Reptile & Amphibian Forums

do with all your boas???? will you still breed them and uthenize the babies and adults you dont want anymore? would you sell them like drugs? will you let them go to piss off the government? would you uthenize your entire collection? would you just keep them and not breed them? what will you do???

What boas?

boa constrictors is what's on the list so I'm assuming that means anything with the name boa tagged on it.

I will move to spain and take mine with. Honestly the Lacey act will not happen. Also everyone for the love of God...vote republican!

Think again.

In fact, I'm betting on the fact that it WILL happen, and that we'll have to fight it. I think it will get reversed by the courts because they're LESS political (not politics free mind you) and "facts" will actually matter there. Gordon Rodda has CLEARLY demonstrated his lack of respect for facts with his response to USARK. And Rodda's bosses are CERTAINLY backing him. Ken Salazar wants to make an example out of Burms, and boas are tied right in there with them.

I OPENLY plea for anyone to show me evidence that the USFWS will not follow the recommendation of the USGS or NPS/ENP. From everything I've seen, they are in FULL support of those two orgs - both of which are in full support of banning burms and anything like them. And why wouldn't they be? They all fall under the Department of the Interior and they all have a common boss, Ken Salazar. I want to be wrong on this so please, someone, accept my plea and prove me wrong.

This is NO LONGER a US House of Representatives and US Senate situation. That part is dead and they will have ABSOLUTELY NO BEARING ON THIS SITUATION. This is a USFWS deal. And if you think politics are bad in Congress... just wait. You'll be AMAZED at the number of blind eyes that are turned and backs that are scratched by the nepotistic DOI organizations.

What will I do if this gets passed... what boas? I don't have boas...

jb
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What's written above is purely my opinion. In fact, MOST of what you read on the internet is someone's opinion. Don't take it too seriously

Jonathan Brady
DeviantConstrictors.com
Deviant Constrictors picturetrail

There are certain things that I don't see changing when taking into consideration the opposition. In my simplistic reply I was taking into account the groups yay will oppose the act, and by the way I'm specifically speaking with regards to the boa constrictor part of it, I think the burms, retics, African rocks and others should be put a fork through cause they're done. And with terms of bias because of the love for them, the amount of people who own them, because these people will invest in usark and make the necessary calls to their representatives, etc. Other things I don't see happening is Rowe vs. Wade over turned, 2nd amendment rights changed, same sex marriage continue to be illegal in most states. I'm nit stating im in support or against any of these, however I think the side which makes sense the most will win. Back to boas, it makes no sense no matter how you look at it for the usfws to put up the fight that they will have to put up and spend in attorneys what they'll have to, to fight all the lawsuits and motions they'll have to fight. Not in this economy and the budgeting issues all federal departments are having. I just don't see it. I hear you Jonathan, don't fall behind the wheel and continue to support and donate. Which we all should and will. But Given that, I don't see it happening, call me a dreamer or wishful thinker.

in a report by Rodda. No one is going to separate them out because then it'll invalidate the others.

jb
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What's written above is purely my opinion. In fact, MOST of what you read on the internet is someone's opinion. Don't take it too seriously

Jonathan Brady
DeviantConstrictors.com
Deviant Constrictors picturetrail

Which should and likely will be exploited. There's nothing easier to overturn or exploit than overwhelmingly broad language in a proposed bill.

I share your sentiments JB... I think it will eventually happen... in some shape or form..... Mainstream politicians don't care about our little slice of the pie.... they will please more people by passing it than they will hurt... and thats how politicians think.. With all the bad press we get.. they see us all as a bunch of animal hoarding wackos..... We can thank all the careless herpers out there that have made bad decisions in the past....

I truly believe the reptile industry as we know it will one day be a thing of the past..... doesnt mean Im going to stop fighting.. but I'm being realistic....... This isnt the same America I grew up in..... I'm definitely no Proud to be an American,....
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Marc Duhon
Lafayette, Louisiana
SURINAMBOAS.COM
kaiyudsai@SURINAMBOAS.COM

I couldnt disagree with you anymore. We will win this fight and all of the other fights after this if we stick together. You may never stop the fight, but the people who are reading your doom and gloom may decide not to fight. Stay positive and never quit.

>>Honestly the Lacey act will not happen.

I also strongly disagree. Bottom line is that things wouldn't have even gotten this far if the DOI wasn't pushing an agenda. Just look at history:

1) About two years ago the USGS publishes a purely academic "study" with two range maps, both of which a 12 year old snake hobbyist would laugh at. One of the range maps is based on a 100 year prediction into the future, and assumes global warming. Of course, the map doesn't take into account if it gets that warm, much of the area on the map would be under water. And keep in mind, this "study" was published without any attempt at some real-life experiments.

Here's a link to the range map nonsense:

http://www.usgs.gov/newsroom/article.asp?ID=1875

2) Two year AFTER the study was published, questionable experiment was attempted by SREL. (From what I heard, the snakes were provided "hibernacula", trees were cut down so the pythons would not climb them and freeze, etc.)

3) Before the results of the experiment could be completed, Mother Nature, with a 10 day cold snap in south Florida, proved what we already knew - that Burmese pythons cannot survive outside of southern Florida. So at best this is a State of Florida issue.

4) The DOI still decides to push the Lacey Act stuff anyway!

