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Clevelend: >20 pythons removed from home

EricWI Jan 23, 2011 10:58 AM

CLEVELAND - The Cleveland Animal Protective league rescued more than 20 constrictor snakes from a home in Cleveland Saturday.

Sharon Harvey with the APL tells NewsChannel 5 there is an active investigation surrounding the ownership of these snakes.

Most of the 20 plus snakes rescued were pythons, some upwards of 15-feet-long, according to Harvey.

Under the current exotic animal ordinance, the owner of pythons and other constrictor snakes must obtain a permit.

“This is a perfect example of why we need Governor Kasich and state legislators to sign into permanent law, the dangerous animal law that Governor Strickland put into place before he left,” Harvey said.

Strickland’s dangerous animal law is only a 90 day ordinance at this time.

Harvey stressed proper care needed for these snakes could not be met in a home and could become a danger to the animals as well as the community.

The APL is working with experts who have taken the snakes and will determine the next steps to keep them safe.

The APL received a tip call about these dangerous animals and worked with the city of Cleveland to recover them from the Cleveland home.

It is unclear how the owner obtained these snakes in the first place.

While this case is unusual to the APL, they say they are working with experts to make sure these snakes get to proper care to keep them safe, as well as others.
www.newsnet5.com/dpp/news/local_news/cleveland-apl-rescued-over-20-snakes-from-cleveland-home

Also see this story:
www.latimes.com/wjw-pythons-removed-from-cleveland-home-txt,0,2345950.story

Replies (12)

jscrick Jan 23, 2011 12:18 PM

How timely...How convenient...
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

OHI Jan 23, 2011 12:35 PM

This is a prime example of why people need to be legal and above board. I have mentioned over and over again that people who hide in the shadows and don't comply with regulations are a "black eye" for the industry.

Welkerii

natsamjosh Jan 24, 2011 10:12 AM

>>This is a prime example of why people need to be legal and above board. I have mentioned over and over again that people who hide in the shadows and don't comply with regulations are a "black eye" for the industry.
>>
>>Welkerii

I understand your point, and up until the last year or two I would have unconditionally agreed with you. I've always been a "follow the law" kind of guy, but at some point there are so many damn laws and so many of them that don't make sense, it's not so black and white. For example, the town I live in just changed its definition of regulated/"exotic" snakes from "exceeding 4 feet or 20 lbs" to "large constricting snakes." Obviously that is a dumb law, since "large" is not defined, and is a relative term. Some might consider 3 feet to be "large." So already that puts snake owners in a precarious situation. Do they decide for themselves what "large" means, or do they publicly try to change the law, which comes with its own risks? And aside from that, the city ordinance requires that if any "exotic" snake bites me or escapes its cage, I need to report that to authorities. Actually, it's even worse. Depending upon the definition of "roam", it might actually be illegal for an "exotic" snake owner to simply let his/her "exotic" snake crawl around a room while the snake's tank is cleaned.

Again, I understand your point, but I don't think it's such a black and white issue. I certainly am not going to blame a boa owner who gets bitten for not calling the authorities to report the bite, nor am I going to blame a python owner who lets his Burm crawl around the snake room while the cage is being cleaned.

The following has become one of my favorite quotes:

“The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.” - Ayn Rand

Thanks,
Ed

jscrick Jan 24, 2011 12:07 PM

Like I said before, it's all a control issue by the Nanny State.

Criminalizing behaviors not before considered criminal for control of the individual.

Narrowing the Sheeple through the chute of conformity, continuously peddling a message of fear and ignorance to the masses...

jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

biophile Jan 24, 2011 01:27 PM

The story made it out to Cali last night on the local news. A city permit violation in Ohio broadcasted out here? What a " Brave New World" we are becoming. No wonder this country cannot fix real problems anymore. What a nation of victims.

emysbreeder Jan 25, 2011 02:01 PM

Ive tryed to get Jeff Gee to reprint his bumper stickers from the 80's again. "When reptiles are outlawed only outlaws will have reptiles" The only people with the "black eye" are the ones that tryed to be legal and were regulated out of their FREEDON lifes work, investments and dreams. Flee or fight,in your choise in POST AMERICA. Our new rulers are an insult to the GREAT GENERATION who had none of this oppressive,so called Liberal (what a joke) rulership in mind as they "took the heat" to save country's like ours has become. Vic Morgan ..Son of an Anizo survivor WWII.

