Reptile & Amphibian Forums

For those of you who feed stubborn ones lizards how do you prevent parasite transfer from your wc lizard to the snake? In addition to that would scenting with a wc lizard lead to worries about parasite transfer this way? I would not even want to bring a wc lizard into my snake room let alone put it in contact with any of my animals.

I am not entirely convinced about the scenting idea. When I scent a pink how much scent actually gets rubbed off and is it worth the risk of parasitism that is associated with it. As an experiment I scented a pink then put it back with its mother mouse who did not even hesitate to recognize the pink as her own. It obviously did not smell like a lizard to her, why would it to a snake?

first off when scenting a pinkie you should first wash it with a mild soap as to remove most of the mouse scent... did you do this?

second off a mouse is a mammal, very strong maternal instincts, scent is not the ONLY thing that the mother associates with its young... its not a bird.
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Chris - TX

2.2 Splendida
1.1 Nigrita
1.1 Ruthveni
0.0.3 277 Alterna

As far as whether or not scenting works, I have one corn snake hatchling, who so far is only eating anole scented pinkies. If I offer the pinky he won't take it. If I rub the pinky on a F/T anole, he takes it.

Now to get him to realize he doesn't need the anole scent...
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Kent

0.1 Hypomelanistic striped cornsnake
0.0.3 Hypo (het lavender, striped) cornsnake hatchlings
0.0.5 Normal (het hypo, lavender, striped) cornsnake hatchlings
1.2 Gray-banded kingsnakes, blairs phase
1.1 Oregon rubber boas

Forgot to mention, I have heard that freezing kills the parasites. I guess I don't know this for sure, but so far I have not had a problem using F/T WC anoles.
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Kent

0.1 Hypomelanistic striped cornsnake
0.0.3 Hypo (het lavender, striped) cornsnake hatchlings
0.0.5 Normal (het hypo, lavender, striped) cornsnake hatchlings
1.2 Gray-banded kingsnakes, blairs phase
1.1 Oregon rubber boas

I work in the zoo field and it is our protocal to keep WC prey items frozen for 60 days to ensure no parasite transfer. I'm not sure if this really does kill all possible parasites, but I just thought I'd add my 2 cents. I've had similar experience with offering lizard scented pinks as opposed to unscented. I had a snake once that would try to eat the piece of lizard skin off the snout of the pink and spit out the rest. Also not to piss anyone off and completely off subject (related to an earlier comment)but it is a common misconception that birds reject their chicks if they are handled because of smell. Vultures are the only group of birds that have an sort of ability to smell what so ever. As part of my profession I handle lots of baby birds of a great variety of species and never seen an sort of rejection behavior.

boomslang, i am not an expert and would never claim to be, but i have personally watched a martin push 3 babies out of her nest at our boat dock after 1 fell out and my father put the baby back in the nest.... I just assumed it may have had something to do with scent... I guess not though, if they have no sense of smell.
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Chris - TX

2.2 Splendida
1.1 Nigrita
1.1 Ruthveni
0.0.3 277 Alterna

I obviously washed the pinks before scenting. I thought that was standard without saying. It just seems like the adult mouse would have thought something funny was up and rejected its baby if it had the scent of any foreign species. I leads me to doubt the ability of scent to rub off of a lizard.

Anyway I guess I have just never been a fan of scenting cause it is so much worse that mouse tails.

Jamesalternafan, Are you joking? I wonder if you have been reading the thread I started on the corn snake forum about force feeding mouse tails!

My corn hatchling that is eating scented pinkies is in much better condition than my hatchling that I had to force feed a mouse tail.

If you are not joking, then I apologize. No offense intended.

Here is one who has definitely not required scenting or tails. This is his first meal, taken during his first shed.

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Kent

0.1 Hypomelanistic striped cornsnake
0.0.3 Hypo (het lavender, striped) cornsnake hatchlings
0.0.5 Normal (het hypo, lavender, striped) cornsnake hatchlings
1.2 Gray-banded kingsnakes, blairs phase
1.1 Oregon rubber boas

The lizard scent certainly would transfer to the pinky. It's just that it is very likely that alterna(and all snakes) can still smell the pinky. No amount of washing will remove the smell of pinky from a pinky and no amount of scenting will completely mask the smell of the pinky. All that is being attempted is for enough lizard scent to be on the pinky so as to briefly suprise the alterna and thus trigger a strike.

It's a totally individual thing, some alterna will be tricked fairly easy. Perhaps just any smell of lizard in the vicinity would cause some to strike at the first thing that moves. Others will stare at or "stalk" the pink for hours before stiking. Others will never take a scented pink and will only take a real lizard. Some will not even take live lizards. Sometimes a change in caging will cause one that would not even take live lizards before, to take pinks right away. Some will take pinks scented with one kind of lizard but not take pinks scented with another kind of lizard.

As far as parasite transmission, yes it can happen. Probably the safest thing to do is scent with a frozen lizard. Even this may allow for bacterial transmission as bacteria is not the same thing as parasites and bacteria are not killed by freezing. Freezing only stops bacteria from multiplying. As soon as bacteria thaw out they begin to multiply again.

But with all that it is very rare for an alterna to get sick just from eating a pinky that was scented with a frozen lizard. In fact I don't know of any for sure cases where this is known to have happened, although I would not be suprised if it did occassionally and people just don't know it.

Personally I just get tired pretty quickly of trying to trick them and usually just pinky pump them with Fancy Feast catfood until they take a live, unscented pinky on their own. I use Fancy Feast specifically because it is finely ground and I have found sharp bone chips in other brands. I use either Beef and Liver Feast or Chicken and Liver Feast. Make sure it says "Feast" because that is the ground one, you don't want chunky style.
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www.hcu-tx.org/

In answer to your question I freeze all the anoles I catch. I have about 20 in the freezer.

>>For those of you who feed stubborn ones lizards how do you prevent parasite transfer from your wc lizard to the snake?

John Rossi (DVM) recommends freezing pre-euthanized lizards for at least 4 days prior to thawing them for food.