Reptile & Amphibian Forums

I really hate to throw such an over-used word like discrimination around but honestly thats what this whole thing is starting to boil down to...reptile owners are being discriminated against by every side both pro-pet(the majority of the "puppies and kittens are the only suitable pets" crowd) and by the no-pets types (HSUS,USFW,PETA).
Discriminated against,slandered,un-fairly judged,and totally and completely misunderstood (much like the animals we keep).
Personally I'm more than tired of the hypocrisy of these people:dogs kill several people a year (mostly children or strangers)and yet no ban on them (and no there shouldnt be)feral cats are neutered/spayed THEN RELEASED BACK INTO THE WILD! to continue killing tons of native wildlife,while the pythons are slaughtered.
Not to mention the hundreds of "nuisance" alligators killed by humans every year,and they are worried the Burmese Pythons will eat them all? The whole thing makes me sick to my stomach.

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1.0 c.b.02' 7' Pastel Colombian Boa(thanks Bill!)"Maverick"
0.1 c.b.06' 6' Firebelly x Pastel boa "Betty Boa"
0.1 c.b. 07 5' Amazon Basin Redtail Boa"Lola Boa"1.0 c.b. 05 6' Blonde Bullsnake "Boo"
1.0 c.b. 05'2' Snow Corn "Zero"
1.0 wc 4' Fl.Cornsnake "Iggy"
0.1 cb 18"Okeetee Cornsnake "Bella"
1.0 wc 3'everglades x yellow ratsnake "Achmed"
1.1 wc LTC Southern WhiteLip PYthons "Thorne and Ariel"

Yes. I'm hopeful we will one of these days file a lawsuit for libel, slander, defamation, and for discrimination on all our behalf.
It could happen.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

I used to think that also, but after I joined this yahoo pet law discussion group, I realized that was a misconception on my part because I was not aware of what was going on with other segments of the pet industry. Dog breeders have been under attack as "puppy mills" far longer than I have been into herps and they are much more experience with AR movements than we are. They have only recently noticed us, but have been attacking more traditional pet and livestock owners for decades longer.

This group consists of 3500 very broad-based and experienced members of all segments of the pet industry and they have a lot of insights to offer us. I would recommend that everyone here join this group and learn from it. It includes a lot of herpers and exotics breeders, not just dogs and cats.
Just a word of caution when setting up your account: at the bottom of the account set-up screen, select the last message option to view messages on the website. Do not receive them as email messages in your inbox. there are at least 100 new messages every day and you wont want to read all of them and have them clogging up your in box. Each state also has its own state pet law group and I would suggest you sign on to those as well.
Pet Law Yahoo Group

feral cats are neutered/spayed THEN RELEASED BACK INTO THE WILD! to continue killing tons of native wildlife,

As I understand the argument, removing a feral cat just means others will move in to take its place; whereas neutering and returning an established cat will result in it defending its teritory from other cats but being unable to make more cats.
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Chris McMartin
www.mcmartinville.com
I'm Not a Herpetologist, but I Play One on the Internet

considering that we almost completely wiped out the American Bison that is an absolutely ridiculous argument. Not to mention I took out the feral cat population on my property several years ago and only recently have any started returning.
I guess sooner or later I'll taking it out for another several years.

considering that we almost completely wiped out the American Bison that is an absolutely ridiculous argument.

Who's talking bison, or human extirpation by hunting? I'm ONLY talking cats. I don't think they were to blame for reducing bison populations.

Not to mention I took out the feral cat population on my property several years ago and only recently have any started returning.

I don't have any of the research to cite...just repeating what I think is the spay/neuter/release crowd's rationale. I'm not a fan of cats.
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Chris McMartin
www.mcmartinville.com
I'm Not a Herpetologist, but I Play One on the Internet

My point was we don't need to spay and neuter and then rerelease animals to help keep the population down. we can just kill them outright. The bison are just an very good example of how we are capable of completely wiping out a species (or almost) that once numbered in the millions (as are wolves and large cats and countless others.).
I see absolutely no logic to capturing a mammalian predator with a rather high metabolism that has been proven to prey on native wildlife and then turning it back loose in the wild fixed or not.
Seeing that I live in Fl. where the attitude toward burms and nile monitors that eat far less native wildlife than feral cats do is to kill them on site (no keeping them for pets either btw just kill em...fwc's orders) this logic really makes no sense to me. Either keep it as a pet or kill it.

Yes. I see your point. It's the Humaniacs that can't see killing the poor darlings. They can't see past their noses as to the damage those cute kitties do.

Talk about hoarders. Most of those types are hoarders. An ex-father in law was like that. Very selfish/emotion/feelings driven and short sighted mentality. Neighbor at my last place used to breed the heck out of them with absolutely no control. Very inconsiderate of him, I must say.

Seems we do a better job of controlling our Reptilian pets, doesn't it.

Since you really can't legally discharge a firearm in most municipalities, I usually round the stays up when they come on my property and become a problem (live trap) and then I take them to the animal shelter. The shelter puts them down if there's no chance they'll tame down. They don't neuter and release.

I have neutered/spayed a few and kept them. Have one now. A semi pet.

Like I said, It's an emotionally driven issue. Logic doesn't enter into it. That is a shame.

jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

The law typically makes distinctions between wild animals and domesticated animals, livestock and companion animals, and so forth.

In a legal sense this is not exactly discrimination.

So, good luck with that lawsuit...

The NATURE NAZI is back.
We've been through this before Steph. Same comment as before from you.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

Godwin's Law.

You lose!

I don't believe there could ever be a lawsuit based on discrimination on feral vs domestic animals but Staph your the one that is lost. You have LOST respect of every single person on this forum I'd wager a long time ago. It's also likely you've lost at life in terms of happiness and just appreciation of being alive in this wonderful world we live in. Your comments instead of being stimulative usually become just plain old rehash of your same gobblygook of alienating almost everyone you reply to. Just go back under the bridge and look for Box Turtles and hope BIG BILLY GOAT GRUFF doesn't try to cross the bridge. It's not likely you'll understand that as it was before your time but some here will...
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Tom Crutchfield
www.tomcrutchfield.com

Such a shame I am not as worldly, intelligent, perceptive, astute, noble, scholarly and wise as you. Oh well.
Perhaps you should go elsewhere to find the stimulating conversation more attuned to and more deserving of your sophistication.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

"The law typically makes distinctions between wild animals and domesticated animals, livestock and companion animals, and so forth."

Not sure what your reply has to do with the topic at hand. Maybe it's just me. Seems like your standard false premise for the argument.

"So, good luck with that lawsuit..."

Not to mention your standard cynical tone of contempt.

jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer