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I recently put a deposit down on an '09 Caramel Albino Female Ball with the hopes of breeding her to my 100% het Caramel male. But someone told me that there are issues with the full Caramel females not being able to lay fertilized eggs and that I would be better off with a het female and a full male instead. Does anyone else have any input on this? My het male is NERD stock and the female was from a pair of hets that are 8 Ball stock. Thanks!

never heard of that before, but caramels do have genetic kinking issues. i doubt tho that a het or visual would influence that either way tho, since from what i understand its tied into the caramel gene. kinda like wobbling with spiders. im sure someone thats bred some caramels will chime in before too long tho.
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caramel females produce viable young just as well as hets or normals for that matter! ive never seen that as a issue! nor have i heard of that one before! some morphs do have there quirks though~! like spiders wobble, caramels kinking, super black pastels, duck billing, and pieds having pickier than normal feeding habits, and maybe others have things going on as well! but no caramel females can breed just fine! just try to out cross the bloodline to youre best ability! regards

"caramel females produce viable young just as well as hets or normals for that matter! ive never seen that as a issue!"

When you report not seeing this are you saying you have produced good eggs from caramel females or just that you haven't read about it being an issue?

I know EBN and others have reported some good eggs but I've also read several reports of all slugs. I'm wondering if whatever allows some breeders to avoid the kinking might also be allowing them to produce good eggs. If we can figure out what that is, perhaps we can put both the known and possible issues behind us. I'm not accusing anyone of withholding a solution; I think it just might be something unexpected like nutrition or some environmental variable that can overcome a problem genetic tendency that just hasn't been recognized yet.

Thanks for the reply. The way it was told to me made me think that it was something that was tied to the recessive gene that was affecting the female's ability to produce viable eggs while not affecting the males. That way a het female wouldn't have that issue much like a het spider won't have any head wobble issue while a full spider might. Anyway, I'm glad to hear that it's not an issue. I love the caramels and am excited about adding them to my breeding projects.

Thanks again!

Also, I've heard there are at least 2 lines of caramels that are not compatible.
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Snakes
Lizards
Tortoises
Dogs
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DH who puts up with it all

Yeah I'm an idiot like that sometimes. I've been working 12 hour days non-stop for a couple of weeks now so my brain is not all where it should be. Spiders are co-doms not recessives... I knew that... really...

Thanks for the info on the incompatible caramels though. Any idea which ones?

My friend has never had a problem with his,I agree some pythons have things that are a pain to deal with.
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1.0 100%het albino
0.1 100%het albino
1.0 pastel
0.1 spider
0.1 pastel
1.0 butter
0.1 albino hc
1.0 orange ghost
0.1 100%het pied poss het albino ringer
1.0 med pied
0.1 pewter
1.0 pinstripe
1.0 pastel

That's good to know. Thanks for the reply!

this is false i personally wtnessed females on eggs at a local breeder in nh

That's true, I know Scott at CV Exotics has Caramels. I'll have to ask him if he's heard of any problems with them. I assume it's not all Caramels but most likely certain lineages that might be affected.

Does anyone have a picture of a carmel female on a good clutch eggs?

Sean Bradley from EBN has a video, and somebody else posted pix of females on eggs over at the bush league breeders club.

What is the Bush League Breeder's club...? Andrew

I don't think there has ever been a picture of a carmel female on good eggs posted anywhere but for sure not on the BLBC. I belive there is a reward so start posting those pic people

>>I don't think there has ever been a picture of a carmel female on good eggs posted anywhere but for sure not on the BLBC. I belive there is a reward so start posting those pic people

Here is a link to Sean's youtube video.

Seans video.

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John Vandegrift

Cool thanks