higher quality.
Set the lizard up in a bigger closed top cage with a temperature gradient from just above 68f on one end ambient, to around 85f as the highest ambient temp on the opposite end. Moisture is provided by proper substrate, any albig Ive ever had seems to love dirt, not clay, but good dirt that packs hard, and holds a great burrow. they do like to climb.
Set up a large basking spot that allows the entire lizards body on it to warm up evenly using multiple low wattage standard bulbs at about a foot away, then adjust closer or farther by the surface temperature try for 130-145f (infared thermometer).
Heres one that was raised that way, shes just shy of 7ft and around 11 years old if I remember right.