Reptile & Amphibian Forums

First pic is beside a standard 30 gallon tank screen(36", about 3-4" in curves, another 6plus" in my hand. Not a record, but havent ever seen a pic of one bigger.

np

np

JEFF! Its in focus.

Sorry. I had to.

Seriously tho, can the boys stop fighting over the size of their snakes now? Is everyone happy?
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Cindy Steinle
PHFaust
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1--FOCUS?? Yes, getting old sucks but so does having cheap cameras.
2--Lets be perfectly clear here Miss Moderator, the rucous can no longer be entirely blamed on us males!
3--Lets see if my fan club comes to eat crow! LMAO!!

"can the boys stop fighting over the size of their snakes now?"

Yeah, Cindy, I think I have seen enough of this to last about five lifetimes!

Jeff should have left out #2 and 3# answers I am thinking too

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Doug, I added those pics for those who would think that it may be the same snake posed 10x... There have been several this size, sorry I wasnt so much into pics in the past. No one has had enough of the crap more than me. But at least we know who the weasels are right?

A picture you can actually get a good sense of how big she is. I'd give it 42"(guesstimated 39" from your previous pics)... she doesn't have enough bends in her to hit floor, you can have the 6" above the screen. In any case she is big, no denying that. And yes bigger than any I've seen posted here to this date. I think all of us already agreed on that though Jeff, we just weren't buying the original claims of 48", could see that wasn't true easily enough even using your photos to judge by.

Now on the chance you take exception to any of those above remarks I assure you nothing offensive was intended. Yup it's a big Ltt Jeff.

Having said all that I hope you also restrain from gloating/crowing over it, as I said before nobody ever denied it wasn't a good size snake, evrybody agrred it did look big all your photo proves is that we we're right in not believing the 48". Being anything but gracious to any comments will just make you look like... well... Jeff Schofield.

Nice photo... finally. I'll even through in... Yes it seems to be a record here in the forum...

Gerry

Well the screen itself is 36", there is at least 6" in my hand, and a few inches bent so I would estimate it at 44-45" which in my book is pretty damn close the the 4' ESTIMATE I noted previous. I have seen ALOT of other estimates off alot more than 4" when measuring snakes. Now this is not the biggest I have found and its a female(which are naturally smaller). While I cant go back in time with a better camera etc and take pics but I can say that I am accurate at guestimating lengths. That big cb female I had was definately bigger than this one.

seen them ,,,had them in hand pair at a time , same timber,,same time,,, York Co........

no camera , no gloating...just the knowing they grow just as big in Lower PA and even Elizabethtown PA.....

.....nice snake.....LOL.....good luck and have fun....

......my brother has been told more than twice that when he pulls a 4 footer from his yard .....keep it!!!!!....we need 4 billion pics of it for the internet....>LOL.....and yes...he had a 3 and maybe a 4 footer last spring...he just moved in ......

......yesterday he stuck an 8 pointer ...3 1/2 yr old....
you need pics...?....LOL......of the teeth?
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........JY

Now was it EXACTLY 3.5 years old or was it maybe 3.37709902 years old?? Tastes the same right??

let's see.....

born around May so...it would be 3 years and 5 1/2 months old maybe.......

he eats it.....

...and the guy that aged it wasn't sure....corn fed deer do not wear down the teeth like non-farmland -corn fed deer....

the guy raises deer also.....so....

.....I really- really- really hope my brother finds a milk over 48 inches in his yard this year......and it's female...LOL....
with 30 eggs in it....(yea I know).....(I'd let them all go)....

//..
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........JY

Definitely a big milk there Jeff. Much better than estimations, assumptions, and exagerations.

I think this is the biggest looking photo of a milk I have seen (from photo gallery). I don't know how big it actually was, maybe you do?

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Joe

That is Leo's kid holding a milk from the Hyannis area. A big one for sure, but its a decieving pic because its being held by a 3'er LOL. It might well be as big as some of the ones I've seen/bred/caught but to say its the biggest one on the forum is very difficult considering you not only cant see the whole snake but the scale is VERY deceptive.

Yeah, that is a big one of about 45" or so. I already knew how long the cage lid is because the square hole in the middle of the strike-plate on the door jamb is typically placed exactly 36" above the bottom of the door.

I could not begin to count how many of those I have personally installed over the years..LOL!

Very cool!, it only took several years and 500 feet of bickering threads to finally establish it's estimated size!..HAHAA!

Anyway, there is no disputing from my end that is is extremely big!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Doug, I posted a pic EXACTLY like this years ago on the forum. Its the turnover of the forum members as much as anything why some think my claims are exaggerated. People, PICS arent the only way to measure a snake. Personal experience and reputation is getting lost both here in the forums and as the hobby has become an idustry. We used to get together and go hunting, we used to travel together to go to far away shows. We used to trust others to come and see our collections and we did this because we DIDNT have pics on the forum!!This was because more people were into NA milks and colubrids in general. We should learn that our "enemies" arent here on the forum but in the commercialization, the ball-pythoning, and the deli cup herpers that dont know the difference. I cant help the fact that all the old timers that have actually SEEN my snakes no longer are in the hobby or the forum, but I ask each of you that read my posts to look in the mirror and ask yourself the same question. I think most of us will aknowledge the lack of respect for people who actually know what they are talking about in lieu of pretty pictures. Not entirely, but you cant deny it.