I sure hope I am wrong, but at this point, why would honesty and common sense prevail?

i don't understand this bit, u say a cold snap killed most of the burms, but it wasn't a cold snap it was a once in a generation freak winter that killed them, something that wont happen again for probably a long time, so burms will survive the more normal winters and their numbers will rebound, a cold snap didn't kill them, a catastrophe did, they had no problem in previous winters getting their numbers to that previous high did they? they survived very well, till that freak event which ur wrongly using as a "see told u cant stand a bit of cold" im sure u saw t crutchfields pics, that wasn't a bit of cold, that was hardcore ice conditions, unless that happens again and soon then burms will rebound like they have in the past, u should point usfw errors but not by making up ur own data.

I didn't make up anything. Of course the cold snap (or whatever you want to call it) was a very rare event for south Florida, but that's not the point. The fact is most of the pythons were killed by a relatively short stretch of low temperatures. Most of the states on that map have much longer stretches of temps that low. Are you saying that this is not evidence that the "problem" is limited to south Florida? It's funny how somehow this get's all twisted around and it's up to snake owners to prove a negative - that burmese pythons can't survive in Ohio and Washington DC.
This is, at worst, a state issue, not a Federal one.

i didn't miss the point, i was referring to the florida population, this is where the media look for storys and then expand on them US wide as they see fit, my point, the florida burms havent gone, they will come back and the media will be there waiting.

Maybe those type winter cold conditions don't always occur in South Florida.

They often do occur in central and Northern FL.

Not to mention every other state North of those points !

So indeed there is no problem except in South Florida !!!

None of what said is fictitious.

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz

I Support USark.org

>>Also everyone for the love of God...vote republican!

NEVER!!
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'There is a very fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."' -Rainshadow

April Im disappointed in your NEVER attitude. Their is good and bad on both sides, but in general , the dems will try to destroy our industry, while the repubs will leave us alone.

Also everyone for the love of God...vote republican!

During the last presidential election. A post was made entitled "Its hard to vote republican this time." During the course of that thread I posted the facts concerning Animals rights groups and who they are in bed with politically. I showed the process used to determine which candidates were supported.I also provided all the names of the candidates. Something like 95% of the politicians that were in line with AR beliefs and had their support were DEMOCRATS! This information was not speculation or opinion. It was the facts as presented directly from the HSUS.

Like it or not the reality is the United States is a two party system.... Republican and democrat. Voting third party independent, libertarian,write in, etc., might sound cool but realistically on the big stage its still going to end up ether Republican and democrat.

ERNIE EISON
WESTWOOD ACRES REPTILE FARM INC.

>> Like it or not the reality is the United States is a two party system.... Republican and democrat. Voting third party independent, libertarian,write in, etc., might sound cool but realistically on the big stage its still going to end up ether Republican and democrat.
>>

Ernie,

That seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy. I believe if every person voted his/her conscience instead of worrying about throwing his vote away, things might eventually change for the better. The two party system is broken. And even so, remember Ross Perot got quite a lot of votes. And I think there are a lot of people more angry today. So I don't think it's totally out of the question a 3rd party candidate could win.

I'd sell them in my state where it is legal to sell them still.

You see it will only be illegal to transport them across state lines.

There would be no reason to kill your collection.

In the mean time we (USARK) would win the court case and the whole decision
will be over turned and all will go back to normal !

. . . Lar M
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Boas By Klevitz

I Support USark.org

Now that's a solid plan, Lar. Me too.

I definitely wont get rid of anything.... I started as a hobbyist,,,, and I could end like one... Lots of backwoods swap meets are probably in the future
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Marc Duhon
Lafayette, Louisiana
SURINAMBOAS.COM
kaiyudsai@SURINAMBOAS.COM

What I think is that right now ppl are scared to buy boas and ppl are selling some of their "keepers". What I think may be the best case senerio for the boa hobby is this; the law goes in effect and a lot of te smaller breeders sell their collections. Some animals get put under. Some keep breeding but may put down a lot of the low end stuff. Some will just not breed. And some will be shipped overseas. ( its funny how they are saying these animals are dangerous and we should not keep them but they won't allow us to ship them overseas, makes no sence). Only the best animals will remain and the ppl who love boas. The boa population in the US will take a big hit. Then the law will get overturned about 2 years later. Then the ppl who kept their boas will have the best stock and bloodlines. The boa market will explode at this time. Ppl will want to have boas again and will be upset they sold their collection. If you have great animals keep them. I know I will. If I ever had to sell them, it would be for personal reasons and not this law. I think once the dust settles the animals will only go up in value.

I doesn't matter republican, democrat, or independent. Politicians will say and do whatever it take's to get into office. We all know that. Vote Libertarian!!! That's the real America!!!!!!!!!!
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All about the U!!!!

Oh Yes brother tell it like it is. Vote for anyone who live's and serve's by example. Andrew

i don't understand this bit, u say a cold snap killed most of the burms, but it wasn't a cold snap it was a once in a generation freak winter that killed them, something that wont happen again for probably a long time, so burms will survive the more normal winters and their numbers will rebound, a cold snap didn't kill them, a catastrophe did, they had no problem in previous winters getting their numbers to that previous high did they? they survived very well, till that freak event which ur wrongly using as a "see told u cant stand a bit of cold" im sure u saw t crutchfields pics, that wasn't a bit of cold, that was hardcore ice conditions, unless that happens again and soon then burms will rebound like they have in the past, u should point usfw errors but not by making up ur own data.

Its time for the Libertarians!!! N/P
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Boas By Klevitz

I Support USark.org

Libertarian, I agree!

We can't get rid of our snakes, we owe it to the next generation of hobbyists to keep as many as we can!