OHI Jan 25, 2011 01:33 PM

While I hear you on BS and confusing laws it is still a black eye. I can understand someone purposely breaking unclear laws to get them before a judge but this is not the case for this one from what I understand. If a permit is required for big snakes and you have the biggest snakes there are it is wise to get a permit. Another example is the venomous reptile law in Florida. If you are required to get a permit to keep venomous then you need to get the permit if you want to keep venomous. If not, don't keep venomous.

We need to follow the good regulations that are out there. And fight the bad ones. We have so much work to do at the state and local level it is ridiculous. And we are not even working on these things. We need people working full time on these issues. We need a legal fund, lobbying wing and a PR department. We are so far behind the eight ball at this point it is overwhelming.

Another reason to get legal is to be counted. If there are thousands of people known to the state working with these animals then it is better for us. They will be less likely to enact BS laws if we are counted and organized. This is also why it's important to establish yourself as a business. Businesses have a lot more rights then hobbyists. We need to be smart, organize and start fighting back.

Welkerii

Calparsoni Jan 25, 2011 03:13 PM

Judging from the posts of his I've read ayn rand is a little bit above him. He'll never get it.

OHI Jan 25, 2011 07:17 PM

When is your perfect world coming back? Did it really ever exist? Or was it just a childhood fantasy? When people abuse their freedom they must be regulated. Again, look at the banking industry. The more people you have, the less freedom you have. FYI: I don't have children. What about you? Natural resources are finite and thus must be regulated for all. Typical human, I want my cake and eat it too, dam anyone or anything else. We are either going to play by the current accepted rules or we will be banned out of existience. I guess you chose to live in the past. Good luck with that. I guess fairness, logic, science and laws have no place in this discussion. You want to do whatever you want and they want to do whatever they want. There is a huge gray area. Where is the common ground? You want NO regulation and they want banning agenda. Neither of these are acceptable. We have to try and meet in the middle. Instead of dishing out insults let's hear your workable ideas?