Oh, I certainly know what you are saying. I don't like many aspects of this hobby to be honest, and the internet is great, while it is also terrible too. Heck, when you can click on thousands of snake pics now and see all the "cool" colors and patterns, and these newbies also learn that they too can try their hand at breeding snakes too without so much as even knowing what the hell a cornsnake even eats first, there is a definite problem with that. These people don't even have a clue about what it rntails taking care of the babies for a long while, or what they will end up "actually" doing with them, but yet they want to "MAKE" SOME!....pure irresponsibility is what it is. And these same people wouldn't know a genuine subspecies of most anything if it hit them in the head either.

And again, the internet can be very helpful and handy in general, but I find that it also has created absolute pure laziness as well regarding many people's learning in-depth about them.

Nobody reads enough books about what they keep, or are interested in these days in my opinion. They think they can simply jump online to ask someone on a forum everytime there is a problem with their snakes, when they should have gotten several books beforehand and read them thoroughly to PREVENT any problems BEFORE they arise!!.

Anyway, as an over 43 year "veteran" in this hobby, I too have seen an aweful lot of change,.....both good and very BAD!

~Doug

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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

"And again, the internet can be very helpful and handy in general, but I find that it also has created absolute pure laziness as well regarding many people's learning in-depth about them. " AMEN BROTHER!"

Doug, how many times do I come up on a newby thread and cite BOOKS right?? I come off as a arrogant SOB but the truth is there are posters on this forum every day that have never read Applegates manual, Markels picture book, or even a Peterson's field guide(I have had to replace mine about 5x due to USE!)never mind something as intricate and educational as the Williams book. I think the internet brings people together alot easier, making more types of snakes available to everyone. But it has also "leveled the playing field", there is a definate lack of respect for reputation and experience. There are fewer people taking chances with difficult breeds. There are fewer people DOING the work and more people criticizing it. And that is what has scared alot of really decent milkheads either offline or out of the hobby all together. OK, off my soap box, grrrr, LMAO.

Yeah Jeff,......I just CANNOT stress good books to people enough either.

I have all those you mentioned too among tons of others as well.

You can get bits and pieces from the internet, but there is so damn much info it isn't the best practical place to begin. Reading lots of good snake books constantly from cover to cover, over and over again is where I got my solid foundation of snake knowledge too starting from the late 60's. THEN all the other sources pretty much fall into place and continue to hone things after that quite well in.

I'm sure you will agree Jeff,...the internet in CONJUCTION with many good books is the REAL way to go, it seems to really be about just how much someone REALLY wants to learn about them!

Man, for me, it has been all-out, and have strived to learn as much as humanly possible. I honestly do not know what my life would be like without snakes!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com

Doug, no one person is 100% correct, not me, you or any author. Here we can meet and discuss what works from one book to the next. We both know that we have read these books and that even with all that info field knowledge is also needed to truely understand the animal. All this info should be the ante to the conversation. To me it is ridiculous to have a conversation about anything related to IDing or field biology with anyone who has not worn out at least 1 copy of a Peterson's field guide. Sure, a ton of books out there but there is now more BAD info then ever. That is mostly because of the internet. Cheers

No doubt about less than inaccurate information being out there in print too. But after some good experience and good common sense, even alot of that can even be discerned with a good foundation of knowledge.

I do not have one single snake book that I haven't found many mistakes and inaccuracies in. Some of it can be quite laughable and ridiculous I'm sure you'll agree too.

Heck, just for one example....Scott Ballard has a perfect text-book stuarti specimen in Markel's that is captioned as a "micropholis", and the illustration above it looks NOTHING like a "micro" either..LOL!

Scott told me there was a big botch-up with the publication somehow, and another book I have shows the exact same snake photo and text misrepresented ...AGAIN!..LOL!

As you know, many authors don't necessarily know anything about all the snakes that are published in their books themselves from personal experience, but rather it is simply regurgitated info from another source word for word, photo's and all!

As a matter of fact, Williams' ~Systematics~ has some MAJOR screw-ups regarding the photo's that are used too. The text itself is very accurate, but some of the photo's that represent the text couldn't be more inaccurate. There is a perfect stuartiphenotype specimen(or at the very least a DEFINITE intergrade) portrayed as an oligozona that is not a good representation AT ALL!, as well as a few other photos that are questionable at best too to represent their subspecies.

But still, most of the photos are well represented, and all the reading is quite good, so until someone else does another one in our lifetime, it's all we have!

~Doug
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"a snake in the grass is a GOOD thing"

my website -serpentinespecialties.webs.com