Welkerii

emysbreeder Jan 27, 2011 11:31 AM

Not until the herpetological Atlas's Shrugs. VM

Aaron Feb 03, 2011 02:24 AM

This one below is from the Los Angeles Times. In the article posted by the OP above, Sharon Harvey of the Cleveland Animal Protection League(APL) claims that the APL "rescued" these snakes and also stressed that "proper care needed for these snakes could not be met in a home."
However Chris Carmichael, the Associate Professor of Biology at the Malone University said regarding the snakes, "They're actually in really good shape." This doesn't sound like the snakes needed rescueing, as described by Sharon Harvey of the APL. Charmichal also says "...the APL doesn't have the space, equipment necessary to handle this many..." It's sounding even less like a "rescue" now, when the APL doesn't even have the ability to take care of these snakes. This is really horrible.
Apparently this action was instigated by a neighbor of the snakes owner. The neighbor, Carol Flannick claims her and her husband have been living in fear to the point that they can't sleep at night and "...one of us, me or my husband, is always up watching or looking." To be blunt this just sounds like a gross exaggeration. I find it very hard to believe that they are so afraid that they actually sleep in shifts with one of them always on duty looking out the window in fear lest one of the snakes escape. Ironically the article states that "luckily for the Malone University wildlife biology and zoology students who carried them out of the home in containers, these pythons are used to humans and relatively tame." Apparently the Flannick's fears were unfounded.
The article concludes with this statement from Flannick, "We're thrilled. We're hoping that now some of these neighbors with for sale signs will maybe reconsider and stay in the neighborhood. I have to take issue here with the newspaper article's author. Here is a statement that is total heresay by Flannick implying that several homeoners in the neighborhood felt so terrorized by these snakes that they were going to actually sell their homes and move away. If true, that would certainly be a newsworthy part of this article so why didn't the journalist include any statements from these neighbors who were supposedly fleeing the pythons? It should have been very easy to contact at least some of them. If any of them really were afraid of these pythons to the point that they were trying to sell their homes, you would think they would be eager to talk to a reporter. Especially in this real estate climate because the market is way down. I would think anybody who felt forced to sell their home in this market, probably taking a huge loss or at the very least selling for alot less than they had expected, would have plenty to say.
This is my favorite part of the article: "Pythons are constrictor snakes, meaning they squeeze their prey to death. They also have lots of sharp teeth." This quote would be laughable if the circumstances of this incident weren't so unfair for the pythons owner. "They also have lots of sharp teeth." Wow! I don't really have the words to express what a lame statement that is. To me it's indicitive of the caliber of research that went into this article. Meaning, basicly no research at all.
The real story is that the python's owner was apparently a law abiding citizen up until a few weeks ago, when the Governor of Ohio decided to act like a dictator and put in place a 90 day ordinance that made this owner and possibly hunders of others, criminals virtually overnight. The real story is that these pythons were in good health and apparently well taken care of, yet organizations like the Cleveland APL are allowed to present their agenda as fact when it is really nothing more than opinion and personal morality; I'm alluding here to APL's statement that pythons cannot be cared for in the home. The real story is that while it may be true that the neighbor's had a fear of snakes and that they do have some right to feel safe in their own homes, the other side of it is that the python owner also has feelings. Since the expert from the university admitted the pythons were in excellent health, it should be indicitive that their owner almost certainly loved and cared for his or hers pets and that this is probably going to have a profound effect on their being and state of mind. Not to mention the economic impact, which has ramifications for all citizens when one's valuable property can be confiscated due to a temporary law that was enacted virtually overnight. I want to know what the government is required to do in these cases, to inform people whose property comes into jeopardy under such actions. Is this not newsworthy, the government confiscating personal property? Or is it because it's a wierdo snake owner that makes it ok? No need to question things when it only affects wierdos, I guess.
Ok, done preaching to the choir.

http://www.latimes.com/wjw-pythons-removed-from-cleveland-home-txt,0,2345950.story

CLEVELAND — Python after python was carried out of a brick home on Westdale Avenue Saturday afternoon.

About 20 carnivorous snakes, as big as 15-feet long, were found in plastic crates. The Animal Protective League says the exotic snakes are illegal to have in Cleveland.

Neighbor Carol Flannick said she has been living in fear, knowing the snakes were right next door. "We can't sleep at night, one of us, me or my husband, is always up watching or looking," Flannick said.

Flannick said she's been telling authorities about the reptile den for years, but no one has done anything, until now. "We noticed there was an alligator a couple of years ago.

They bring them out in the yard with the snakes. That's when we really started noticing what was going on over there with the illegal animals and everything," Flannick said.

Sharon Harvey, executive director of the Cleveland APL, said it is illegal to keep dangerous exotic animals in the city limits without a permit, and no one at this home had one.

Harvey also said criminal charges could be filed, but could not give any details citing the on-going investigation.

Pythons are constrictor snakes, meaning they squeeze their prey to death. They also have lots of sharp teeth.

Luckily, for the Malone University wildlife biology and zoology students who carried them out of the home in containers, these pythons are used to humans and relatively tame.

"They're actually in really good shape," Associate Professor of Biology Chris Carmichael from Malone University said, adding the snakes will have a good home.

"It's enough snakes that a lot of zoos just don't have the space or APL doesn't have the space, equipment necessary to handle this many, but we have several large serpentariums so we use them for education," Carmichael said.

"We're thrilled. We're hoping that now some of these neighbors with for sale signs will maybe reconsider and stay in the neighborhood," Flannick said.
http://www.latimes.com/wjw-pythons-removed-from-cleveland-home-txt,0,2345950.story

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www.hcu-tx.org/

jscrick Feb 03, 2011 01:46 PM

Only in America is ignorance catered to and in fact preferred.
jsc
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"As hard as I've tried, just can't NOT do this"
John Crickmer

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